Posted on 02/12/2011 6:20:06 PM PST by topcat54
Joel McDurmon, hosting today's show for Gary DeMar, exposes End-times Dysfunction (E.D.) for what it is. Joel shares with doomsdayers how they can get relief from their paranoia and troubled souls.
>> It’s most certainly not in the Bible.<<
It’s code between the Jews and Dispensationalists to keep the Replacementarians in the dark. Duh.
>>Honestly, I can’t tell when you say “return of Christ” whether you are referring to the rapture return of Christ or the Second Coming return of Christ<<
Just think of it like your view on Satan being chained now but still being able to deceive and then when he’s loosed for one day and is able to deceive this time because he’s loosed. That way it might fit better into your thought patterns.
Makes a nice fairy tale, but his every post to this thread has rejected the clearest facts of God’s word in favor of the adversary’s attack on the rapture of the saints.
Perhaps sophisticated in the ways of men, but certainly not in the ways of the word.
“but is always accompanied by good works, which is our sanctification.”
Huh??? Good works is our sanctification?
Never heard that one before.
Sanctification - setting apart for sacred use. It’s a process that a justified believer goes through to become consecrated to God. A dying to self.
Not works.
and that's just random things from books in one box we dug up from the attic. My son is ticked at you for making him dig it out, by the way. I didn't bother with a web search it would keep me here all month.
Christ is long forgotten once the important stuff like who is who and RFID tags and what countries are in the news starts. Even some of the very popular books barely mention him and no matter what you say, it's mostly something other than Christ and Him crucified. More than 95% never mentions Him or His role because, after all the Rapture has come or is coming and it's assumed everyone knows Him so they move on to focus on what the signs are, what the horrible stuff in the tribulation will be like, etc.
have a nice day
bye
my son said he added that blue team thing from a website, I don’t know what it is and asked after I copied the list. I use a brace to hold a pen so he copied what I read and I didn’t know he edited. He also added cloning he said, but I know what cloning is, although I don’t know how it fits in.
Do a web search yourself and look at random pages, you’ll be busy for a month and you’ll be surprised how much doesn’t related to Christ. My son is now collecting links to things he never heard of, so, they’re things not in the Bible or the version of things per Hal Lindsey. He’s heard that.
have a nice day
Do a web search yourself and look at random pages, you’ll be busy for a month and you’ll be surprised how much doesn’t related to Christ.
Not too long ago, months, I listened to a podcast. (It doesn't matter who. A mix of interesting stuff and certifiable raving nutterie. Quix is probably a fan.) The host and guest spent the whole hour talking about a end times prophecy conference they were both going to be at, without once mentioning Christ.
Your ranting becomes less valuable to intelligent debate every time I see you post. Accusing people of not using scripture to substantiate their views is weak and your spiteful vitriol is only worthy of contempt.
Well put.
” you have no intention of ever seeing.” —> why do you say that?
Because Futurists believe that the bulk of The Revelation is really a Day Planner™ for those "Left Behind" - that Pre-trib rapture thing.
Praise eisogesis
The objection would be that in order to believe what you guys believe you have to deny parts of scripture.
Specifically?
Of Sanctification
1. They, who are once effectually called, and regenerated, having a new heart, and a new spirit created in them, are further sanctified, really and personally, through the virtue of Christ's death and resurrection, by his Word and Spirit dwelling in them: the dominion of the whole body of sin is destroyed, and the several lusts thereof are more and more weakened and mortified; and they more and more quickened and strengthened in all saving graces, to the practice of true holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord.Of Good Works
2. These good works, done in obedience to God's commandments, are the fruits and evidences of a true and lively faith: and by them believers manifest their thankfulness, strengthen their assurance, edify their brethren, adorn the profession of the gospel, stop the mouths of the adversaries, and glorify God, whose workmanship they are, created in Christ Jesus thereunto, that, having their fruit unto holiness, they may have the end, eternal life.3. Their ability to do good works is not at all of themselves, but wholly from the Spirit of Christ. And that they may be enabled thereunto, beside the graces they have already received, there is required an actual influence of the same Holy Spirit, to work in them to will, and to do, of his good pleasure: yet are they not hereupon to grow negligent, as if they were not bound to perform any duty unless upon a special motion of the Spirit; but they ought to be diligent in stirring up the grace of God that is in them.
Westminster Confession of Faith
You only demonstrate your ignorance of what is prophesied. The only detail given in the scriptures is in the feasts of Yom Teruah, and Tabernacles. The fact that they are celebrated on different days is a clear indication that there is far more to the “second comming” than your level of understanding can wrap itself around.
Then you must share this gnosticism with us if it is so critical to understanding the series of returns.
First off, has this feast of Tabernacles have any history of being observed by the Christian Church - more pointedly, how did you last observe it? If not, why not? You are correct that the observance is detailed in Scripture (Lev 23:33-44 among others). So what animals on each of the seven days did you slay to make your blood sacrifice to G-d? You see, when this ignorant nave reads vv42-44 I'm told that this was so the children of Israel dwell in booths when I drew them out of the land of Egypt. I'm not as wise as you are as to understand how exactly that talks clearly about a rapture, tribulation and second coming.
Your limitations are no reason for the rest of us (the wise virgins, the vast majority of believers which the deceived call ‘futurists’) to lose faith in the resurrection of the church.
Good, you can be the virgin, we will be the Bride. Have fun on nuptials night, our Bridegroom doesn't fool around with the attendees - we'll be busy.
You are absolutely right. The coming Rosh Hashanah could well be an exiting time.
Are you guys date setting again? After countless predictions gone bad, you're returning to your vomit once more?
Since you are already claiming to know the date, why not double down on it and go for the hour too. Let me help you out:
Matt 25:6-7"And at midnight a cry was heard: 'Behold, the bridegroom is coming; go out to meet him!'
Jerusalem time is UTC+02:00 and Pacific Time is UTC-08:00. Rosh Hashanah falls on September 28th at sundown so midnight would be the 29th. Israel Summer Time ends on the Sunday between Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur (Oct 2) and the U.S. is still on Daylight Savings time so no need to change anything there.
Subtract ten hours and at 2PM (PDT) on September 28th, 2011 have your oil in your lamps!
(I honestly don't know what is supposed to be so special about Rosh Hashanah to the Futurists since, according to Rev 12:1 that day was the day our LORD became flesh at 6:45 PM September 11th, 2BC)
So you would say that Christians are “caught up” “in the twinkling of an eye” and everything else happens “on that day” as you said.
You are misrepresenting again, I don't know if that is deliberate or not.
Could you read this short little explanation of the Last Day by our LORD and then explain how it in any way matches your Rapture/Tribulation theory>
Matt 13:37-43 He answered and said to them: "He who sows the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the kingdom, but the tares are the sons of the wicked one. The enemy who sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels. Therefore as the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age. The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness, and will cast them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears to hear, let him hear!
Questions:
In verse 40, who is gathered up?
In verse 43, who remains?
Could you please harmonize our LORD's words with Hal Lindsey's?
TC -- did you ever get a response for that "sources" question you askeD?
Nah. Still working to assemble a brain trust, I suspect.
We did get some cool and amusing cartoons though. Don't push them, its like asking a three-year old to drive into town and pick up the groceries.
>> Could you please harmonize our LORD’s words with Hal Lindsey’s?<<
I personally told Lindsey he was wrong on the 40 year generation and haven’t paid much attention to him since.
As for the other questions. You haven’t told me who Satan is deceiving after he is released from the pit. Why would I answer your questions? You’re all brave now but couldn’t stand the heat earlier.
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Ok, so now we are at the end of the thousand years and Satan has been released to deceive and is gathering the nations? Am I hearing that correctly? I mean scripture says that it’s after Satan is released at the end of the thousand years to deceive and gether the nations. Is this the thousand years we’re in or has the thousand years ended and has Satan been released or is he bound.
Hallelujah! A relevant question! (though I'm guessing its rhetorical)
Just like Jesus doesn't own the cattle on the 1001st hill (Ps 50:10), and you folks should console each other since you still need to wait another 36,000 or so years (Dt 7:9; 1 Chr 16:15; Ps 105:8) before the 1001th generation after Abram is born (Using Hal Lindsey "generational math" it may be as little as 72,000 years from now), I suppose you can also be as literal on the "myriad" of years as you want.
Nevertheless, there have been many non-premillennarians who have taken that 1000 years literally, and just like the Futurists, they looked around at what was happening in their own little world, saw nothing but decay and corruption and concluded that the 1000 year clock just happened to start ticking 999 years earlier. So ridicule of that crowd is fine by me. I just happen to be of that heretical crowd that believes that God does own the cattle on more than 1000 hills, and our LORD's Parousia can happen as I type this rather than tens of thousands of years from now, so I'm capable of handling your ridicule at believing that 1000 means "large number" in this context.
You did heckle over the reference passage of "binding the strongman" with respect to the broader understanding of what it means for Satan to be bound. That is OK too, I don't expect infants to consume anything more solid than milk. Essentially, when our LORD told the disciples that they would "bind on earth" as they went out into the world, the Gospel flourished very much unlike the time before Pentecost when we can only think of a handful of Gentiles who came to saving faith.
To "bind the strongman" so that one can "plunder his household" is for the Holy Spirit to "chain" and "bind" the Deceiver so that the Gospel could be understood and believed in the household that the Devil rules. As we bring the gospel to the lost, we are plundering Hell of its souls. The idea that Satan will be freed for "a short time" means that opposition to the gospel will become greater and greater.
As for now, even though to us it appears the Gospel is losing its influence in the West, Asia and Africa are exploding with converts, so it seems to me, Satan is still bound as the Gospel is clearly being received. For those who like speculative theology, as we know the Gospel went forth and "bound Satan" from Judea outward, similar to the waves a dropped stone makes in a still pool of water, it can be similarly argued that, like a collapsing star, Satan is released from the outer edges back to Jerusalem.
This scenario seems to have support in the OT prophets who describe a centralized "last stand" where the last of the converts may very well be the Jews living physically in and about Jerusalem. (Romans 11:25) - you futurists read it as Gog and Magog, along with all of the other nations circling in on the physical nation of Israel. Don't ask me to explain, you don't want to understand - its not as sexy and sophomoric as trying to have a NYT or WaPo journalist leave you a bread crumb trail of clues to the unmasking of this alleged antichrist.
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