Posted on 07/19/2013 5:39:12 AM PDT by fatima
http://www.spiritdaily.com/lorig.htm
For Father Lorig, going strong at 77 and full of the Spirit, it's a matter of seeing some of it with his own eyes.
On about a dozen occasions, says the priest, he has personally encountered spirits of the dead, including at bedside during the night, and has been led to pray their souls toward Jesus.
Father Lorig, who was ordained a Catholic priest in 1984, and who is married with four children (and fifteen grandchildren), had some special experiences while at Saint Andrew's Episcopal Church in Nogales (near the Mexican border).
"It was built over an Indian graveyard -- paleo-Indians who were peaceful," says Father Lorig, pastor of Saint Maria Goretti parish (he is not associated with previous claims at this church of the supernatural).
"While we were digging a sacrarium -- a dry well [for proper disposal of Communion wine] -- the workmen came upon hand-made pots. We called the University of Arizona, which had paleontologists, and they came down.
How is it “bashing” to say that I would expect Catholics to be upset with those defiling their sacraments? That’s expressing disappointment, not “bashing”. As far as I can tell, both protestant and catholic theology denounces what this man is doing, so we should all be on the same page with this issue.
we can do that?
What do I consider communication with the deceased? Well, “communication with the deceased” is a pretty concise term, I don’t think it really requires further explanation, does it?
The only thing unclear about it is if you are trying to get some “wiggle room” to communicate with those saved Christians who may be said to not be truly dead, even if they have passed away physically. However, this thread isn’t about that topic (the Catholic notion of the communion of the saints which they use to justify prayers to their deceased). This man is not communicating with anyone canonized by the Catholic church, or even with anyone ostensibly Christian. So, let’s stay on topic and not worry about that little wrinkle, shall we?
It can be done if you do not want to argue.
Thanks for the kind words. I don’t even want to get going on topics like purgatory or prayers for the dead, etc, since none of those have much to do with what this gentleman is doing. What he is doing doesn’t even fit the justfications that Catholics appeal to for those other practices, and is clearly condemned by their own church. We should all be on the same page here, but some seem to want to believe in new age spiritist nonsense rather than pretty much universal Christian doctrines.
Christ did not found the Catholic Church. Sadly many will find out the hard way. I will continue to pray that is not the case.
Well Jesus did say, “you are Peter and on this rock I will build my church.”
Suffering can't pay for sins.
What suffering here in this life can do....
Romans 5:1-5 Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God. 3 Not only that, but we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, 4 and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, 5 and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us.
2 Corinthians 1:3-7 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, 4 who comforts us in all our affliction, so that we may be able to comfort those who are in any affliction, with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God. 5 For as we share abundantly in Christ's sufferings, so through Christ we share abundantly in comfort too. 6 If we are afflicted, it is for your comfort and salvation; and if we are comforted, it is for your comfort, which you experience when you patiently endure the same sufferings that we suffer. 7 Our hope for you is unshaken, for we know that as you share in our sufferings, you will also share in our comfort.
Hebrews 2:18 For because he himself has suffered when tempted, he is able to help those who are being tempted.
Hebrews 5:8 Although he [Jesus] was a son, he learned obedience through what he suffered.
You know, I have NO problem criticizing if someone (especially a Church leader) does something against the Faith. Could you show me exactly where the Church condemns what this priest is doing?
I’ll admit, after reading the OP, something seems a bit off, but I can’t put my finger on it.
Christianity = DONE
Huge difference.
Amen!
You or anyone else on this planet CANNOT know that.
Not one human being can discern whether the apparition they are seeing or encountering is really a person or demonic.
THAT it what makes that kind of contacting the dead activity so dangerous.
Here's a clue.
Demons lie. Satan lies.
It's in their best interests to lie to humans and tell them that what they are seeing is Grandma, or Grandpa, or great-aunt Matilda.
If they can deceive someone into believing that, they have free reign with them.
Do you think an apparition would not lie?
let me know if you get a response.
Not holding my breath placemarker
Religion = DO
Christianity = DONE
Huge difference.
Jesus Christ:
Luke 6:46 And why call you me, Lord, Lord; and do not the things which I say?
Believing and doing are one and the same
Sure. Let me point you to this relevant section of the Catholic Encycopedia (http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14221a.htm), in the article “Spiritism”, under the section “Action of the Church”:
The Congregation of the Inquisition, 25 June, 1840, decreed:
Where all error, sorcery, and invocation of the demon, implicit or explicit, is excluded, the mere use of physical means which are otherwise lawful, is not morally forbidden, provided it does not aim at unlawful or evil results. But the application of purely physical principles and means to things or effects that are really supernatural, in order to explain these on physical grounds, is nothing else than unlawful and heretical deception.
This decision was reiterated on 28 July, 1847, and a further decree was issued on 30 July, 1856, which, after mentioning discourses about religion, evocation of departed spirits and “other superstitious practices” of Spiritism, exhorts the bishops to put forth every effort for the suppression of these abuses “in order that the flock of the Lord may be protected against the enemy, the deposit of faith safeguarded, and the faithful preserved from moral corruption”. The Second Plenary Council of Baltimore (1866), while making due allowance for fraudulent practice in Spiritism, declares that some at least of the manifestations are to be ascribed to Satanic intervention, and warns the faithful against lending any support to Spiritism or even, out of curiosity, attending séances (Decreta, nn. 33-41). The council points out, in particular, the anti-Christian character of Spiritistic teachings concerning religion, and characterizes them as an attempt to revive paganism and magic. A decree of the Holy Office, 30 March, 1898, condemns Spiritistic practices, even though intercourse with the demon be excluded and communication sought with good spirits only. In all these documents the distinction is clearly drawn between legitimate scientific investigation and superstitious abuses. What the Church condemns in Spiritism is superstition with its evil consequences for religion and morality.
Indeed, they can and do deceive humans, even Christians, with their apparitions.
2 Cor 11:14 -
“And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.”
Matt 24:24 -
“For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.”
As opposed to so much empty religious ritual...do
"Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent." (John 6:28-29)
You know, the more I think about this , the more I’m questioning it. When a home is “haunted” (let’s say any spirit...good or bad), a priest will come to the house to say a blessing and bless the home with holy water (at the very least).
I believe that that blessing is specific to something like this. It is not considered a prayer for the soul in purgatory. There is no assumption made that this soul is/should be in purgatory. There is no assumption made that the soul is good or bad.
In addition, I have never heard of saying prayers for such spirits at the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. However, it sure wouldn’t surprise me if we had a Vatican II priest doing something outside of the rubrics. I mean, like *that* never happens.
Eh, not sure if that applies because it is specifically speaking about evocation. Unless I missed it, I don’t see this priest calling forth or summoning these spirits (as in a séance).
I have 2 souls that have never left me,my Mom and Father J.Their presence is with me and they guide me along with St Joseph and Our Lady.
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