Hello vladimir998
I love your passion. This is a Catholic post and you are convinced the Catholics are the true church and others have strayed. I have no quarrel with your heart felt convictions on that.
The root meaning for “church” is a called out assembly. As for the Christ-made church, she is composed of those Christ has called out to Himself - His body. And believers have affliliated themselves as Catholics (Greek, Roman), Lutherans, Baptists, Methodist, ... and even Presbyterians.
In the Old Testament, God’s people were saved by faith - looking forward to Christ. (Jesus said Abraham saw His day and was glad.) In the first century to the twenty-first, we look back to Christ and are saved by faith in him.
Our doctrine is indeed based on Christ and the Apostles. And as one who takes authority from Holy Scriptures, we all can thank the Catholics for putting it all together for us.
If we all were perfect, we wouldn’t be so divided and quarrel like we do. But in Heaven ... we all with agree and be with Jesus forever.
I Agree
You wrote:
“Hello vladimir998...I love your passion.”
I have not shown any. I am simply dealing with logic.
“This is a Catholic post and you are convinced the Catholics are the true church and others have strayed.”
No. You yourself have essentially confirmed that you yourself believe that the Catholic Church is THE Christian Church. I agree with that assessment. I am just wondering why your logic stops there. If there is logic, there should be follow through. Whether or not someone strayed is essentially immaterial to the main issue.
“I have no quarrel with your heart felt convictions on that.”
I haven’t expressed any heart felt convictions. Again, I am just going by logic and your own statements here.
“The root meaning for “church” is a called out assembly. As for the Christ-made church, she is composed of those Christ has called out to Himself - His body. And believers have affliliated themselves as Catholics (Greek, Roman), Lutherans, Baptists, Methodist, ... and even Presbyterians.”
No. I am not talking about any “church”. I am talking about THE Church. Christ made one. It is not diffused in competing recent sects established by men. The idea you are putting forward is not only not scriptural, but was never heard of until the Protestant Revolution. The Lutheran idea of the “invisible church” was necessary because of Martin Luther’s other heretical ideas. It has no real basis in orthodox theology, or history or scripture. It’s a man-made idea.
“In the Old Testament, God’s people were saved by faith - looking forward to Christ. (Jesus said Abraham saw His day and was glad.) In the first century to the twenty-first, we look back to Christ and are saved by faith in him.”
Faith alone? And where did Jesus say it was only faith that was necessary for salvation? Did he not say that baptism also is part of salvation? Presbyterianism was invented by John Knox. It was not sent by Christ. It, and its doctrines, never existed until the 16th century.
“Our doctrine is indeed based on Christ and the Apostles.”
Not if your doctrine is Protestant. There were no Protestants until after 1517. Protestant doctrines did not exist until the 16th century too. Thus, it is logically impossible that your doctrines are based on Christ or the Apostles if they differ from the Church that came from Christ.
“And as one who takes authority from Holy Scriptures, we all can thank the Catholics for putting it all together for us.”
And that makes no sense. Logically, if you trust the Catholic CHurch as the guardian who assembled scripture why would you not trust its interpretation of scripture? If you can’t trust its interpretation, then how can you trust its canon? Some Protestants, pursuing a more dangerous, but more logical stance than yours, say that the canon is a fallible collection of infallible books. The end result is the same: based on what do you trust it?
If scripture is your authority, then please show me the verse that says the Gospel of Matthew is inspired. Come to think of it, show me the verse that says Matthew wrote a gospel. Can you do that?
“If we all were perfect, we wouldn’t be so divided and quarrel like we do.”
Is Christ perfect? I bet you agree He is. So, would a perfect God leave it up to imperfect man to produce a unified Church? Are we all just quarrelling or is it that someone has truth and others do not? We cannot all be equalling wrong - not if we believe Christ is Who He said He is. Again, logic.
“But in Heaven ... we all with agree and be with Jesus forever.”
We will not all be in heaven. Sad, but true.