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FAIR changes Mormon defenders website name
Deseret News ^ | November 21, 2011 | Joseph Walker

Posted on 11/28/2011 4:12:34 PM PST by Saundra Duffy

"The Mormon Defense League" is out. "MormonVoices" is in.

That change became official Monday, when the Foundation for Apologetic Information and Research announced a name change for its website aimed at defending the teachings and practices of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

FAIR is a non-profit organization that, according to a press release, is operated by "self-motivated Mormons who seek to improve the public understanding about the church" through conferences, workshops and scholarly articles posted on the organization's websites. While it is dedicated to "providing well-documented answers to criticisms of the doctrine, beliefs and practices" of the LDS Church, it is not owned, controlled by or affiliated with the church.

(Excerpt) Read more at deseretnews.com ...


TOPICS: Current Events; Ecumenism; Religion & Culture; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: 11sept1857; brighamyoung; cult; inman; josephsmith; lds; mittromneyscult; mittromneysreligion; mormon; mormonism; polygamy; polygyny; racistcult; romney; romneyscult; romneysreligion; slickmittscult; slickmittsreligion
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To: Saundra Duffy; All
From the article: "The Mormon Defense League" is out.

It was never rightly titled, anyway. "The Mormon Defense League" was more like "The Offensive Mormon Band" -- Or T.O.M.B. for short.

(And if anybody wants to see why Mormon "scriptures" and their defenders are offensive, see post #138)

141 posted on 11/29/2011 3:11:38 PM PST by Colofornian (JoePologists: Those who defend the personality cults of Joe Smith and Joe Paterno)
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To: Admin Moderator

Thanks AM. It’s good to have the real facts out there.


142 posted on 11/29/2011 3:15:00 PM PST by greyfoxx39 (If other churches were dead dunking mormons to save them mormons would be furious.)
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To: Colofornian
You actually deem it to be a 'family reunion' when the 'family reunion' excludes the ULTIMATE PATRIARCH of the Family! Wow! How offensive can your false gospel get???!!!"

Excellent! This post really puts the lie to the mormon lie about everyone being "saved".

143 posted on 11/29/2011 3:24:02 PM PST by greyfoxx39 (If other churches were dead dunking mormons to save them mormons would be furious.)
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To: Gaffer
Me laddy, what we gots here are world class, nothing less...

INDEED!

We riled SPAMlds so much that Greg West retired!

144 posted on 11/29/2011 3:55:51 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
And so you're telling me that 'salvation' in your eyes includes NEVER being reconciled to Heavenly Father?

2 Corinthians 5:20We are therefore Christ's ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ's behalf: Be reconciled to God.


(SOMEbody has this on their homepage...)

145 posted on 11/29/2011 3:59:16 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
JOE MORMON: don't let them ANTI's get you down!

I remember your kind words when I couldn't go to my oldest daughters wedding in the Temple; and THAT's why I decided to become a Temple Worthy MORMON!

--MormonDupe(So I could attend my YOUNGEST daughter's wedding in the Temple.)

146 posted on 11/29/2011 4:04:59 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
I wish all of us MORMONs were here in person: hugs all around!

--MormonDupe(So we all could check for the garment)

147 posted on 11/29/2011 4:06:06 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: F15Eagle
My only objective is to repeat the evidence that Joseph Smith and co. like Brigham Young were false prophets.

EVIDENCE is bad!

--MormonDude(We tend to IGNORE it; or say that it mattereth not.)

148 posted on 11/29/2011 4:08:45 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie; Scoutmaster; 1010RD; svcw; Tennessee Nana; All
I remember your kind words when I couldn't go to my oldest daughters wedding in the Temple; and THAT's why I decided to become a Temple Worthy MORMON! --MormonDupe(So I could attend my YOUNGEST daughter's wedding in the Temple.)

Well, of course!

Temple marriage is EVERYTHING to Mormons!

10th Mormon "prophet" Joseph Fielding Smith was answering a 1958 question related to "marriage in heaven." He took the opportunity to blast away at Christians -- Prostestants and Catholics -- who didn't teach temple marriage for eternity:

"Unfortunately the great apostasy which swept over the earth, the words of the Lord to the Pharisees were misinterpreted because the spirit of revelation had ceased. Therefore the Christian world, Protestant and Catholic, has fallen into this fatal error." (p. 119 republished by the Mormon church-owned Deseret Book Co. in 1979 in Answers to Gospel Questions, Vol. 2)

So here you had a Mormon General Authority teaching that marriage beyond Mormon temples is a "fatal error!"

[Well, exxxxxxxxxxcuuuuuuuuuuuse people for getting married, Mormon "prophets"...I s'pose you want them to live in cohabitation sin vs. committing "fatal errors," eh???]

And now, remember. EVERY time a Mormon "prophet" is cited on these Web sites, they were unanimously "sustained" by Mormon people of that given generation. Mormon people themselves are the very "sustainers" of these kinds of ideas...especially when they give 10% of their income to a church which republishes this stuff as recent as 1979 (or perhaps later).

Btw, this idea that people absolutely HAVE to get married has led Mormon leaders to be revisionistic and go back and declare that both Jesus and the apostle Paul were married.

For the Mormon leaders who taught this, see this Scoutmaster post Mormon general authorities teaching Jesus was married [see post #24]

For the apostle Paul, see Joseph Fielding Smith's Answers to Gospel Questions, Vol. 5, p. 152. This was published by the Mormon church-owned Deseret Book Co. in 1966 and republished in 1979:

"It would be inconsistent for Paul to teach others they had to be married and that marriage was essential for exaltation and then not be married himself. Paul was worthy of the exaltation, therefore, Paul was without any question a married man." [Joseph Fielding Smith was citing NT passages, 1 Tim. 3:2 and Titus 1:6, about how leaders needed to be married to one woman -- hmm...somehow, his predecessors missed these "one wife" passages...but, of course, he neglected the apostle Paul's passage to the Corinthians...1 Cor. 7...about his qualified recommendation for staying single]

Now, 1010rd...why were you pinged here? 'Cause one of your most common complaints about Christian posts is how we supposedly engage in eisegesis. Yet what do we have here? All these Mormon general authorities who have engaged in the absolute worst of eisegesis...reading into texts that say nothing about Jesus or Paul being married...this was retro-revision...eisegesis--all to fit later-imposed Mormon doctrine!

149 posted on 11/29/2011 5:43:57 PM PST by Colofornian (JoePologists: Those who defend the personality cults of Joe Smith and Joe Paterno)
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To: Elsie; All
2 Corinthians 5:20We are therefore Christ's ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ's behalf: Be reconciled to God.

Yup. You picked the best verse for this.

And Mormons think this can only be done via proper "paperwork."

(a) A certified Mormon-church issued "Temple Recommend" to a real Mormon temple.
(b) A marriage certificate.

This, of course, converts millions of Mormons into imaginary "paper" 'saviors' -- either literally or at least overshadowing Jesus Christ as the True Only Savior of the world!

Let's "start" with (b) -- the marriage certificate:

Q1: What have Lds general authorities said about this marriage certificate (or else, no living with Heavenly Father forever)?

A.:

* Lds "apostle" Boyd K. Packer-- three years ago last week: "Any man who thinks he is going to the highest degree of glory without a women at his side does not understand the gospel." (Church News, Nov. 22, 2008, p. 6)

IOW, any single men can't live with Heavenly Father forever minus a marriage certificate!

* Lds "first president" Hugh B. Brown (one of three highest-ranking Mormons at any given time): "Celestial marriage is an everlasting covenant, prereguisite to exaltation and eternal progression the kingdom of God" (You and Your Marriage, p. 22)

Q2: How "cherished" is the Mormon temple recommend?

“The ‘temple recommend’ is a cherished slip of PAPER that gives its holder the right to enter the LDS temple and participate in its ceremonies. Mormons ‘pass stringent demands of dietary laws, tithing, sexual orthodoxy and others requirements for a ‘temple recommend’. These recommends are printed forms which, when filled out by the bishop, provides a copy for the Mormon church headquarters files, one copy for the ward’s records, and a third for the holder to present at entrance of a temple for admission.” “Since the church believes that one must be ‘temple worthy’ in order to attain the Celestial Kingdom, having the power to grant or withhold recommends gives the local bishops immense power. Furthermore, in predominantly Mormon areas the lack of a recommend can often mean the loss of a job or being shunned by one’s neighbors. These slips of PAPER are most valuable.” 1 ... Having a temple recommend also serves as a status symbol, as those without it cannot marry or attend marriage ceremonies in the temple, nor can they be sealed for eternity with their father so that they may eternally be together with their family in Mormon Heaven.
Source: Mormon LDS Temple Bishop Recommends

Therefore, a piece of PAPER signed off by a Mormon lay bishop -- a position held at one time by Mitt Romney -- can determine if...
...a man gets to be sealed with his family forever in heaven...
...a person will be living with Heavenly Father forever -- or not...
...you can see your son or daughter get married (or other relatives and friends, for that matter)
...you'll become a "god" or not...

Reflective Questions:
* Could you imagine Mitt Romney having that kind of power over you were you in Mitt's ward back when he was a lay bishop?
* Or knowing that Mitt himself believed he once held that kind of power over others?
* Now do you see why the author called this a "Mormon conspiracy"? (It takes quite a plot to have a piece of PAPER carry that much weight in a person's life)
* Now do you see why Lds lay bishops carry so much fearful power in the Mormon church? (A bishop says "jump" -- and the Mormon asks, "How high?")

You see mere pieces of PAPER carry tremendous weight in the Mormon church.

Q3: How do Mormons determine their next head "prophet"?

A: Among those eligible, a piece of PAPER printed long ago does. It's called a calendar. The age of the Mormon general authority among the candidates is what dictates to the Mormon god who gets the nod.

Lds may talk about how they "sustain" who the "prophet" is by a show of hands...but coincidentally, no "no" votes seems to have ever been tallied. Even the Mormon holy ghost can't override the power of calendar PAPER re: the selection process.

Q4: In the Mormon plan of salvation, what power do pieces of PAPER carry beyond temple recommended Mormons?

A: Others (non-Mormons) can get a "get-out-spirit prison" monopoly card because some keen Mormon researchers found some old pieces of PAPER -- birth and death records...which in turn can trigger a proxy baptism in that Mormon temple...which supposedly triggers deceased Mormon spirit missionaries to go visit the Spirit World where ALL go after they die [If you don't believe this part of what I'm saying, go to this Mormon published source here: The Spirit World, Our Next Home

Q5: How does the power Mormon leaders assign to mere pieces of PAPER compare to how Jesus treated the all holy Bible -- which consists, of course of pieces of PAPER?

A: Even Jesus set the holiest pieces of PAPER in proper perspective when He said: 39(You) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of ME . (John 5:39)

IOW, even many people attending a Christian church abort the process. They search the Scriptures, thinking "in them" that they "have eternal life"....Yet Jesus said even the PAPERED Scriptures' purpose was to testify to HIM!!! (A testimony to a living relationship with the LIVING WORD, Jesus Christ). Jesus CANNOT be reduced to mere words about Him on pages. The LIVING WORD is to be encountered! Do Lds see the very ritualism to which they've become attached?

Mormon leaders, on the other hand -- like Lds "apostle" Bruce McConkie -- have counseled BYU students to NOT seek a special relationship with Jesus Christ. (See: Our relationship with the Lord)

Who will we trust?
* Mormon leaders counseling impressionable college students AGAINST a special relationship with Jesus?
* Mormon leaders inventing temple rituals, including ones that replace the blood of Christ cleansing our generational sins?
* Mormon leaders vesting the very power as to who gets to live with Heavenly Father according to a signature on a piece of PAPER signed by a part-time lay bishop, whether his name is Mitt or something else???

150 posted on 11/29/2011 6:00:49 PM PST by Colofornian (JoePologists: Those who defend the personality cults of Joe Smith and Joe Paterno)
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To: Colofornian; All; Scoutmaster; 1010RD; svcw; Tennessee Nana
Re post #149...link to Scoutmaster post wasn't posted correctly: Here it is: [This is on Mormon leaders teaching Jesus was married]

For the Mormon leaders who taught this, see this Scoutmaster post Mormon general authorities teaching Jesus was married [see post #24]

151 posted on 11/29/2011 6:04:53 PM PST by Colofornian (JoePologists: Those who defend the personality cults of Joe Smith and Joe Paterno)
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To: Colofornian

Magic Mormon Underoos Placemarker!


152 posted on 11/29/2011 6:15:30 PM PST by aMorePerfectUnion (You know, 99.99999965% of the lawyers give all of them a bad name)
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To: Colofornian
Mormons ‘pass stringent demands of dietary laws, tithing, sexual orthodoxy and others requirements for a ‘temple recommend’.

HMMmm...

My purient interests have been aroused.

Just WHERE in the BoM are THESE instructions found??

153 posted on 11/29/2011 7:48:51 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
"We have also proved that both God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ inherit their wives in eternity as well as in time." The Seer, p. 172 (1853)

Orson Pratt, an "apostle" in mormonism, declaring that Jesus was a polygamist and that God the Father had a plurality of wives.

154 posted on 11/29/2011 8:07:06 PM PST by SZonian (Throwing our allegiances to political party's in the long run gave away our liberty.)
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To: SZonian
Remember folks...


If a person has bought into the idea that the BoM is 'true'; then 'believeing' all of the subsequent REVELATIONS and VISIONS of the MORMON Leaders becomes a LOT more easy to swallow.


And just HOW does a person 'believe' that the BoM is TRUE?

Why, by their OWN revelation or vision!

Which MORMON, Inc. would have them call FAITH.

155 posted on 11/30/2011 4:28:25 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: SZonian
Orson Pratt, an "apostle" in mormonism, declaring that Jesus was a polygamist and that God the Father had a plurality of wives.



 
W. W. Phelps

I have a Dream


William Wines Phelps, assistant president of
the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints
in Missouri
 
 

 
 
William W. Phelps' grave marker.
 The back is inscribed with the words
 
There is no end to matter
There is no end to space
There is no end to spirit
There is no end to race.
 
There is no end to glory
There is no end to love
There is no end to being
There is no death above"
from the hymn

Today, William W. Phelps is probably best-known for his legacy of LDS hymns, many of which appear in the current edition of the LDS Hymnal.[6]

Just a couple...
If You Could Hie to Kolob
Praise to the Man

Excommunicated and rebaptized

A scribe to Joseph Smith Jr., for some time, in late 1838 Phelps was one of several who bore witness against Smith and other leaders, aiding in their imprisonment in Missouri until April 1839. In June 1840, Phelps plead for forgiveness in a letter to Smith. Smith replied with an offer of full fellowship, and ended with the famous couplet, "'Come on, dear brother, since the war is past, For friends at first are friends again at last.'"[4]

It was decided that Phelps, along with Frederick G. Williams, could be ordained as elders and serve missions abroad. Phelps served a brief mission in the eastern United States in 1841. Phelps moved to Nauvoo, Illinois where on August 27, 1841, he replaced Robert B. Thompson (who had died) as Joseph Smith's clerk. Beginning in February 1843, Phelps became the ghostwriter of many of Smith's important written works of the Nauvoo period, including General Joseph Smith's Appeal to the Green Mountain Boys of November 1843, Smith's theodemocratic presidential platform of January 1844, and The Voice of Innocence which was presented to and unanimously approved by the Relief Society in February 1844 to rebut claims of polygamy in Nauvoo arising out of Orsimus Bostwick's lawsuit accusing Hyrum Smith of polygamy and other sexual misconduct with the women of Nauvoo.[5]

Phelps was endowed on December 9, 1843, received his "second anointing" promising him godhood on February 2, 1844, and was also made a member of the Council of Fifty. In Nauvoo, Phelps spoke out in favor of the destruction of an opposition newspaper, the Nauvoo Expositor. He believed that the city charter gave the church leaders power to declare the newspaper a nuisance. Shortly afterwards, the press and type were carried into the street and destroyed. Phelps was summoned to be tried for treason with Joseph Smith at Carthage, Illinois.

During the Mormon Succession Crisis in 1844, Phelps sided with Brigham Young and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles. He was again excommunicated on December 9, 1848 for entering into an unauthorized polygamous marriage, but was rebaptized two days later.[citation needed] He took part in the Mormon Exodus across the Great Plains and settled in Salt Lake City in 1849. He served a mission in southern Utah Territory (as counselor to Parley P. Pratt) from November 1849 to February 1850. There he served in the Utah territorial legislature and on the board of regents for the University of Deseret (now the University of Utah). Phelps died on March 7, 1872 in Salt Lake City, Utah Territory. He was buried at Salt Lake City Cemetery.



Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W._W._Phelps_(Mormon)


156 posted on 11/30/2011 5:14:22 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie
 
 

OR...

 

 
 
 
(Just WHO copied from WHOM?)
 
Click on either to go to their respective websites

157 posted on 11/30/2011 5:40:24 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

I wonder if Fred Phelps is a descendant of William W. Phelps?


158 posted on 11/30/2011 8:21:00 AM PST by dragonblustar (Allah Ain't So Akbar!)
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To: Elsie

Voice of the Martyrs sounds cool but Mormon Voices sounds like they’re schizophrenic.


159 posted on 11/30/2011 8:23:14 AM PST by dragonblustar (Allah Ain't So Akbar!)
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To: dragonblustar

On my way home one day, I stopped to watch a Little League base ball game that was being played in a park near my home. As I sat down behind the bench on the first-base line, I asked one of the boys what the score was.

‘We’re behind 14 to nothing!’ he answered with a smile.

‘Really,’ I said. ‘I have to say you don’t look very discouraged.’

‘Discouraged?’, the boy asked with a puzzled look on his face...

‘Why should we be discouraged? We haven’t been up to bat yet.’


160 posted on 11/30/2011 8:55:24 AM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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