True.
Posted on 08/15/2013 10:59:07 AM PDT by Alex Murphy
PROVIDENCE — Addressing a wide range of issues posed to him Tuesday night at a meeting of the state’s Young Republicans, Roman Catholic Bishop Thomas J. Tobin said he was not only deeply disappointed by the passage of same-sex marriage in Rhode Island, but that he felt a sense of personal failure on his part as well as a failure of the Catholic Church in Rhode Island to keep it from becoming law.
“I was profoundly disappointed that the state moved in that direction and that so many Catholic politicians abandoned ship on this issue,” the bishop said, speaking to about 40 people at the Holy Rosary Band Hall on Gano Street in Fox Point. “This was a critical issue, and they let us down.”
Though a good deal of the questions at the two-hour session dealt with the church’s teaching on respect for life, questions toward the end shifted to what one participant referred to as the “pink elephant” in the room and whether there might be a way for members to uphold traditional marriage while not denying “some of our friends” who are gay — by having a system that recognizes civil marriage for gays while at the same time reserving sacramental marriage that allows only marriages between one man and one woman.
“Well, that’s what we have now. We feel we do not have the right to redefine marriage from what God has designed. We believe that any homosexual activity is immoral, and for the state to establish same-sex marriage would be a state approbation of that.”
Bishop Tobin added that the church continues to have a great deal of respect for all people, and “loves and supports” those with same-sex attraction, and that “they should not be subject to any sort hate or discrimination.”
He said he believes that same-sex marriage passed in Rhode Island as a result of a tidal wave of support for gay marriage that came as a result of President Obama’s “evolving support” for it and heavy lobbying by the entertainment and news media, the support given to it by Rhode Island House Speaker Gordon Fox, the Rhode Island State Council of Churches, the Board of Rabbis and by others.
For gays working for passage of the law, “this was their issue” and they obviously were strongly invested in it, he said, while for the church, the issue was important but just one of many issues.
In an interview afterward, Bishop Tobin, who has not commented publicly on the gay-marriage issue since its passage in May, said he did not believe that he and other gay-marriage opponents were undercut by Pope Francis’ remarks during a news conference on a return flight from Brazil that “if a person with a same attraction is of good will and seeks to follow the Lord, who am I to judge?”
Bishop Tobin said the pope had simply restated the church’s teaching with different words, and never said that homosexual activity is not a sin.
On the question of whether priests should deny Communion to couples they know are living together — be they as gay couples or cohabitating heterosexual couples — Bishop Tobin said that question would be best left to the individual parish priests who know the individuals and who have counseled the couples about the church’s teaching.
During his address Tuesday, Bishop Tobin said he felt he was out of his element speaking to a political group, but noted at the onset that he had had changed his political affiliation from Democrat to Republican, largely based on his dismay at the Democratic Party’s support for abortion rights.
At the same time, he urged those considering political careers to hold on to their moral convictions and not to base their votes solely on the latest polls.
The bishop had been invited to the gathering by Daniel Harrop, a Republican who recently threw his hat in the ring for another try at becoming the mayor of Providence. Harrop said he invited the bishop after hearing him speak at a seminar on religious freedom held at Portsmouth Abbey.
On other topics, the bishop said that during a recent visit to a beach in Florida, he saw notice closing a portion of the beach to the public to protect the endangered sea turtle. He said the church believes too in the need for protecting God’s creation but it seemed strange that the federal government is so willing “to protect the unborn sea turtle but not protect unborn children.”
He strongly defended the right of the church and all religious believers to speak out on matters of political discourse, saying the separation of church and state is meant to protect the church from interference from the state, not the other way around.
He said it was deplorable that the new healthcare exchanges that have been set up as part of the implementation of the Affordable Health Care Law in Rhode Island do not include even one option allowing participants to choose a plan that does not provide coverage for abortion. “That to me is a dictatorship, and you have to wonder who’s imposing what on whom.”
Asked why the church doesn’t clamp down on Catholic politicians who help to enact laws that extend or expand abortion rights, the bishop said it’s hard to say to someone “you’re not a Catholic anymore” except under certain conditions, and that frustrating as it may be to some in the pro-life movement, “I don’t have the canonical right to do that.”
On the question of whether priests should deny Communion to couples they know are living together — be they as gay couples or cohabitating heterosexual couples — Bishop Tobin said that question would be best left to the individual parish priests who know the individuals and who have counseled the couples about the church’s teaching. During his address Tuesday, Bishop Tobin said he felt he was out of his element speaking to a political group, but noted at the onset that he had had changed his political affiliation from Democrat to Republican, largely based on his dismay at the Democratic Party’s support for abortion rights. At the same time, he urged those considering political careers to hold on to their moral convictions and not to base their votes solely on the latest polls....
....Asked why the church doesn’t clamp down on Catholic politicians who help to enact laws that extend or expand abortion rights, the bishop said it’s hard to say to someone “you’re not a Catholic anymore” except under certain conditions, and that frustrating as it may be to some in the pro-life movement, “I don’t have the canonical right to do that.”
They just WILL NOT take to the pulpits and decree “You’re committing a SIN if you vote for that, or for any politician who is in favor of it!”
...According to the USCCB, the five most Catholic states, in population, are: Rhode Island, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York and Connecticut. According to the American Life League, the states with the most pro-life legislation (i.e., inhibiting abortion in various ways) are: Oklahoma, Louisiana, Pennsylvania, Arkansas and Texas. This is a shocker. In short, there is no Catholic political impact in support of life in those states reportedly having the most Catholics.
-- from the thread The Mythical Catholic Vote: The Harmful Consequences of Political Assimilation
“Bishop Tobin said that question would be best left to the individual parish priests who know the individuals and who have counseled the couples about the church’s teaching.”
No, it’s not Bishop Tobin. It’s your JOB!
there are 75 House members in RI. 65 DEM.
In most seats, the DEM primary determines the ultimate winner.
the average DEM primary has 1000 votes, so 500 votes gets u a house seat.
“On April 23, all 5 Republican state On April 23, all 5 Republican state senators announced their support for the legislation—the first time a party’s caucus in a state legislature has supported same-sex marriage unanimously—and the Senate Judiciary Committee approved the legislation in a 7-4 vote while defeating a proposal to present the issue to voters as a referendum.[29] On April 24, the Rhode Island Senate passed an amended version of the bill by a 26-12 vote.”
Back in 2004 and 2005 I organized two separate marriage-as-God-defines-it rallies at the Rhode Isand state house. We had a lot of support from the evangelical community...about 400 people in attendance each time...but the Catholic churches didn’t lend their support at all. They didn’t want anything to do with it.
How many bishops, priests, and nuns vote democrat? I bet it is way more than 90%. I saw a Catholic voter guide last November. The only recommendation that stood out was to vote for candidates who favor minimum wage laws. All of the candidates who favor minimum wage laws also vote for unlimited abortions. Oh, and by the way, I have not heard much lately from their excellencies about fighting 0bamacare’s abortion provisions for Catholic institutions.
Last Fall my “individual parish Priests” were apparently afraid to cheese-off the large number of dues-paying Union Democrats who attend this church. Their response to Obama’s outrageous mandate was a brief announcement after Mass that “you can go to our parish website and access a link to a video with information about the election”.
I believe you; however, you would find that traditional Catholics parishes -- Latin Mass and old-fashioned morals -- are 100% supportive of what you are doing.
That’s because the Republicans have been infiltrated with moles. The party is completely whipped in this state. They can’t even get candidates to run in some districts because the Demo’s will just personally and professionally destroy them. The democratic party has taken over all the functions of the old organized crime networks.
Bump that!
i beleive that Sen. O’Neil from Lincoln, idependent, voted ‘no’. What is the deal with him? Howd he beat the majority leader?
“He said he believes that same-sex marriage passed in Rhode Island as a result of a tidal wave of support for gay marriage that came as a result of President Obama’s “evolving support” for it and heavy lobbying by the entertainment and news media”.
100% correct. When you have an anti-Christian homosexual president agreeing with sodomite “marriage” it all flows down hill from there. Every left-wing flake in the country jumps on the bandwagon. And RINOs like Dick Cheney that have came out in support of pretend marriage.
The Northeast is flooded with Cafeteria Catholics who go to Mass maybe twice year. They are left-wing voters and no amount preaching will make them change their mind. Catholics who regularly attend Mass vote for the most conservative candidate. In this respect Catholics are no different than any other denomination. In otherwords there is no such thing as the Catholic vote.
Except that there is, it has gone democrat in every presidential election in our history, with 5 exceptions, and will probably always go democrat in the future. That is a predictable 'Catholic vote'.
The Bishop has no canonical powers to discipline people for public, unrepentant, serious sin, but the parish priest does?
He needs a serious sit-down with Card. Raymond Burke.
Like I said there is no such thing as the “Catholic vote”,
irregardless to what you think.
Even with the number of “catholics” voting for democrats, the number that vote for conservatives dwarf Southern Baptists are any other of the alphabet soup protestant denominations.
Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton twice, and Obamagabe twice, all so called protestant democrats, won because protestant voters voted for them. Protestants put them in the White House. There are more protestants than there are Catholics in the United States. If you capture the protestant vote you don’t win.
Thank you!
Hmmm, that almost sounds like anger.
I was merely pointing out the predictability of the “Catholic vote”. Not as predictable as the Protestant vote which has only gone democrat 3 times 1932, 1936, and 1964, but still predictable.
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