Do you mean a Temple ceremony?
Posted on 11/10/2012 7:59:09 AM PST by Colofornian
MessageToEagle.com - Normally, as a matter of personal preference I don’t get into politics, but when we have a presidential campaign that begins to cross over into the strange twilight zone of religious weirdness that centers on the one person who’s going to control the most powerful government and army on the face of the earth, well, it brings up some unusual scenarios to wonder about.
It is being reported in the media today that former presidential candidate Mitt Romney only wrote a victory speech for Election Day; presumably a harried, last minute scramble to revise his speech was being suggested as the reason behind the Romney-Ryan campaigns’ sluggish reluctance to concede their party’s unthinkable defeat.
Electoral Votes:
Barack Obama: 303 Mitt Romney: 206
Curiously, one has to wonder whether it was Romney’s obsession with polls and tracking data that lead to this overextension of hubris; his unshakable faith that he would be the next president of the United States—or could it have been Romney’s Mormon faith itself that lead him to believe victory was all but assured by some divine mandate?
Ascending to the office of the presidency has always been a coveted part of the mission of the Mormon Church, which began with its founder Joseph Smith, who as a young man experienced a close encounter with a being from another planet named Moroni, who descended from the heavens and instructed Smith to found a new religion (as seen on History Channel’s Ancient Aliens, S3E01)—today, in Ufology, such a happenstance would likely be classified as a contactee CE5 level event.
“I saw a pillar of light . . . which descended gradually until it fell upon me” – Joseph Smith.
In 1844 Joseph Smith, an apparent UFO contactee and the founder of the Mormon Church, brazenly launched his own political campaign for President of the United States. His stated goal was to overthrow the U.S. Constitution, and bring about a Mormon theocracy to the Nation.
Smith’s candidacy was always long shot, but that didn’t stop him from rallying his people to help clinch his destiny to be an independent commander in chief of the “army of God”.
Smith prophesied that if the U.S. Congress did not bow to his demands that “they shall be broken up as a government and God shall damn them.” He foresaw the emergence of “the one Mighty and Strong”—a leader who would “set in order the house of God”.
Smith’s call for a “theodemocracy where God and his people hold the power to conduct the affairs of men in righteous matters” evidently did not sit well with the majority of voters in the United States, and brought down a lot of bad press and hostility upon the Mormons. Smith’s presidential campaign was cut short while he was sitting in jail facing charges of treason and inciting a riot; an angry mob broke into the jailhouse and brought him to justice by shooting him to death.
Out of this early chapter of U.S. history developed what has became known in the Mormon Church as the “White Horse Prophecy”—a controversial prediction that someday a great Mormon leader, who, at a time when the U.S. Constitution “hangs like a thread as fine as a silk fiber”, would be elected President.
I know a little bit about Mormonism and their beliefs. I grew up and lived in Salt Lake City most all my life, I sat through many days of LDS seminary at public schools, and I also attended a private Mormon school as a teenager.
My family has roots in the Mormon pioneer heritage and early history. My ancestors, the Neff’s, came to the Salt Lake Valley in 1847, from Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. My great-great-great-grandfather John Neff, Sr. settled Neff’s canyon in East Millcreek, Utah. He was also a close friend of Brigham Young and accompanied him into Northern Utah to proselyte amongst the Native Americans there. His daughter, Mary Ann Neff, married the notorious Mormon gunslinger and Utah folkhero Orrin Porter Rockwell.
Orrin Porter Rockwell was one scary-looking son of a bitch . . .
Rockwell served as a loyal henchman to Church founders Joseph Smith Jr. and Brigham Young—and was affectionately nick-named ‘Ol’ Port’ the ‘Destroying Angel of Mormondom’.
In his despicable and sordid history, Ol’ Port was intimately connected to political assassinations, revenge-killings, and gruesome Indian massacres. He’s praised for having avenged the Prophet Joseph Smith’s murder by shooting one of the conspirators with his musket while riding astride a horse.
There have been a few failed attempts in various movies and books to elevate the psychopath to the status of a gritty American hero of the old west —fortunately, none of them have really stuck.
A few of the many curious tenants of Mormonism I heard growing up in Salt Lake City were as follows . . .
*Cain, the killer of his brother Abel, is alive and wanders the earth, wearing no clothing but being covered by hair, and that LDS Church apostle David W. Patten encountered him once; and that reported sightings of Bigfoot can be explained by this story.
*Blacks were neutral in the War in Heaven, and that is why they were not allowed to hold the Mormon priesthood before 1978.
*Albert Einstein supposedly once said that LDS Church apostle James E. Talmage was the smartest man he had ever met.
*The Second Coming was imminent, and when I was age 25 I would be living in the “Last Days” (I’m in my 40’s now).
And here’s where Mitt Romney’s presidential candidacy enters the picture—
I remember my 7th grade LDS seminary teacher sermonizing about the “signs” of the ‘Last Days’.
One of his favorite ‘signs’ that he liked to talk about was that a great Mormon leader would be elected President of the United States, and this would be a major indication that the Last Days were imminent, e.g. the White Horse Prophecy.
Some say that the White Horse Prophecy was written by Joseph Smith himself, while others dispute that claim. According to the Salt Lake City Tribune:
The disputed prophecy was recorded in a diary entry of a Mormon who had heard the tale from two men who were with Joseph Smith in Nauvoo, Ill. when he supposedly declared the prophecy. “You will see the Constitution of the United States almost destroyed,” the diary entry quotes Smith as saying. “It will hang like a thread as fine as a silk fiber.”
Not only will the Mormons save the Constitution, under the prediction, but the prophecy goes further, insinuating that Mormons will control the government.
“Power will be given to the White Horse to rebuke the nations afar off, and you obey it, for the laws go forth from Zion,” the prophecy says.
Publicly, the Mormon Church doesn’t officially endorse the ‘White Horse Prophecy’ as doctrine, and will deny anything to do with it (just as Romney has whenever it’s been brought up)—however, there’s a telling piece of Mormon dogma that people may find disturbing. It was set in place by Joseph Smith himself, and is referred to as “lying for the Lord.”
As an act of self preservation or to protect the Mormon Church, it is doctrinally permissive to lie about your beliefs or intentions. In other words the ends justify the means. Smith did it with regard to his polygamous lifestyle. Brigham Young did it when he claimed that only Paiute Indians were responsible for the Mountain Meadows Massacre.
Over and over again, Mitt Romney marginalized his devout Mormon background, and downplayed its significance throughout his entire campaign. But in the 1970’s the ‘Cougar Club’ at Brigham Young University declared their admiration of Mitt and predicted that he’d be the president of the United States one day. According to an article on Salon.com:
…the Cougar Club — the all male, all white social club at Brigham Young University in Salt Lake City (blacks were excluded from full membership in the Mormon church until 1978) — was humming with talk that its president, Mitt Romney, would become the first Mormon president of the United States. “If not Mitt, then who?” was the ubiquitous slogan within the elite organization. The pious world of BYU was expected to spawn the man who would lead the Mormons into the White House and fulfill the prophecies of the church’s founder, Joseph Smith Jr., which Romney has avidly sought to realize.
With all this in mind, it’s hard not to look back and wonder . . .
Could Mitt Romney have been intending to run the United States as a Mormon theocratic state, as fortold by his Church’s prophet Joseph Smith?
Would a President Romney have executed the will of the people of the United States, and answered to the people—or would he only answer to God via the hierarchy of the Mormon Church?
What if a “revelation” or “vision” was received by the current President of the LDS Church (or Prophet), and passed on to ‘President Romney’ as a directive from God?–would Romney have executed that directive, even if it had gone against the will of the U.S. people, or the World?
Thankfully, this is probably one mystery we’ll never know the answer to . . .
Written by Dustin Naef - MessageToEagle.com Contributor
About the author: Dustin Naef has been a student of ancient mysteries and the paranormal for as long as he can remember. He has worked in screenwriting, graphic design and illustration, produced and designed video best-selling games, and is currently involved in the production of a film documentary and book about the mysteries surrounding Mount Shasta, California.
If you wish to follow Dustin Naef: Dustin's website: http://www.dustinnaef.com Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dustinnaef.mountshasta https://www.facebook.com/MountShastaFilm
Do you mean a Temple ceremony?
SANDY!!
You are BLESSED!
It seems you are channeling Hinckley!!!
You go, Gyrrl!
When posters are banned, the mod log records the date and reason given. Whoever banned you wrote that you had opus’ed out which basically means that you wanted to go.
Religion Moderator;
You may have to SHOW her the actual text.
She'll not acknowledge it; of course; but it would stifle the wild accusations she's tossing about.
And there may be some reading this that think you are kidding!!!
Excellent proofs. I bow to your wisdom and expertise. The only question I have is: which are the more heretical? The Swedenborgians or the Mormons?
Or is it a simply a matter left to Dante Alighieri as to which level we find them on?
The bothersome reply
"I don't know that we teach it. I don't know that we emphasize it. I haven't heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse. I don't know. I don't know all the circumstances under which that statement was made. I understand the philosophical background behind it, but I don't know a lot about it, and I don't think others know a lot about it."
The reporter wrote, "On whether his church still holds that God the Father was once a man, he sounded uncertain." That's an unfortunate conclusion. Of course I wasn't at the interview and neither were you but I'll bet the reporter mistook careful thoughtfulness for uncertainty. This doctrine is indeed deep territory and not something that is taught outside the LDS Church.
An earlier and similar interview
The San Francisco Chronicle, published an interview with President Hinckley in April of 1997. The reporter asked, "There are some significant differences in your beliefs. For instance, don't Mormon's believe that God was once a man?" President Hinckley responded, "I wouldn't say that. There is a little couplet coined, 'As man is, God once was. As God is, man may become.'"
He then said, "Now that's more of a couplet than anything else. That gets into some pretty deep theology that we don't know very much about." The reporter pounced on this. "So you're saying that the church is still struggling to understand this? " President Hinckley responded, "Well, as God is, man may become. We believe in eternal progression. Very strongly."
President Hinckley's response
President Hinckley said in October 1997 General Conference: "I personally have been much quoted, and in a few instances misquoted and misunderstood. I think that's to be expected. None of you need worry because you read something that was incompletely reported. You need not worry that I do not understand some matters of doctrine.
"I think I understand them thoroughly, and it is unfortunate that the reporting may not make this clear. I hope you will never look to the public press as the authority on the doctrines of the Church." And there lies the whole point of my post today. Some members did indeed become a little concerned by the exchanges they read in the press reports of those interviews.
Does the Church still teach this?
I know this is old news but it still bothers some people when they discover the anti-Mormon attacks floating around on the Internet. President Hinckley was right. We really don't know much about how our Heavenly Father became a God. The idea that he passed through a mortal probationary state like you and me is certainly not documented in any scripture of which I know.
However, it is still taught. In the Gospel Principles manual in the chapter on exaltation we read, "Joseph Smith taught: "It is the first principle of the Gospel to know for a certainty the character of God. . . . He was once a man like us; . . . God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ himself did" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pp. 345-46)."
Summary and conclusion
I don't know why this should bother anyone. The doctrine is true. Joseph Smith knew a whole lot more about this than I do. President Hinckley also knew a whole lot more about this doctrine than he was willing to share with reporters who did not have the background to understand it. It must have been difficult for President Hinckley to hold back and not teach it in those interviews.
It didn't bother me when I read the interviews back in 1997 and it doesn't bother me today. However, I know it does bother some people. We each have trials of our faith. I have never depended on an intellectual understanding of the gospel in order to accept it and live it. There are some things that just can't be fully comprehended without the temple, prayer and faith.
There are some things that just can't be fully comprehended without the temple, prayer and faith.
You really admit to being THIS stupid? A LAWYER???
Pardon?
I was quite surprised when mine started to do this, as I had NO clue as to goat behavior at all!
Even the girls do it.
The 'boys', ahem, are wethers. Would this surpress the head thumping a bit?
just visited 629 and don’t quite understand it..I’m a little slow on some things.....GG
I may have been wrong to assume that the "Daily" was his own writings. Yet he otherwise seemed to claim it (previous to my own reply concerning it) and the banner ad seemed part of the overall "ministry" page, so what can I say? That even taking care to carefully check before assuming my suspicions were correct, I may still have been in error? Yeah, but I had more than a bit of help in it...and got a small snoot-full for my troubles. From one whom preaches acceptance, tolerance, love, etc.
Aint' the FR RF just peachy? hehheh...
ONLY if ALL of the 'family' have TR's.
Or don't...
I have NOTHING that the MORMONs have not provided themselves.
Even Sandy can find this stuff out; if and when she would ever decide to become honest to herself.
PS seperated wethers from males during breeding season or they would likely get killed..
“Your Jesus is different from mine. My Jesus loves and accepts me. “
... Oh, no. Jesus Christ loves you so much, He died for you. The mormonic jesus, is fiction. The real Savior can be yours.
“My Jesus suffered and died for me. I love Him. Your Jesus died for only you and your people.”
... Why cling to a fictional, sweaty version of the Real Jesus Christ, when you can have the Real One, who really loves you and died for your sins?
“You condemn me to hell every time you spout the anti Mormon/anti MormonISM nonsense.”
... Only you can reject the real Christ. I’ve never condemned you to anything. It’s all up to you Sandy. What will you do?
You make lots of victim statements in your posts. You never use facts, evidence, or logic. Just sweeping generalities. Have you considered why you don’t have any facts?
Shouldn’t your eternal destiny be supported by more than sweeping generalities, feelings and victim-hood?
I would hope so for you. I wish a great eternity for you with God.
You guys and your goats........their eyes are so weird.
Really, they creep me out, but I do love goat cheese and of course the stew.....yumm.
My opinion is the mormon sects are more heretical than the Swedenborgians, for the following reason:
I have only read one of Swedenborg's works, "A treatise on Heaven and Hell", circa 1790, read it 5 years ago. I do not recall Mr Swedenborg doing anything more than stating his opion, based on Paul's mention of a "third heaven" in the bible.
FLDS/LDS "prophet" Joseph Smith, checked this same book out from the Palmyra NY library many times, records show. Smith ripped off the entire theory of Swedenborgianism, said he got it directly from "gods" and called it the mormon "plan of salvation."
The mormons here visciously turned on me, and Greyfoxx39 and the others took me right in and comforted me. When I say "turned on me" I mean just that, sending emails asking how my daughters were by name, telling me they turned me into the FBI for church shootings and firebombings that happened states away, etc. Want to know the best way to identify a cult ? Watch what they do to people who try to leave. I had to get a court order to keep them away from my daughters.
Recovery was a long and bumpy road. After a year or so I realised how brainwashed I had been. I once was blind, but now I see.
I was baptized a little over a year ago. I am a non-denominational Christian and know that Jesus calls me friend.
shame on you for not loving our goats...but they make better sausage than stew..Elsie has 4, I had a large flock that needed to thinned out once in a while. You bad mouth Elsie’s goats and He will put a curse on you, not a bad one, maybe only a stubbed toe....LOL
;-)
Now that you have refreshed my memory, I do recall that time. Please forgive me for not having been there to help much, myself. Then again, I've never been a Mormon, myself, so left that to those whom you have named (along with others whom provided help as best they could).
I didn't want to try and add to what was then being shared, for fear my own comments might distract, for my own flesh lead me into reacting like "oh yeah? naming your daughters, huh? let me at 'em!" which is NOT of the Spirit of the Lord, t'all.
it is interesting though, how they claim to have the spirit (and none but themselves do!) yet when scratched, they respond with demonic fury. Quite telling!
sorta reminds me of some other folks 'round here, a bit...
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