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Posted on 11/30/2011 5:08:01 PM PST by TSgt
COVINGTON, Ky. - Bishop Roger Foys of the Covington Diocese decreed that parishioners should not hold hands during the Lord's Prayer.
In his decree Bishop Foys writes:
Special note should also be made concerning the gesture for the Our Father. Only the priest is given the instruction to "extend" his hands. Neither the deacon nor the lay faithful are instructed to do this. No gesture is prescribed for the lay faithful in the Roman Missal ; nor the General Instruction of the Roman Missal , therefore the extending or holding of hands by the faithful should not be performed.
"I'm a little bit surprised," said Dan Ryan of Edgewood.
9 News spoke Ryan as he picked up his son from Covington Catholic High School.
"It helps keep us together as a family you know the motto that says a family that prays together stays together. I think there's a whole lot of room for interpretation there I think again we're talking about individual decisions and individual options there should be some discretion it sounds like to me," said Ryan.
"First, I didn't know that was an edict that Bishop Foys made but my family and I do hold hands while we say the Lord's Prayer but the way I feel about it is if that is not part of liturgy then we will follow the liturgy," said J. Zang of Crestview Hills.
In a statement to 9News diocesan spokesman Tim Fitzgerald said, "Bishop Foys’ purpose [in issuing the decree] was to reiterate the directives guiding the celebration of the Mass as specified by the Second Vatican Council and related Vatican documents, fulfilling his role as chief teacher of the diocese; he did so as the new translation of the Roman Missal was first used in the diocese and in the United States last weekend. The decree concerned the proper texts of Mass prayers; liturgical music; gestures for priests, deacons, religious and lay faithful; the location of the choir and other musicians; and prayerful silence before and after Mass.”
I have been thinking a dress code would be nice, or at least have some charity sweaters handed out to the cleavage clappers in order to to cover up their entertainment. Modesty is neither taught, nor preached.
On the other hand, Catholics believe that prayer is between the indiviual and God. Believe it or not, the 'holding hands' thing is one of the main liturgical abuses. I always fold my hands, bow my head, close my eyes and commune with God only.
What Does GIRM 160 for the USA Really Say? (Communion posture) [Catholic Caucus]
Liturgical Vigilantes
Vatican Officials Say Bad Masses Lead to Weak Faith [Catholic Caucus]
[CATHOLIC CAUCUS] THE TEN MOST COMMON LITURGICAL ABUSES
Another Look at the Orans Issue
THE TEN MOST COMMON LITURGICAL ABUSES And Why They're Wrong
Liturgical Abuses: Summarized from Redemptionis Sacramentum
Discipline Regarding Reception of Holy Communion
Principals or principles?
Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:
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I have the Keys and you can't have them. Take a walk. It will not fit anything you think it will fit.
Also don't you have an " off " button. Well push it and take a chill pill.
Maybe use less starch in that collar.
You know once in awhile it's nice to come up for air.
LOL!!!
Our Bishop suspended the physical contact part of the sign of peace two years ago when the swine flu swept through. We didn’t do it from about November to February. Well, you should have seen the mass (pun intended!) confusion Christmas Eve! We should witness the same phenomenon this Christmas with all of the wording changes.
Just read your comments and I remember a few years back, when Catholics in my diocese only was allowed to recieve Jesus in the eucherest only, no wine from the chalice.
In regards to the old words still being use at Christmas, when those Catholics who only come a few times a year, will be very, very interesting in regards to the new English words.
What about rasing the hands up, not holding hands?
Yes actually we are told to pray in the closet...and not be like the hypocrites.
>>Wish all bishops took that position<<
The Bishop in Cleveland took that stand and instead instructed the laity to use a “modified Orans” Which looks like the “stick um up” gesture.
It’s hilarious.
>>How does holding my husband’s hand during the prayer direct it away from Our Father?How does holding my husband’s hand during the prayer direct it away from Our Father?<<
It’s not your family that this poster is talking about. It’s the focus on “community”. Everyone getting together and holding hands.
Now, reasonably you should be able to focus exclusively on Christ during the “Liturgy of the Eucharist” but if you are thanking God for your great husband or child, cool. If you are taking the hands of strangers and this is encouraged by the congregation, they are ignoring the GIRM.
And we do have those instructions for something.
>>What about rasing the hands up, not holding hands?<<
The “Hands Extended” position is a directive given specifically to the Priest in the Holy Mass. NOT to the laity. In fact, this gesture is for the priest and deacon ONLY.
There is a reason we are told what gestures we can use in the holy mass.
Here, this will help you...
“However that may be, the Holy See has been concerned about the laity unduly aping the priest at Mass, and in the 1997 Instruction on Collaboration, an unprecedented conjunction of Vatican dicasteries wrote:
6 § 2. To promote the proper identity (of various roles) in this area, those abuses which are contrary to the provisions of canon 907 [i.e., “In the celebration of the Eucharist, deacons and lay persons are not permitted to say the prayers, especially the eucharistic prayer, nor to perform the actions which are proper to the celebrating priest.”] are to be eradicated. In eucharistic celebrations deacons and non-ordained members of the faithful may not pronounce prayers — e.g. especially the eucharistic prayer, with its concluding doxology — or any other parts of the liturgy reserved to the celebrant priest. Neither may deacons or non-ordained members of the faithful use gestures or actions which are proper to the same priest celebrant. It is a grave abuse for any member of the non-ordained faithful to “quasi preside” at the Mass while leaving only that minimal participation to the priest which is necessary to secure validity.
This instruction, incidentally, was approved by John Paul II in forma specifica, meaning that the pope invested it with his own authority and is binding on us with the pope’s authority and not merely the authority of the authoring congregations.”
From here
http://www.jimmyakin.org/2005/06/ed_peters_has_a.html
Could it be because both the priest and deacon raising the hands represents Christ as the high priest?
It’s during the Liturgy of the Eucharist. Eventhough you are praying for the congregation, your focus should be on God, NOT them.
>>Could it be because both the priest and deacon raising the hands represents Christ as the high priest?<<
That sounds right to me. And that’s why the “we are all Priests” wing of the liberal Catholics pushed all of us using the Orans position and mimicking the priest in the Holy Mass.
Remember the liberal Catholics will base this on what was said what I believe is in 1st Peter about being a “royal priesthood” by being baptized.
I can’t believe that so far no one has mentioned the following:
“...and prayerful silence before and after Mass.”
When did it become permissible to chat with each other when in the presence of the Eucharist?
And what happened to genuflecting before entering the pew?
In other words, pray in silence along with the priest than?
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