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Posted on 01/02/2011 5:46:30 PM PST by Paragon Defender
Dennis B. Neuenschwander, “Joseph Smith: An Apostle of Jesus Christ,” Ensign, Jan 2009, 16–22
Adapted from a presentation to the Seventy.
In the Doctrine and Covenants we read that Joseph Smith was “called of God, and ordained an apostle of Jesus Christ” (D&C 20:2). The call of an Apostle is first to witness or testify of Jesus Christ. Old Testament prophets testified of His coming. The New Testament Apostles bore personal witness of Christ’s being and of the absolute reality of His Resurrection. This apostolic witness was the basis of their teaching. “Ye shall be witnesses unto me” (Acts 1:8) was Jesus’s instruction to the original Twelve. Peter testified on the day of Pentecost to the Jews who had gathered “out of every nation” (Acts 2:5) that “this Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses” (Acts 2:32). Similarly, Paul wrote to the Corinthians that Jesus “was seen of me also” (1 Corinthians 15:8). The sure witness of Christ’s being and the reality of His Resurrection is the first pillar of apostolic testimony.
The second pillar is centered on the Savior’s redemptive and saving power. Peter teaches that to the Lord “give all the Prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins” (Acts 10:43).
Without these twin pillars of testimony concerning Christ, there could be no Apostle. Such testimonies are born of experience, divine command, and instruction. For example, Luke writes that Christ showed Himself to the Apostles “alive after his passion … being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God” (Acts 1:3).
How does the Prophet Joseph Smith fit into these apostolic requirements? The answer is “Perfectly.”
Joseph Smith’s apostolic instruction began in 1820. Pondering the questions of religion, he soon found that there was no way to reason or argue one’s opinion to an authoritative conclusion concerning the correctness of the various churches or their doctrines. Short of a divine manifestation, young Joseph could add only one more opinion to the already existing “war of words and tumult of opinions” (Joseph Smith—History 1:10). But Joseph’s questions on religion were answered by the personal and physical manifestation of God the Father and His divine and living Son, Jesus Christ—an experience referred to as the First Vision.
Like that of the original Apostles, Joseph’s experience with Deity was direct and personal. There was no need for the opinion of others or the deliberations of a council to define what he saw or what it came to mean to him. Joseph’s vision was at first an intensely personal experience—an answer to a specific question. Over time, however, illuminated by additional experience and instruction, it became the founding revelation of the Restoration.
As apostolic as this manifestation of Christ’s being, existence, and Resurrection was to Joseph Smith, it was not the only thing Jesus wanted to teach him. The boy Joseph’s first lesson arose from the manifestation of Christ’s absolute, omnipotent, and divine power. Joseph learned firsthand at least one meaning of the redeeming and saving power of Christ when he prayed in the grove. As he began to pray, “Thick darkness gathered around me, and it seemed to me for a time as if I were doomed to sudden destruction” (Joseph Smith—History 1:15). With every bit of energy Joseph had, he began to call upon God to deliver him from the grasp of this enemy.
“At the very moment when I was ready to sink into despair and abandon myself to destruction … , I saw a pillar of light. …
“It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound” (Joseph Smith—History 1:16–17).
Joseph Smith’s confrontation with the adversary is reminiscent of an experience Moses had, about which the Prophet would learn some few years later. Unlike the boy Joseph, however, Moses saw God’s greatness first and then was confronted with the power of the adversary before being delivered from his influence. (See Moses 1.)
The difference in the order of events is significant. Moses was already far into maturity and had much knowledge and influence prior to this event. By displaying His magnificent power to Moses before he faced the adversary, the Lord helped Moses put his life into perspective. After experiencing God’s glory, Moses said, “Now, for this cause I know that man is nothing, which thing I never had supposed” (Moses 1:10). This incident enabled Moses to withstand the temptations of the adversary that followed.
Joseph Smith, on the other hand, was an inexperienced young man, who in his lifetime would repeatedly face adversarial power and the overwhelming problems it brings. By facing the adversary first, then being saved from his assault by the appearance of the Father and the Son, Joseph learned this indelible lesson: as great as the power of evil might be, it must always withdraw with the appearance of righteousness.
This lesson was critical in Joseph’s apostolic education. He needed this knowledge not only because of the personal trials that lay ahead of him but also because of the overwhelming opposition he would face in founding and directing the Church.
The boy Joseph went into the grove seeking wisdom, and wisdom he received. His apostolic instruction had begun. Among the great apostolic lessons of this First Vision were both the physical nature of the Savior and Heavenly Father and the initial and fundamental lessons relating to Their power—each a pillar of apostolic testimony.
Joseph Smith’s early apostolic instruction continued with his translation of the Book of Mormon. The Book of Mormon gave Joseph access to “the fulness of the everlasting Gospel” (Joseph Smith—History 1:34), principles that were necessary to understand even prior to the organization of the Church. The Prophet was introduced to numerous “plain and most precious” (1 Nephi 13:26) prophetic and apostolic testimonies regarding the Savior, all of which served as models for him.
Indeed, the Book of Mormon prophets employ over 100 titles in their teachings of Christ, each of which helped Joseph understand the Savior’s divine role.1 By virtue of these teachings, Joseph Smith became intimately acquainted with ancient prophets, giving him insight into the divine purpose of his responsibilities.
The Book of Mormon illuminates the universality of Christ’s Atonement. The Savior’s holy sacrifice is not confined to the borders of the Holy Land of His day or even restricted to the apostolic world of the original Twelve. The Atonement encompasses all of God’s creations—past, present, and future. What an impression Jacob’s teaching of the “infinite atonement” (2 Nephi 9:7) must have made on the mind of young Joseph, especially in contrast to Christian teachings at the time.
The Book of Mormon also introduces the universality of the Resurrection and other doctrines relating to it. Discourses on this doctrine by Lehi, Jacob, King Benjamin, Abinadi, Alma, Amulek, Samuel the Lamanite, and Moroni are all rich sources of instruction.
During the translation of the Book of Mormon, the Prophet received additional valuable personal instruction concerning the redemptive and saving power of Christ. In 1828 Martin Harris persuaded Joseph to lend him the first 116 pages of the Book of Mormon manuscript. When Martin Harris lost those pages, the Prophet felt an enormous despair.2 His mother, Lucy Mack Smith, recorded that Joseph exclaimed: “Oh, my God! … All is lost! all is lost! What shall I do? I have sinned—it is I who tempted the wrath of God. … How shall I appear before the Lord? Of what rebuke am I not worthy from the angel of the Most High?”3
For well over a month the Lord left Joseph in this terrible condition of remorse.4 Then came relief and the apostolic lesson. The Lord told Joseph:
“The works, and the designs, and the purposes of God cannot be frustrated, neither can they come to naught. …
“For although a man may have many revelations, and have power to do many mighty works, yet if he boasts in his own strength, and sets at naught the counsels of God, and follows after the dictates of his own will and carnal desires, he must fall and incur the vengeance of a just God upon him” (D&C 3:1, 4).
These words carefully describe what Joseph Smith had been experiencing. He had learned the exacting nature of the apostolic call and to whom the Apostle, at all cost, owes his loyalty. “Although men set at naught the counsels of God, and despise his words,” Joseph was told, “yet you should have been faithful” (D&C 3:7–8). Joseph Smith had lost access to the plates for a season and had been taught an invaluable lesson. Subsequently, the plates were returned, and his position as translator restored.
How critical were the lessons provided by the translation of the Book of Mormon as Joseph Smith grew in his apostolic calling! The Book of Mormon is the “keystone of our religion”5 because it contains so many prophetic testimonies of Christ and stands as a tangible witness of the Restoration.
After finishing the translation of the Book of Mormon in 1829 and organizing the Church in 1830, Joseph Smith had the opportunity to receive continuing apostolic education through the process of translating other scripture. This included three years of translating the Bible and, beginning in 1835, translating the book of Abraham. Joseph Smith’s translation of the Bible expanded his understanding of the role of Old Testament prophets and New Testament Apostles. It also resulted in additional revelation, namely the book of Moses.
The book of Moses provided the Prophet with important knowledge about the Savior’s ministry, including His role in the Creation. “The Lord spake unto Moses, saying: … I am the Beginning and the End, the Almighty God; by mine Only Begotten I created these things” (Moses 2:1). Further, He said, “And worlds without number have I created; … and by the Son I created them, which is mine Only Begotten” (Moses 1:33).
The book of Moses clarified Christ’s relationship to the Father in the premortal existence and reinforced the Prophet’s understanding of the ascendant power of righteousness. One of the most beautiful of all the apostolic lessons that came to Joseph Smith in this revelation was the confirmation of God’s love. It was so different from the harsh, unforgiving, and judgmental personage so many believed God to be; the book of Moses reveals a God of infinite compassion. Enoch saw that the “God of heaven … wept” (Moses 7:28) over those who would not receive Him. Wishing to know how it was possible, Enoch was given an answer that has a familiar biblical feel to it: “I [have] given commandment, that they should love one another, and that they should choose me, their Father. … Wherefore should not the heavens weep, seeing these shall suffer?” (Moses 7:33, 37; see also Deuteronomy 6:5; Leviticus 19:18; Matthew 22:37–39).
Through the translation of the book of Moses, the Prophet also became more acquainted with the redeeming and saving power of the Savior. As the Lord said, this earth was created “by the word of my power” (Moses 1:32) for the purpose of bringing “to pass the immortality and eternal life of man” (Moses 1:39). Many long years before the Savior taught Thomas and the Twelve that “I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me” (John 14:6), He revealed to Moses that “this is the plan of salvation unto all men, through the blood of mine Only Begotten, who shall come in the meridian of time” (Moses 6:62).
The First Vision in the grove, the translation of the Book of Mormon, the revision of the Bible, the revelation of the book of Moses, and the translation of the book of Abraham laid the basic foundation of the Church, largely through the rapidly expanding knowledge and testimony of the Prophet Joseph Smith relating to Jesus Christ.
Revelations given to him and compiled in the Doctrine and Covenants contain a wealth of knowledge concerning the Savior. One could research the numerous topics and cross-references of the Topical Guide and Guide to the Scriptures referring to Jesus Christ and still not understand the breadth of information on the Savior that the Prophet Joseph Smith brought to the world. I am grateful to know that Jesus was “in the beginning with the Father” (D&C 93:21). I am grateful to know that He “suffered these things for [me], that [I] might not suffer if [I] would repent” (D&C 19:16).
I am grateful for yet one other thing about the Savior’s ministry that stirs my soul deeply. From studying the promises of Malachi, Moroni’s initial visit with Joseph, the Savior’s words to the Nephites, and the visit of Elijah in the Kirtland Temple, I learn that God loves His children and has provided a way for each to return to Him. I know of no doctrine more just, no teaching that gives more hope than that of redemption of the dead. I am so grateful for the revelations that teach me that the Savior’s Atonement reaches to those who have lived, loved, served, and hoped for a better day yet never heard of Jesus or had the opportunity to embrace His gospel. This knowledge alone would be sufficient to convert me to the gospel if I knew nothing else at all. Here, at least for me, is the ultimate testimony of Jesus Christ and His atoning sacrifice.
What, then, can be said of the incomparable saving power of Christ? That which Joseph Smith learned in the Sacred Grove about the power of righteousness overcoming evil foreshadows the final scene. So reveals the Lord:
“I, having accomplished and finished the will of him whose I am, even the Father, concerning me—having done this that I might subdue all things unto myself—
“Retaining all power, even to the destroying of Satan and his works at the end of the world, and the last great day of judgment” (D&C 19:2–3).
Our own testimonies of the Savior are framed by the testimony and teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith. Is it any wonder then that the Prophet taught that “the fundamental principles of our religion are the testimony of the Apostles and Prophets, concerning Jesus Christ, that He died, was buried, and rose again the third day, and ascended into heaven; and all other things which pertain to our religion are only appendages to it.”6
Joseph Smith’s apostolic testimony of the divine reality and the Resurrection of Jesus Christ, as well as his knowledge of the redemptive and saving power of the Savior, can best be seen by the Prophet’s own beautiful, powerful, and succinct witness:
“And now, after the many testimonies which have been given of him, this is the testimony, last of all, which we give of him: That he lives!
“For we saw him, even on the right hand of God; and we heard the voice bearing record that he is the Only Begotten of the Father—
“That by him, and through him, and of him, the worlds are and were created, and the inhabitants thereof are begotten sons and daughters unto God” (D&C 76:22–24).
How grateful I am for the apostolic call of Joseph Smith.
4. The 116 pages were lost in June 1828. In July Joseph Smith received what is now section 3 of the Doctrine and Covenants. In September the plates were returned to the Prophet. See the historical introductions to D&C 3; 10.
>...true confession of faith ...
... is the shunning of ALL religion,...You realize there is no ‘true church’
= = = = =
Are you saying that all the people who regularly attend church don’t have a “true confession of faith” ? Do you mean that the thousands who attend (and financially support) mega-churches like the Chrystal Cathedral should instead “shun all” church going?
I don’t think you meant that, did you?
Or did you mean to say that a “true Christian” can go to any church or no church at all...whatever. It doesn’t matter.
Or what did you mean?
No that isn’t what i am saying, and I am sorry it came across that way.
You do know, you do recognize that something is different. And I know several people who have tried faking being a Christian, i was one of them once.
Read John, Romans, Acts, Hebrews. Look at what the Bible says, trust Christ alone for your salvation, REALLY believe and REALLY surrender. That is where it begins.
But you see Charles, I was still a Mormon when I joined FreeRepublic. For several years I posted as a Mormon, though an unbelieving one. One day, one particularly nasty LDS lady told me that I wasn’t allowed to call myself a Mormon since I didn’t regularly attend Church services, and didn’t believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet (she has since been banned from this site).
From that day forward, I was refused the right to post on Mormon caucus threads, simply because I didn’t toe the mark - wasn’t up to snuff when it came to Mormonism. Almost all of the Mormons on this site refused to allow me a say on caucus threads about my Mormonism or my experiences as a Mormon even though I was been born and raised a sixth generation Mormon in Utah and still retained my membership on their rolls.
Now, who gets to decide who can post on a caucus thread? Is it the Religion Mod? Admin Mod? Jim Rob? The poster of the thread?
Mormonism is a devious cult of Christianity. They use control tactics and don’t allow dissension or questions. They bring their accusations of bigotry and hatred to unrelated sites like this and try to control discussions about their theology so only the “good” parts are shown. Is that a Christian way to act? I say it isn’t.
no, church doesn’t matter for the most part. However, Christians need to be in a solid bible believing church and sadly there are too few of them.
Christians go to church for fellowship with other believers and to learn that is all. I know too many people, lds especially, who place their faith in RELIGION (rites rules church membership all that stuff) rather than in Christ.
You can be a Christian (a true Christian) and never step foot into a church, but you won’t grow. However, you can also have your spiritual growth stunted by attending a church that is legalistic or isn’t doctrinally (biblically) sound.
Doctrine matters, but only on the big things - Person work and nature of Christ. That automatically leaves Mormons and JW’s and a few other groups out.
Groups like the LDS claim there is only one ‘true church’, that God founded a denomination. that isn’t true in the least and that is what I meant. The word translated Church (ekklesia), means in the greek ‘an assembly’ or literally the ‘called out ones’. It isn’t about religon, it is about relationship. Christ came to reconcile us to God, not start a denomination. When you get too caught up in belonging to a denomination (church) you can (and often do) lose focus on Christ. That is dangerous indeed.
FWIW, I have attended several churches over the years, all Christian, but I am a member of none of them. Right now, we divide our time between the Lutherans, Methodists, and a non-denom church. For the last several years before we moved, we attended a Calvary Chapel, before that it was a community church, we were married in an EV Free church. All are Christian.
See 965 for an example of DU talking out of both sides of his mouth.
"Answer to above from DU: I'm asking you again, how exactly did you receive your negative message?
What exactly were your preparations for an answer from on high?
Please understand I am not trying to tear you down, but your actions are not consistent with your words here and I as an analyst must either conclude that you have left something vital out of your report, or you have falsified it in some way. I do not like to think that my Christian brethren would lie about something so important to the salvation of the soul, so I ask for more information to help me and any Lurkers to rectify the apparent contradictions of your story with your actions."
Legerdemain is for magicians not preachers.
For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or [if] ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with [him]. - 2 Cor 11:3-4
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. – John 1:1-4
Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all [things] he might have the preeminence. For it pleased [the Father] that in him should all fulness dwell; And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, [I say], whether [they be] things in earth, or things in heaven.– Colossians 1:15-20
Remember the former things of old: for I [am] God, and [there is] none else; [I am] God, and [there is] none like me, Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times [the things] that are not [yet] done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: - Isaiah 46:9-10
Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. - John 8:58
As soon then as he had said unto them, I am [he], they went backward, and fell to the ground. – John 18:6
Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and [that] no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost. –I Corinthians 12:3
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. - Revelation 1:7-8
I just want to say thank you for pulling this thread out of its ‘caucus’ status and into the light for the rest of us who find the title highly objectionable to be able to comment and refute.
I’ve been of the opinion for some time that many LDS freepers have been using FR as a proslytizing website. When their doctrine is refuted using facts they usually start whining about being ‘bashed’ and ‘hated’. The individual mormon is not hated, but prayed for. The LDS organization/hierarchy is indeed hated as all Christians are commanded to not only hate but refute all false doctrine. There is a difference between the individual caught up in the lie and the false prophets/church by and from whom the individuals are kept deceived.
The responses coming in from Mormons as I am attempting to get caught up in the hundreds of posts so far are proving me to have probably been right in my initial analysis. Thanks Jim.
Amen and worth a repost. You hit the nail on the head:
The individual mormon is not hated, but prayed for. The LDS organization/hierarchy is indeed hated as all Christians are commanded to not only hate but refute all false doctrine. There is a difference between the individual caught up in the lie and the false prophets/church by and from whom the individuals are kept deceived.
WOW...So many posts..Where to begin...
Ok here I go...
You said
Jesus said who do you say I am? Is that Jesus trying to convince other’s of his divinity? he lived his life showing other’s who he was, by his actions, by his healings, by his teachings....
I guess he could of really convinced everyone by raising his hands to heaven and screaming to GOD to shout over the world who he was.....
No I don’t think he was out to CONVINCE other’s who he was by the standards of Man’s proof of GOD....
To the person who asked:
BTT and BTTT and BUMP all mean the same thing. It’s just a way to add a post to the thread, so that the thread will stay somewhere near the top of the list (and thereby be seen by more viewers).
Like this:
BUMP
” Was Joseph Smith a true prophet?”
Based on the “truest” book ever written according to Mormons. No!
The doctrine according to Mormon theology is that Jesus was not God Himself but an older brother to all of us. But according to the BOM it specifically states that it was God himself that came down as Jesus. So naturally when a Christian reads the BOM he finds not too much difference. It is only when you get into their deeper theology that you find bad doctrine. Doctrine that contradicts itself on the most fundamental levels. Such as who is God.
Book of Mormon (Condradicts that Jesus was the OLDER brother)
Mosiah 13:34: “Have they not said that God himself should come down among the children of men, and take upon him the form of man, and go forth in mighty power upon the face of the earth?”
Mosiah 15:1-5: “And now Abinadi said unto them: I would that ye should understand that God himself shall come down among the children of men, and shall redeem his people. And because he dwelleth in flesh he shall be called the Son of God, and having subjected the flesh to the will of the Father, being the Father and the Son— The Father, because he was conceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son— And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth. And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, suffereth temptation...”
Mosiah 16:15: “Teach them that redemption cometh through Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father.”
Alma 11:26-33: And Zeezrom said unto him: Thou sayest there is a true and living God? And Amulek said: Yea, there is a true and living God. Now Zeezrom said: Is there more than one God? And he answered, No. Now Zeezrom said unto him again: How knowest thou these things? And he said: An angel hath made them known unto me. And Zeezrom said again: Who is he that shall come? Is it the Son of God? And he said unto him, Yea.”
Alma 11:38-40: Now Zeezrom saith again unto him: Is the Son of God the very Eternal Father? And Amulek said unto him: Yea, he is the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth, and all things which in them are; he is the beginning and the end, the first and the last; And he shall come into the world to redeem his people; and he shall take upon him the transgressions of those who believe on his name; and these are they that shall have eternal life, and salvation cometh to none else.”
In Mosiah it says, “God himself” shall come down among the children of men. “God Himself”. What better words to explain who Jesus is! In Mosiah it also says Jesus is “…Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father”. This isn’t written in another language or in need of further interpretation, but comes from the Book of Mormon – a book proclaimed to be “the most correct book on the face of the earth”! The Book of Mormon – and the Bible – teach there is only one Eternal Father and He is our Father in heaven who is over all, not just ‘over this earth’, but over all that exists and all that will ever exist. Why don’t you believe these verses from the Book of Mormon? If the Book of Mormon is the most correct book on the earth, why doesn’t it say, “Jesus, who is our eternal brother”?
How can the Book of Mormon be the most correct book on the earth when the LDS Church doesn’t accept and teach the above passages? Growing up, I was always taught that the Book of Mormon is “the most correct book on the face of the earth”. I don’t know who originally said that, as far as church history, but I’ve heard this quote or phrase many times. To find out that the Book of Mormon agrees with the Bible on who God is, was like a lightning bolt from the sky. Can you tell me why the LDS Church doesn’t teach this – especially since it is in the Book of Mormon? It doesn’t make sense that your church does not accept it’s own scriptures.
Book of Mormon
Mosiah 13:34: “Have they not said that God himself should come down among the children of men, and take upon him the form of man, and go forth in mighty power upon the face of the earth?”
Mosiah 15:1-5: “And now Abinadi said unto them: I would that ye should understand that God himself shall come down among the children of men, and shall redeem his people. And because he dwelleth in flesh he shall be called the Son of God, and having subjected the flesh to the will of the Father, being the Father and the Son— The Father, because he was conceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son— And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth. And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, suffereth temptation...”
Mosiah 16:15: “Teach them that redemption cometh through Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father.”
Alma 11:26-33: And Zeezrom said unto him: Thou sayest there is a true and living God? And Amulek said: Yea, there is a true and living God. Now Zeezrom said: Is there more than one God? And he answered, No. Now Zeezrom said unto him again: How knowest thou these things? And he said: An angel hath made them known unto me. And Zeezrom said again: Who is he that shall come? Is it the Son of God? And he said unto him, Yea.”
Alma 11:38-40: Now Zeezrom saith again unto him: Is the Son of God the very Eternal Father? And Amulek said unto him: Yea, he is the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth, and all things which in them are; he is the beginning and the end, the first and the last; And he shall come into the world to redeem his people; and he shall take upon him the transgressions of those who believe on his name; and these are they that shall have eternal life, and salvation cometh to none else.”
In Mosiah it says, “God himself” shall come down among the children of men. “God Himself”. What better words to explain who Jesus is! In Mosiah it also says Jesus is “…Christ the Lord, who is the very Eternal Father”. This isn’t written in another language or in need of further interpretation, but comes from the Book of Mormon – a book proclaimed to be “the most correct book on the face of the earth”! The Book of Mormon – and the Bible – teach there is only one Eternal Father and He is our Father in heaven who is over all, not just ‘over this earth’, but over all that exists and all that will ever exist. Why don’t you believe these verses from the Book of Mormon? If the Book of Mormon is the most correct book on the earth, why doesn’t it say, “Jesus, who is our eternal brother”?
How can the Book of Mormon be the most correct book on the earth when the LDS Church doesn’t accept and teach the above passages? Growing up, I was always taught that the Book of Mormon is “the most correct book on the face of the earth”. I don’t know who originally said that, as far as church history, but I’ve heard this quote or phrase many times. To find out that the Book of Mormon agrees with the Bible on who God is, was like a lightning bolt from the sky. Can you tell me why the LDS Church doesn’t teach this – especially since it is in the Book of Mormon? It doesn’t make sense that your church does not accept it’s own scriptures.
As anyone familiar with the LDS doctrine you can clearly see that the BOM CONDRADICTS their own theology.
With Judaism and Christianity you could go back and translate out of the original tongues. With Mormonism their is no original tongue except Joseph Smith.
...although it doesn’t seem to be working that way right now.
The original thread is still way, way down the list.
And... it’s back in the Religion category. It’s not in Breaking News anymore.
Hmm...
Can anyone explain to me how this works?
Why isn’t the thread in Breaking News anymore?
Tara,
Are you as naive as you try to portray, or are you just following the script? It is apparent to many of us that you belong to the sect called the Jehovah's Witnesses. If not, please feel free to deny it. For our sake, go away with your little ploy. You fooled a few, but as it was alleged:
"You can fool some of the people all of the time, you can fool all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all people all the time..."
Jesus ran through the temple tossing tables. He taught elders. He may have shouted. It isn't noted.
I would think that God's truly chosen people will always recognize His voice. I do, and I am not part of any 144,000. We have the same promise as the guy next door!
Jesus promised a rest. I'll take His way!
>With Judaism and Christianity you could go back and translate out of the original tongues.
= = = =
No, actually, you can’t. The earliest existing fragments come from the second century (about 125 A.D.).
So we have no way of know exactly what the original New Testament said... and the Old Testament, of course, goes back much, much earlier.
Slanderous? Oh that is choice victimology. Remarkable because I've seen of evidence of any application of those studies in your posts.
Is it your contention that I should spend less time with the KJV and more with the JST? If not, why do you keep bringing it up?
The JST is your prophets corrected kjv is it not - therefore more reliable and correctly translated? Yet you don't cite it here at all. LOL, guess you must consider it spurious just like 'ol bring'em young eh?
“In Satira Veritas”
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