Posted on 10/19/2011 5:25:28 AM PDT by Colofornian
With Mitt Romney campaigning...his Mormon religion is coming under increasing scrutiny.
SNIP
Now Mark Driscoll, pastor of the high-profile Seattle-based Mars Hill Church, has added his voice to the fray -- agreeing that Christians should consider Mormons as members of a "cult" and not "brothers and sisters in a common faith."
Writing on his website Tuesday, Driscoll goes on at length about the various definitions of a cult. He is careful to say that Mormonism has "outgrown" the popular culture and sociological definitions of a cult because of its enormous growth and general acceptance in the nation.
But, Driscoll writes, Mormonism "is most certainly a cult theologically speaking because it deviates substantially from historic Orthodox Christian belief about essential issues related to God, humanity, and salvation." And it's not just that it differs, he says, but also that "it claims Christianity while subtly subverting it in both practice and theology."
"Because it claims to be Christian, uses Christian language, but is antithetical Christianity, it must be labeled a cult theologically," Driscoll writes.
He concludes:
"So what do we make of all this? Simply said, by the theological definition, Mormonism is a cult."
"As the presidential race heats up and the prospect of a practicing Mormon as a viable Republican candidate becomes more a reality, there will be continued effort to bring Mormonism into the center of Christian orthodoxy..."
"...we cannot go so far as to call them brothers and sisters in a common faith. To do so is to not only confuse real Christians, but to also diminish the importance of lovingly speaking with Mormons about the errors of their belief in hopes of seeing them come to know the real God of the Bible and avoiding eternal damnation for worshiping a false god."
(Excerpt) Read more at seattletimes.nwsource.com ...
No you have not.
I take care of a friend who is Mormon and whose grandparents walked with Brigham Young.
I have wanted to take her temple in Oakland and San Diego.
No can do. I ain’t a Mormon.
You may have been invited to a stake or ward but never to a temple.
Great point.
It's rather disappointing to see conservatives like Bill Bennett jump on the PC wagon and condemn a pastor and by association Perry for answering a question from a lib reporter. I suppose Bennett and all the other PC conservatives will condemn Pastor Driscoll now. They might want to pick up a Bible first.
LOL, perhaps you SHOULD pay more attention to doctrine morgana - it is a scriptural mandate.
Why else would the bible warn about false prophets and teachers preaching a false Christ - those apostles would be foolish in your expressed view.
Mormon leaders THEMSELVES are on record as saying that the Jesus THEY recognize as mormons is different from the Jesus of Christianity. Ponder that for a minute.
Is Jesus the Second Person of the Trinity - or just one of a plethora of gods and godesses? Yep - who Jesus is IS important and not just a name.
Including Mormon parents who were unable to attend their child's wedding in the temple because the parents did not have their temple recommends.
pharisees and sadducees?
LOL
The main gripe with LDS is their claim that all of us are apostates and whores of Babylon.
They have griped about Christianity for 150 years and now all of the sudden, so they can mainstream their religion, they are now Christian?
Notice, they “are Christian”. Never “I am a Christian too” or “I am a Christian like you”.
They always use the term in its objectified and exclusionary form “I am Christian” (you are not).
Now, it would be just so great of LDS would go through a reformation and become part of the larger body of Christ but they can’t. Otherwise there is no restored church and LDS becomes irrelevant or diluted.
When they stop running the rest of us into the ground I’ll get over it.
Until then, I don’t believe they are the one true church, they have ordinances and keys(giving them some kind of power I have yet to observe), their rites, rituals and handshakes are absolutely Masonic(I am a Mason), They believe in direct contradiction to God that well... they can become a god and since God is a jealouse, never sees another beside him, etc. I just don’t see how that kind of thinking is going to work out well.
At least Pharaoh figured it out after taking it on the chin a few times.
That was a horrible story and I feel very sorry for her and her son.
Too bad you weren't there when Jesus gave the Sermon on the Mount, you could have corrected him on the spot.
"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?' And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.' Matthew 7:21-23
You know the Muslims "believe" in the prophet Isa -- otherwise known as Jesus. He is mentioned more than once in the Quran. Muslims also believe in the virgin Mary -- also mentioned in the Quran.
(Of course, the Muslims don't regard Isa as the "Son of God" -- just as a great prophet).
So...tell you what...next time you meet some Muslims...just ask them if they think Jesus was a holy man, a prophet, and if they believe in his virgin birth. (They'll say, "Yes")...
Then, you, too can be content with that...no matter how many of their followers express "Jihad."
Oh, and if anybody you encounter actually has the gall to object to Islamic Jihad...just preach @ 'em like you've done here...Just tell them:
"If you all want to be like the pharisees and sadducees and argue law then fine. It just makes you bitter in my opinion. There is more to life and religion than arguing like pharisees and sadducees. There is the faith of the person."
And then you can just go on your merry little Pollyannish way...just taking all these spiritual realities @ purely face value...
FWIW, the word "cult" should probably be avoided when describing the Mormon Religion. The word has connotations that may have applied to the Mormon Religion 100 years ago, but would not apply now. When you use the word "cult" you invoke images of Jim Jones or the Manson Family.
I would think we should develop a new description. I would suggest something along the lines of "Quasi-Christian Sect" or Pseudo-Christian Sect. Then when people ask whether the Mormons are "Christians" you can politely say that you believe they as a people may have many "Christian" virtues but they are doctrinally a "Quasi-Christian Sect" and not a part of Historic Christianity.
That might give these peoliticians a less politically incorrect method of giving a direct answer to such a question.
Quasi-Christian sect would work for politicians. I agree.
The truth is for me, however, that they are an entirely new religion.
Any group that believes Jesus Christ is the half brother of Satan, that their god evolved from a man on the planet Kobol, and that we will evolve into gods and have planets to rule should not have Christian associated with their description. I don't see anything Christian in them. They are mormon.
Doesn't work P-M. Other clearly non-Christian religions have some similar "christian" virtues as well - yet clearly we cannot call a buddist a "quasi-christian".
Some times I rather be right than politically correct. It is a cult. One should never try to white-wash that fact.
Well, when you put it that way....
Maybe that should be the talking points when candidates are asked about whether or not Romney is a Christian.
That might change the focus of the discussion.
That might put Romney on the defensive.
I predict, however, that if Romney is the nominee, the whole dark skin curse crap that permeates the book of Mormon and Mormon history will rise up and swallow Romney whole. Romney would never survive those revelations if he is running against a black man.
Good post, Vendome.
Okay, okay I know I come on strong sometimes but I get a little cranked up when someone claims to be a Christian and denys the Trinity.
Maybe that should be the talking points when candidates are asked about whether or not Romney is a Christian.
It doesn't help when conservative Christians fall over themselves in a rush to condemn anyone who points out that mormonism is not Christian. We've seen some of it on FR threads.
I predict, however, that if Romney is the nominee, the whole dark skin curse crap that permeates the book of Mormon and Mormon history will rise up and swallow Romney whole. Romney would never survive those revelations if he is running against a black man.
You were the first to point this out to me and I think you are spot on. It will be the lib media that does the dirty work. They will ask Romney if he holds to these beliefs or if he repudiates mormonism. Romney won't repudiate mormonism so he will talk about how his church has changed. However, the damage will be done.
asked some Mormon missionaries if they believed in Jesus and they answered “yes”. I asked if they believed he was born of the Virgin Mary and they said “yes”.
_____________________________________________
Any Moslem could have told you the same thing...
You only asked the safe questoions
next time ask the questions that require a full explanation...
Other than a “Yes” that could mean anything
and something different to you than it does to them...
“Do you believe in (the mormon) jesus?”
“Yes”
of course they believe in the mormon jesus who was a man who earned hois way to godhood just like his father, grandfather, great grand father infinitum did
His father lives on the planet Kolob with his many wives and children and is a polygamist just like his son, the mormon jesus..
“Was he born of the Virgin Mary”
“Yes”
The mormon jesus was a product of the mormon god who came down to Earth from Kolob and had physical sex with the Virgin Mary who because she had sex with NO MAN but a god (though a man-turned-god he was still a god according to the mormon mindset and noit a man)So Mary got to stay a virgin...
The early Mormons poopooed the idea that Mary got pregnant without any sex act involved...
So they said their mormon jesus was concieved the same way they had been...
Especially since such blasphemy upset Catholics and Protestants alike..
The Mormons hated Christianity and made up any heresy theyh could think of to spit in the eyes ofg the God of the Christian Bible...
Their doctrines contain all Ten Commandments but broken...
For “Thou shalt not commit adultry” Exodus 20:14 the Mormons said only men who practice the “new and everlasting covenant” (polygamy) get to be gods...
and so on...
See ???
For the most part, you’re probably right.
However, I found this on one of the boards I frequent...
“It’s hard to believe after 19 yrs of marriage, it is over.
What’s really sad is, my ex husband, did not want to do this. He told me he didn’t want to do it, but felt like he had to do it. The pressure from church leaders, friends and family was just too great.”
A family torn apart by mormon “leaders” and family because the wife left mormonism.
I would venture to say there are still pockets out there that behave in an extremely cultish manner.
Dude! I am not a Mormon, so I don’t care about their doctrine! When their missionaries come to my door, and they do, I just tell them “I am happy and content in my faith” and leave it at that.
It is a free country (I still hope) and if they want to follow the Book of Mormon, which I have read and don’t agree with that is their right. As long as they don’t try to force me to believe or worship their way I don’t care what their doctrine is.
TN
It’s a free country (I really hope) As long as they don’t force me to believe this, I could not care less.
Freedom of religion means that you have the right to be a weirdo. Just so long as you are not forcing your weirdo beliefs on everyone else.
The Jesus that you believe in, would he be the half brother of Satan and the literal physical offspring of God the Father and Mary?
The God that you believe in, would that be a god who was once a man on another earth who was later exalted to the position of God by a council of the gods on the planet Kolob?
And by by being born of the Virgin Mary, would that include a god who came down from heaven and had sexual relations with the Virgin Mary and that Jesus was conceived from that relationship?
Or would you not agree that anyone who believed that nonsense was NOT a Christian?
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