Lds Temple Haunted? Did Declaration of Independence signers appear as ghosts to leader? [Vanity]

Free Republic [Vanity] ^ | July 1, 2011 | Colofornian

[Elsie]

I won’t be looking back at this string, however, because I have a life to live, focused on better and more fulfilling things to do other than to engage in such pointless debate.

When I walk past the graveyard, in the middle of the night, whistling - I never look back; either!

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Psst!

You spelled 'an unwinnable' wrong...

[Elsie]

I won’t be looking back at this string...

Typical MORMON behavior found amoung those whose doubts are VERY nearly catching up to them.

Shut your eyes, ears, mind and RUN away!

[Elsie]

I’d be inclined to recommend that you consider finding an obsession other than straining at every historical gnat you think you can detect through your relentless and incessant searching and fault finding; a pattern of living unlikely to achieve a state of happiness, contentment and peace, IMHO.

GNAT????

Great LDS teachings??

Your Bishop wants a word with you!!

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BTW; you spelled FACT wrong.

[Elsie]

I’d be inclined to recommend ...

Of COURSE you are!

You CANNOT defend historical FACTS; so you'd like the FACTfinder to just disappear!

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(No WONDER so many Utahns are on PROZAC!)

[MarkBsnr]

I made ribeye steaks and half pound hamburgers sizzle on the grill yesterday. Montreal Steak Spice liberally applied. Medium high heat.

Fresh pineapple and watermelon that I sliced up just prior to supper. A whole bunch of yums.

[MarkBsnr]

We live in Iowa. No Prozac here. Lots of beer and whisky, though. Does that count?

[Kip Russell]

No such thing as ghosts. They’re demons. Any apparitions are. You'll NEVER see this on Discovery channel!

Unfortunately, you'll also never see the skeptical viewpoint there either (that there's no reliable evidence that ghosts even exist in the first place).

[svcw]

Why are you ignoring apparently all the references directly from lds sources about this issue and just questing the sanity of the thread

[ejonesie22]

On the contrary, this type debate is far from pointless, for we have several here on FR alone who have broken free from the LDS cult and embraced the real Christ. And these debates are occurring else where with similar results trimming the rolls of the LDS. Knowledge is power, that you counter with attacks on the individual proves the point...

[Hammerhead]

Good for you.

However, I’m not talking about the people, I’m talking about the weird, false, empty feeling, of the temple’s I visited - both Mormon and Masonic.

[Colofornian]

...through your relentless and incessant searching and fault finding...

Fault finding?

All I did is to quote from one of the EXACT same sources your church-owned Deseret News cited on Wednesday, July 3, 2013:
Founding of America and LDS gospel Restoration are divinely connected

ALL: If you jump to page two of that article, DesNews writer Trent Toone cites the same exact quote that the BYU curricula uses (see account #1 in my thread's piece):

In the April 1898 general conference, President Wilford Woodruff declared: "I am going to bear my testimony … that those men who laid the foundation of this American government and signed the Declaration of Independence were the best spirits the God of Heaven could find on the face of the earth. They were choice spirits, not wicked men. General (George) Washington and all the men that labored for the purpose were inspired of the Lord."

So, apparently, per JustTheTruth, it's "OK" for the church-owned DesNews to cite what one of their "prophets" said at the April 1898 General Conference on July 3, 2013. But if I -- a "Gentile" as described by Mormons -- cite the same source on July 4, 2013...duck!

ALL: What's also interesting is where DesNews journalist Trent Toone chose to end the quote from Woodruff...re: "George Washington and all the men who labored for the purpose were inspired of the Lord."

What did Toone leave out from what Woodruff said next...?

Well, let's pick up the quote...Imagine being a Mormon...sitting in the April 1898 General Conference:

Woodruff: Another thing I am going to say here, because I have a right to say it. Every one of those men that signed the Declaration of Independence with General Washington called upon me, as an Apostle of the Lord Jesus Christ, in the Temple at St. George two consecutive nights, and demanded at my hands that I should go forth and attend to the ordinances of the house of God for them. Men are here, I believe, that know of this—Brothers J. D. T. McAllister, David H. Cannon and James C. Bleak. Brother McAllister baptized me for all these men, and I then told these brethren that it was their duty to go into the Temple and labor until they got endowments for all of them. They did it. Would those spirits have called upon me, as an Elder in Israel, to perform that work if they had not been noble spirits before God? They would not. I bear this testimony because it is true. The spirit of God bore record to myself and the brethren while we were laboring in that way.

There ya go. A Mormon "prophet" bearing his testimony that for two straight nights, demonic entities masquerading as the founders of our country begging for Mormons to necro-baptize them...as if that would make some difference in their lives even from a Mormon theological perspective.

These men weren't married in Mormon temples. They had no Mormon temple recommends. From a Mormon perspective, most of the Founding Fathers would "qualify" for the middle kingdom in heaven, anyway. A Mormon necro-baptism wouldn't get them into Celestialville, anyway.

[Elsie]

YUM!

I grilled the hamburgers and weenies while SIL grilled the baby back ribs.

[Elsie]

Yes; at least according to the Deseret article...

[Elsie]

That’s all it is possible to do.

Who wants to tangle with a TarBaby?

[Elsie]

Fault finding?

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I just HATE when there is that stuff going on!!

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Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).

Joseph Smith: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).

 

 

 

Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).

 

 

 

Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).

 

 

 

Orson Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses

, vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses , 18:172).

 

 

President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses , 10:127).

 

 

 

James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).

 

 

 

President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).

 

 

 

More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).

 

 

 

President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).

 

 

President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 2, p.196).

[metmom]

La, la, la ,la,....la,..la,..la,....laaaaaaaaaa.........

I can’t hear you!!!!!!

Come one, Elsie, someone is just trying to confuse them with the facts. That’s the only response option available to preserve their sanity if they persist in adhering to their religion.

[Kip Russell]

Good for you.

However, I’m not talking about the people, I’m talking about the weird, false, empty feeling, of the temple’s I visited - both Mormon and Masonic.

While I can't speak of Masonic temples (never having been in one), I've been in churches & temples from Temple Square in SLC and Salisbury Cathedral to New Synagogue in Berlin and Notre Dame de Paris, and I've never gotten a "weird, false empty feeling" from any of them.

[Colofornian]

fault finding

Mormon author Lucile Johnson wrote in her book Sunny Side Up: "Faultfinding is putting personal prejudice and personality in place of principle."

I place the principle of truth very high. Whereas many Lds hold anyone who consistently challenges the ISM of MormonISM with prejudicial contempt, I try not to take it personally...even when Lds comments are against the person. Let's keep talking principles, issues, history, doctrine, truth vs falsehood...shall we?

[Colofornian]

fault finding

and...btw...are you finding fault with me again??? :-)

[reaganaut]

Let’s hear it for lapsed Mormons!