Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

The Companionship of the Holy Ghost - Mormon
LDS.org ^ | August 1988 | Carlos E. Asay

Posted on 07/25/2011 10:34:37 AM PDT by greyfoxx39

The Companionship of the Holy Ghost

By Elder Carlos E. Asay

Of the First Quorum of the Seventy

For many unmarried Latter-day Saints, particularly some of the single sisters, courtship and eternal companionship are unrealized dreams. You long for them, you know eternal companionship is a crucial part of the gospel, and yet you feel frustrated because no worthy partner is available.

It is tempting to wish that I could match you with perfect companions in an instant and send you off for the eternities in joyful marriages. But such a solution would be satanic. Satan, you will remember, wanted to dictate the courses of our lives, doing away with our testing and choosing, thus frustrating our Father’s plan and stopping our progress.

Your courtship with a mortal companion is not something you can dictate or plan by yourself. But there is a companionship of great and eternal significance over which you do have full and complete control. It is a companionship that can be obtained and enjoyed by all, regardless of age or sex. It is a companionship that heals loneliness, motivates to excellence, and gives meaning to life. It is the companionship of one of the members of the Godhead—the Holy Ghost, the Holy Spirit, the Comforter, the Revelator, the Sanctifier, the Spirit of the Lord. It is a companionship which will assure you that you’re not alone, and will never be alone.

Mortal companionships—one person with another—are important and essential, and if they are cemented by love and mutual respect, they can become heavenly in nature and bring unspeakable joy. Any such companionship, however, becomes vacant and somewhat meaningless without the influence of the Holy Ghost. No mortal companionship ever overshadowed or surpassed in importance the binding of a person to the Spirit of the Lord.

“Prayed for That Which They Most Desired”

It is significant that while Christ taught and prayed with the Nephites, “they did pray for that which they most desired; and they desired that the Holy Ghost should be given unto them.” (3 Ne. 19:9.) As Church members, we have completed the necessary steps of faith, repentance, and baptism and have had authorized hands placed on our heads to receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. But just as love between friends or companions must be cultivated and nourished like a tender plant, so likewise must a companionship with the Holy Spirit be cultivated.

When I was a young man I fell in love with a beautiful girl. More than anything in the world, I wanted to receive her love and eternal companionship. I therefore behaved my best, spoke my best, and gave my best as I courted her and sought to gain her favor. Even after she was promised to me, I recognized the need to continue the courting. My desire was, and still is, to please her and to avoid any offense. She is my inspiration, my motivation to live on a high and noble level.

The companionship of the Holy Ghost is cultivated in much the same manner. To obtain his influence and companionship, we must be our best; we must be worthy of his presence. I see five things we must do to attract and retain the Holy Spirit.

1. We must keep our bodies clean.

We must not pollute our mortal tabernacles in any way. We must live the Word of Wisdom; we must not misuse our powers of procreation; we must do whatever is possible to avoid disease or other enemies of our physical bodies. “Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.” (1 Cor. 3:16–17.)

2. We must keep our minds clean.

We must guard against all suggestive and carnal notions and other satanic influences. From the Doctrine and Covenants, we receive this advice and promise: “Let virtue garnish thy thoughts unceasingly; then shall thy confidence wax strong in the presence of God; and the doctrine of the priesthood shall distil upon thy soul as the dews from heaven. The Holy Ghost shall be thy constant companion.” (D&C 121:45–46.)

Few things are more repulsive than evil minds and the filth they produce. Can one hope to enjoy the companionship of the Holy Spirit when one is double-minded—that, when his mind shares time with the evil one? I think not.

3. We must exercise faith and reserve a place in our hearts for the Holy Spirit.

Manifestations of the Spirit of God, we are told, are forfeited in the absence of faith. Moroni spoke openly of the gifts of the Spirit, including healing and tongues, then cautioned: “All these gifts of which I have spoken, which are spiritual, never will be done away, even as long as the world shall stand, only according to the unbelief of the children of men.” (Moro. 10:19.)

It is most important that we understand “that the Holy Ghost may have place in [our] hearts” only when we exercise faith in Christ. (Moro. 7:32.) How can we be acceptable to the Holy Ghost without recognizing and acknowledging those whom he represents—those of whom he testifies and bears witness? Loving and seeking the Christlike life is true worship—the kind of worship that opens our lives to the power of the Holy Ghost.

4. We must avoid all iniquity, all manner of wickedness.

As stated previously, gifts of the Lord cease when faith is missing. The same applies, and the problem is compounded, when iniquity is present.

Alma said, “No unclean thing can inherit the kingdom of heaven.” (Alma 11:37.) Similarly, no unclean person can achieve a lasting relationship with the Spirit of God.

5. We must pray, feast upon the words of Christ, and walk uprightly before God.

The Spirit of the Lord teaches and entices a man to pray. (See 2 Ne. 32:8–9.) The words of Christ help us to understand who the Holy Spirit is and how he may be invited into our presence. (See 2 Ne. 32:1–3.) The Spirit of God persuades men to do good and to believe in Christ. (See Ether 4:11–12; Moro. 7:16–17.) So prayer, scripture study, and righteous living are musts.

The skeptic or gospel novice might inquire: “Why seek the Holy Ghost? Why strive for his companionship? What is in it for me?” Answers to these questions are abundant if we are receptive to the testimonies of those who know and have associated with the Spirit of the Lord. Some of these testimonies help to answer questions about the value of association with the Holy Ghost.

Would you like to possess perfect foresight, perfected powers to anticipate what to do under certain circumstances? If so, you must do as Nephi directed: “Enter in by the way, and receive the Holy Ghost, [for] it will show unto you all things what ye should do.” (2 Ne. 32:5.)

“Would You Like the Power of Discernment?”

Would you like to have powers of discernment—the power to identify truth? If so, you must read the word of God, acknowledge God’s Goodness, ponder, and ask of God. Through doing this, Moroni testifies, “By the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things.” (Moro. 10:5.)

While I was a mission president in Texas, I was informed that a particular missionary had lost his testimony and wanted to go home. Some checking disclosed that doubts of the divinity of his call had been planted in the young man’s mind by an investigator. In an interview with the so-called investigator, I experienced special powers of discernment that enabled me to know that the man was a minister of another faith, posing as a college student and pretending to be an honest investigator of Mormonism. Confronted with the knowledge that had been revealed to me, he became confused and admitted his fraud. With the deceiver out of the way and the truth known, the missionary stayed and completed an honorable mission.

On one occasion, a missionary in the final week of his mission reminded me that I had given him clearance two years previously to serve a mission. The clearance had been extended with some reservations on my part because he had indulged in a number of transgressions before his mission. He said: “Elder Asay, you allowed me to go into the field after due repentance and after I promised that I would be strictly obedient and would work diligently. I can assure you that I have worked hard and have obeyed every rule.” Then he said something very significant. “I feel that my sins have been forgiven. I feel perfectly clean.” He had been cleansed through selfless service and by developing a close association with the Holy Spirit. He had been through the refiner’s fire, and impurities had been burned away.

“Would You Like to Hear Revelations from God?”

Would you like to have the power to hear, feel, and know the revelations of God? Through the Prophet Joseph Smith, the Lord promised, “I will tell you in your mind and in your heart, by the Holy Ghost. … This is the spirit of revelation.” (D&C 8:2–3.)

I have heard President Marion G. Romney, at the conclusion of his testimony in a temple meeting, say something like this: “You may not have needed to hear what I have said today and you probably didn’t learn anything new. However, I learned something while speaking and I needed to hear these words.” This is a beautiful and open acknowledgment of the influence of the Holy Spirit.

Would you like to enjoy spiritual gifts—powers to heal, be healed, speak in tongues, for example? If so, give heed to the prophet Moroni’s words: “And all these gifts come by the Spirit of Christ; and they come unto every man severally, according as he will.” (Moro. 10:17.)

Would you like convincing powers of speech—the power to speak like an angel? If so, note Nephi’s question, “Do ye not remember that I said unto you that after ye had received the Holy Ghost ye could speak with the tongue of angels?” (2 Ne. 32:2.)

Thirty years ago, while I served as a missionary in the Near East, my companion and I were assigned to visit a branch that had been torn apart by division and apostasy. We approached our assignment humbly and prayerfully. A crucial meeting was held involving the disaffected parties. My companion was selected to preach the sermon that we hoped would bring everyone together again. After we had fasted and prayed earnestly, he stood with confidence and worked the miracle. He spoke with the tongue of an angel. That young, inexperienced elder’s words healed wounds festering in the hearts of men much older than he, prompted confessions, and literally saved a branch of the Church.

“Would You Like the Power to Resist Temptation?”

Would you like the power to ward off and resist temptation? If so, do as Alma and Paul suggested: “Pray continually, … and thus be led by the Holy Spirit.” (Alma 13:28.)

Would you like to obtain perfect peace and assurance in all that you do? If so, make the Holy Ghost your companion and you, too, may receive the type of assurance given Nephi and Lehi: “Peace, peace be unto you, because of your faith in my Well Beloved, who was from the foundation of the world.” (Hel. 5:47.)

Finally, would you like the power to perform beyond your natural abilities? Would you like the help of unseen powers in all that you do? I refer to the power to speak with convincing authority—even the power to receive promptings that enable you to say things that you had not planned. I speak of the power to receive impressions, which, if heeded, bring blessings to you and others.

Mortal men and women are endowed with marvelous abilities and potential. But however great these mortal powers may be, they are only a shadow of those powers that can be claimed through a linkage with the Holy Spirit.

I hope you do not say to yourself that these words about a companionship with the Spirit are for someone else, not you. God is no respecter of persons. His blessings and gifts are not reserved for a precious few. It matters not whether you are an Apostle or a deacon, a Relief Society officer or a Primary teacher. All of us have the promise of gifts of the Spirit if we place ourselves in a position to claim them.

If your introduction to this divine companion seems incomplete, review your baptism and confirmation and determine whether you have really received him as you were commanded to do. Pay careful attention to your physical cleanliness, the cleanliness of your thoughts, the extent of your faith in Christ, your inclination to avoid all manner of sin, and your prayer and study habits.

It is wise from time to time to do some reflective thinking and determine whether you really know the Holy Ghost. Pause long enough to measure your acquaintance with spiritual gifts and powers. See whether foresight, discernment, sanctification, revelation, spiritual gifts, angelic speech, peace of assurance, and attendant blessings are evident in your life. Determine whether spiritual experiences are sprinkled generously throughout your daily living. And, if you find yourself wanting, have the courage to change and place your life in order.

If you will do these things, you need never be alone, for you will have the most important companion of all—the Holy Ghost.



TOPICS: General Discusssion; Other non-Christian; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: antichristian; antimormonfatwa; antimormonhatred; antimormonjihad; antimormonrant; beck; bitterformermormon; glennbeck; inman; mormoaner; mormon; religiousbigotry; romney; zealot
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 161-180181-200201-220 ... 461-474 next last
To: greyfoxx39
May we soon become worthy to receive the remainder of the records of Your Mesoamerican ministry!

I suspect that some people we both know are worthy. And here's the guy to facilitate that transfer:


181 posted on 07/27/2011 5:41:34 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 180 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell

“In Matthew 15:24 we have Jesus teaching: “I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” So I was true to the New Testament when I interpreted the “other sheep” of John 10:16 as predicting a future appearance to decendants of the house of Israel.”

Actually, you were wrong on the New Testament when you identified “lost sheep” as lost tribes.
You were correct, however, on representing the heresy of mormonism.

That would be, what, half a gold star?


182 posted on 07/27/2011 6:11:15 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (This message carfully checkd to misteakes by powerful softwhere)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 179 | View Replies]

To: ejonesie22
I don't even get it. I mean LDS and derivatives is enough but to believe in the BOM and NOT be Mormon. If the BOM is true, then Smith is a prophet and he was clear theirs was the only way... So how does that work...

I am a member of the Community of Christ, which prior to 2001 was the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. The RLDS had a lonely struggle over many decades trying to educate the general public as to how the Utah Mormon church had departed from the original beliefs of the church founded by Joseph Smith Jr.

Beginning in 1860, Joseph Smith III was the president of the RLDS. There is high drama in his memoirs, such as his first visit to Utah, when Brigham Young tried to keep his followers from listening to the son of the founding prophet.

Joseph Smith III and other RLDS ministers had to spend major portions of their preaching trying to expose Mormon apostacy, such as the then current doctrine of plural wives. Meanwhile, the RLDS made use of the doctrine of common consent to clarify which communications had scriptural status and which did not. Unless a general conference had officially confirmed a writing as scriptural, it was not accepted to be so. Thus, the RLDS never accepted "The Book of Abraham" as scripture, never practised baptism for the dead (finally stripping its documents of any scriptural authority in 1970), and has never allowed secret temple rites to be practised in its two temples, the Kirtland, Ohio Temple (gaining property rights to it due to a civil court ruling that the Utah Mormon church had departed from the original doctrines of the church), and The Temple in Independence, Missouri. Unlike Mormon temples, both Community of Christ temples are open to the general public.

Joseph Smith III was critical of many of his father's activities during the Nauvoo, Illinois period of church history, when Joseph Smith Jr. was producing "The Book of Abraham" and the false doctrine of baptism for the dead.

Concerning the rise of polygamy, Joseph Smith III wanted to know the truth no matter how ugly it might be. In a key interview with his mother, the former Emma Smith, it was established for the RLDS church that Joseph Smith, Jr. did not have plural wives, not physically nor spiritually.

The motives for branding the founding prophet with that practise were obvious. Enemies of the church jumped at anything that would suggest it, and even recruited persons to testify of it. Polygamists in the Mormon church made up things about the Joseph Smith Jr. to protect their own polygamy, even faking a "revelation" from Joseph Smith, Jr. supporting their practise, removing the 1835 statement on monogamous marriage from their Doctrine and Covenants, and recruiting persons to lie about Joseph Smith Jr.

Elsie, Colofornia, and other Mormon-haters love to quote "dcumentation" of Joseph Smith Jr.'s plural marriages, which are of course taken from statements recruited by enemies of the church and by polygamists in the church seeking to justify their scarlet sins. Thus, Elsie and Colofornia merely dredge up lies of the past and present them as if they were true.

When Utah became a Territory of the United States and was moving towards statehood, polygamy had to be outlawed, several Mormon church leaders were arrested, and the Mormon church president had to issue an official statement that the church would no longer practise polygamy.

In the Book of Mormon, in the Book of Jacob, is a vigorous denunciation of polygamy, which had begun to creep into Nephite life. The polygamous Mormons got around this denunciation by claiming that the Book of Mormon, though containing the fullness of the gospel, was a "lower law". The "higher law" was the polygamy that they would later be forced to abandon.

Something amazing happened when Martin Harris, one of the three witnesses of the Book of Mormon, moved to polgamous Utah. In his final years on Earth he testified of the truth of the Book of Mormon with such sincerity and enthusiam that this one man began to convert the Mormon church to the Book of Mormon. The result of that conversion was that while the RLDS was rather weak in promoting the Book of Mormon, the Mormon church began publishing it with vigor, translating it into many languages for worldwide influence. So the rather small and publicly embarrassed Mormon church began to prosper and became the major denomination of Latter Day Saints.

Although the Mormon church continued with some of its false teachings, baptism for the dead, secret temple rites, etc., its promotion of the Book of Mormon helped that church become readily understandable and popular. Although the Community of Christ has been more doctrinally sound, its leaders cozied up to scholarship highly critical of the Book of Mormon, while its remaining Book of Mormon enthusiasts were given no official church support.

One of these enthusiasts, Neil Steede, while doing archaeological research in Mesoamerica, met one of the three immortal Nephites on the original Hill Cumorah in Mexico. Steede has remained a member of the Community of Christ, while continuing to lead The Hill Cumorah Expedition Team in anticipation of the Nephite records being discovered (which would be a major shock to Community of Christ leaders, who regard the Book of Mormon as a source of stories to refer to only, not as the historical document that it is).

There is much drama concerning the Book of Mormon yet to unfold. The progress of Mesoamaerican archaeology, at first way off from what is presented in the Book of Mormon, has steadily been moving in the direction of the pattern of civilations described in the Book of Mormon. The high population and advanced cultures required by the Book of Mormon are now being confirmed by archaeological discoveries.

The Mayan glyphs are gradually becoming accessible to translation. One shocker came when a stele giving the name of Palenque was at first translated "Bountiful", the name in the Book of Mormon of the city where Jesus Christ appeared to His "other sheep" in America. Perhaps that prompted someone to retranslate it as "Abundant", lest it give support to the historicity of the Book of Mormon.

183 posted on 07/27/2011 6:46:19 PM PDT by John McDonnell
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell
I was merely stating what is obvious from the New Testament itself.


TRUTH IGNORED!

Smith,
Young,
Taylor,
Pratt,
Snow,
Kimball,
Woodruff ...


1 Timothy 3:2-3
2. Now the overseer must be above reproach, the husband of but one wife, temperate, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach,
3. not given to drunkenness, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money.
 
1 Timothy 3:12
A deacon must be the husband of but one wife and must manage his children and his household well.
 
Titus 1:6
An elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient.




BEHOLD!!!! The Restorative Power of the Book of Mormon!!



THE BOOK OF JACOB
THE BROTHER OF NEPHI
CHAPTER 2
24 Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord.
25 Wherefore, thus saith the Lord, I have led this people forth out of the land of Jerusalem, by the power of mine arm, that I might raise up unto me a righteous branch from the fruit of the loins of Joseph.
26 Wherefore, I the Lord God will not suffer that this people shall do like unto them of old.
27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;
28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.
29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.
30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.
31 For behold, I, the Lord, have seen the sorrow, and heard the mourning of the daughters of my people in the land of Jerusalem, yea, and in all the lands of my people, because of the wickedness and abominations of their husbands.
32 And I will not suffer, saith the Lord of Hosts, that the cries of the fair daughters of this people, which I have led out of the land of Jerusalem, shall come up unto me against the men of my people, saith the Lord of Hosts.

184 posted on 07/27/2011 7:05:53 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 179 | View Replies]

To: greyfoxx39

185 posted on 07/27/2011 7:06:47 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 180 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell
The RLDS had a lonely struggle over many decades trying to educate the general public as to how the Utah Mormon church had departed from the original beliefs of the church founded by Joseph Smith Jr.

I would GUESS that it was lonely; hiding in caves and deep woods to keep from being EXTERMINATED!!!!

186 posted on 07/27/2011 7:08:46 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell
At least that is the story that the FEARFULL SLC branch likes to spout.

Of course; history SHOWS that the MORMONs who remained in the midwest were NOT killed, boiled alive, children stolen or emasculated by those MURDEROUS Gentiles that were alledgedly out for BLOOD!

They became quite properous and were able to build their kingdom quite nicely.

187 posted on 07/27/2011 7:12:11 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell
They became quite properous and were able to build their kingdom quite nicely.

And; they have the COPYRIGHT for the Joseph Smith Translation.

THAT's why SLC doesn't consider it to be 'scripture'; even after GOD had instructed JS to do it!

One more nail in the coffin of MORMONism: NOT declaring the JST to be SCRIPTURE.

188 posted on 07/27/2011 7:14:07 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell
The Mayan glyphs are gradually becoming accessible to translation.

GRADUALLY?

http://www.omniglot.com/writing/mayan.htm

189 posted on 07/27/2011 7:16:59 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell
The polygamous Mormons got around this denunciation by claiming that the Book of Mormon, though containing the fullness of the gospel, was a "lower law".

Oh it does NOT!

Prove me wrong!

190 posted on 07/27/2011 7:18:23 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell; Colofornian
The Book of Mormon records less than a hundredth part of His Mesoamerican ministry, but those passages contain some unfragmented glimpses of a ministry that even in words only are stunningly beautiful.

Has your 'prophet' officially made mesoamerica doctrine - or is that just your opinion. Many of your mormon brothers name many other places instead of mesoamerica John.

Either case has no support what so ever. Please, show us the mayan writings that mention a metallurgically advanced peoples in the millions upon millions, conducting massive genocidal wars. Please show us the metal swords, chariots, elephants, horses, smelters, etc that document their presence. Where is the DNA support John?

No John, Jesus was not talking about mesoamerica, not in the slightest.

191 posted on 07/27/2011 7:30:13 PM PDT by Godzilla (3-7-77)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 179 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell

satan lied to Eve - you to can be god
satan lied to Joseph Smith - you to can be god
Joseph Smith lied to everyone - you to can be god
Joseph Smith is a liar


192 posted on 07/27/2011 7:59:54 PM PDT by svcw (democrats are liars, it's a given)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 179 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell; Elsie

What set her off must have been my phrase “the days of my probation”, which, as anyone who has calmly read the Book of Mormon knows, is in full harmony with Book of Mormon teachings.\

- - - - -
But it isn’t in harmony with the Bible.


193 posted on 07/27/2011 8:01:35 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian - "I once was lost, but now am found; was blind but now I see")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 162 | View Replies]

To: ejonesie22; Godzilla; John McDonnell

Most of the non-SLC restoration groups either believe that ‘the Church’ was pure until the battle of succession and that Young ‘stole’ the ‘church’ from the rightful successor (6 were vying for it IIRC), that Smith was a prophet but became a ‘fallen’ prophet about the time of polygamy or that Smith was only called to translated the Book of Mormon and nothing else.

Since there are over 100 ‘restoration’ groups that trace back to Smith, various ones have their own view of it, depending on the circumstances of their formation.

John, you are COC (RLDS) right? Or are you part of one of the smaller groups?


194 posted on 07/27/2011 8:07:59 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian - "I once was lost, but now am found; was blind but now I see")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell; ejonesie22; Godzilla

The progress of Mesoamaerican archaeology, at first way off from what is presented in the Book of Mormon, has steadily been moving in the direction of the pattern of civilations described in the Book of Mormon. The high population and advanced cultures required by the Book of Mormon are now being confirmed by archaeological discoveries.

- - - - - -
ABSOLUTE HOGWASH!!! I used to be president of the largest chapter of AIA in the US. I know several Meso-American Archeologists (SCHOLARS) and NOT A SINGLE ONE says there is any support for the BOM.

NO NON-BOM believing archeologist of ANY type supports anything that is claimed as support for the BOM, and if you present them with any of the ‘so called’ evidence put forth by LDS scholars they will laugh in your face.

Book of Mormon archeology is classified as ‘pseudo-archeology’ right up there with alien archeology and Atlantis.


195 posted on 07/27/2011 8:17:24 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian - "I once was lost, but now am found; was blind but now I see")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: Godzilla
No John, Jesus was not talking about mesoamerica, not in the slightest.

You tell me that without any authority for it other than your desire that it was not so. My authority for telling you that Jesus visited His "other sheep" in Mesoamerica are John 10:16, that had to be fulfilled somewhere, the Book of Mormon, which revealed that it was somewhere in the New World, and the findings of archaeology, which show that the only place in the New World where it could have been, considering the large population and advanced cilivization requirements of the Book of Mormon account, was Mesoamerica. There is also the witness of Neil Steede concerning the location of Hill Cumorah in Mexico, where numerous stone and obsidion weapons have been found with traces of blood embedded in them.

http://www.hillcumorahexpeditionteam.com/April12Newst05.html

That is at least greater evidence than your paltry wishing that it was not so.

196 posted on 07/27/2011 8:33:37 PM PDT by John McDonnell
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 191 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell; ejonesie22
The RLDS had a lonely struggle over many decades trying to educate the general public as to how the Utah Mormon church had departed from the original beliefs of the church founded by Joseph Smith Jr.

Does that include becoming a god John.

Joseph Smith III and other RLDS ministers had to spend major portions of their preaching trying to expose Mormon apostacy, such as the then current doctrine of plural wives.

A practice that is well documented that the elder Joseph Smith started and participated actively in.

Thus, the RLDS never accepted "The Book of Abraham" as scripture,. .

So your proxy prophet is indeed a false prophet.

In a key interview with his mother, the former Emma Smith, it was established for the RLDS church that Joseph Smith, Jr. did not have plural wives, not physically nor spiritually.

Emma lied to spare her children a degree of pain. What say rlds? -

Jason Briggs one of the founders of the “New Organization” (later known as the RLDS Church), said, “I was at Nauvoo in 1843, the year it was found necessary to legalize polygamy by a revelation….I have no doubt as to the authorship of the revelation of July 12, 1843. It has all the earmarks to identify it as the production of the mouthpiece of those days [Joseph Smith].

This comes from the COC website
http://www.cofchrist.org/ourfaith/faq.asp
Joseph Smith III, son of the founding prophet and first prophet-president of the RLDS Church (1860–1914), spent much of his life trying to clear his father’s name from the stigma of polygamy and polygamous doctrine,even though there were leaders in the early RLDS Church who believed otherwise.

The very first edition of The Truth Latter Day Saints’ Herald (the official RLDS Church publication) said that it was because of polygamy that Joseph Smith had ‘fallen’, and that he had been killed by the LORD.

Elsie, Colofornia, and other Mormon-haters love to quote "dcumentation" of Joseph Smith Jr.'s plural marriages, which are of course taken from statements recruited by enemies of the church and by polygamists in the church seeking to justify their scarlet sins. Thus, Elsie and Colofornia merely dredge up lies of the past and present them as if they were true.

Ah, the dreaded lies of the past - except that even the white shirted slc lds accept smith's polygamy. Testimonies (you guys are big into testimonies aren't you?) of those wives, discussions of church leaders of the time and other practitioners of polygamy amount to an substantial pile of truth that your petty 'recruited' statements, etc, fails to address. Reboot and try again John.

When Utah became a Territory of the United States and was moving towards statehood, polygamy had to be outlawed, . .

It was already illegal from its beginnings with smith. later laws were enacted to force the utah mormons to cease the practice and to submit to existing law.

One of these enthusiasts, Neil Steede, while doing archaeological research in Mesoamerica, met one of the three immortal Nephites on the original Hill Cumorah in Mexico.

Where is the picture? Or rather another faith promoting rumor filed under lying for the lord.

The progress of Mesoamaerican archaeology, at first way off from what is presented in the Book of Mormon, has steadily been moving in the direction of the pattern of civilations described in the Book of Mormon. The high population and advanced cultures required by the Book of Mormon are now being confirmed by archaeological discoveries.

Michael Coe, one of the foremost mesoamerican archaeologists would get a belly laugh from this claim. So where are the smelters and evidence of an advanced metallurgical society John?

One shocker came when a stele giving the name of Palenque was at first translated "Bountiful", the name in the Book of Mormon of the city where Jesus Christ appeared to His "other sheep" in America. Perhaps that prompted someone to retranslate it as "Abundant", lest it give support to the historicity of the Book of Mormon.

No, perhaps had your source been more intellectually honest in this 'translation' they would have found that the context was not referring to a city but "abundant (bountiful) harvest" Sadly, your evidence is nothing more than wishful thinking on the so-called 'researchers' part.

BTW, as recently as 2007 Coe states "We have another part of the world where the archaeology is really very well known now; we know a lot about people like the Maya and their predecessors. . . . . . Nothing can ever come out of it because it's just impossible that this could have happened, because we know what happened to these people. We can read their writings: They're not in reformed Egyptian; they're in Maya. " Archaeological evidence shows that the only people known to have developed written languages in America were the Olmecs and Mayans, whose written languages have no resemblance to Hebrew or Egyptian hieroglyphs. NEVER LET THE FACTS GET IN THE WAY OF A FAITH-PROMOTING STORY!

Wake me when the nephite exhibit opens at the smithsonian.

197 posted on 07/27/2011 8:33:45 PM PDT by Godzilla (3-7-77)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell
Mexico?

I though it was New York...

Or was it the Mid West...

That hill gets around...

John, quoting Mormon Sources to support Mormon fiction and try and make it true is a tick disingenuous at best...

When real Scientist and Archaeologist start referencing the BOM maybe...

As far as authority I state this as one who knows God doesn't play tricks, and I stood in the Holy land. We can find it John. The Nephites, um no...

No desire needed, just eyes and the mind God gave me...

198 posted on 07/27/2011 8:44:35 PM PDT by ejonesie22 (8/30/10, the day Truth won.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 196 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell; ejonesie22

The Mayan glyphs are gradually becoming accessible to translation.

- - - - - -
Not even close. With only a couple of exceptions, Mayan glyphs have been translated since the 1950’s. I even have a textbook from the 1960’s on translating Mayan.

And I’m not even talking about the Landa alphabet from the 16th century.


199 posted on 07/27/2011 8:45:12 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian - "I once was lost, but now am found; was blind but now I see")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: John McDonnell
The progress of Mesoamaerican archaeology, at first way off from what is presented in the Book of Mormon, has steadily been moving in the direction of the pattern of civilations described in the Book of Mormon. The high population and advanced cultures required by the Book of Mormon are now being confirmed by archaeological discoveries.

Any independent non Mormon (or CoC) sources for this statement John?

200 posted on 07/27/2011 8:48:51 PM PDT by ejonesie22 (8/30/10, the day Truth won.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 161-180181-200201-220 ... 461-474 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson