Third Secret of Fatima and Russia

In her memoirs, Lucia writes of a warning spoken by Mary pertaining to the failure of Vatican officials to obey her requests in a timely manner...before the point Russia reeks havoc upon the world: "Later...Our Lady said to me, complaining: "Not wishing to attend to my request! Like the King of France, they will repent then make it happen, but it will be (done) late. Russia will have already spread it's errors through the world, provoking wars, and persecutions of the Church: The Pope will have much to suffer." (in Portuguese: Mais tarde...Nossa Senhora disse-me, queixando-se: Não quiseram atender ao Meu pedido! Como o rei de França, arrepender-se-ão e fá-la-ão, mas será tarde. A Rússia terá já espalhado os seus erros pelo mundo, mundo, provocando guerras, perseguições à igreja: O Santo Padre terá muito que sofrer)

The word "repent" was translated from the Portuguese "arrepender-se-ão" also meaning "to regret/be sorry for" (http://dictionary.reverso.net/portuguese-english/arrepender ).

Through Lucia, Mary made two requests of the Church: 1) publicly consecrate Russia to Mary's heart. 2)open the Third Secret to the world in 1960.

In 1980, during a trip to Fulda Germany, Pope John Paul II made remarks about the Third Secret. He stated that: "my predecessors in the Petrine office diplomatically preferred to postpone publication so as not to encourage the world power of Communism to make certain moves."

We already know that the Fatima prophecies speak precisely about Russia and more particularly "Russia's errors" rather than "communism." Thus in all likelihood JPII is referring to the then communist superpower RUSSIA when using the broader term "world power of communism."

For the Vatican to withhold publication of the Third Secret for decades due to fear of the Russians/Communists reacting with "certain moves" indicates that those "certain moves" are significant and grave. For instance the Third Secret may contain provocative words that infuriate Russia into a vengeful military attack against the Vatican.

A third secret element that would definitely infuriate Russia would be something along the lines of a prophecy that states: the leader of Russia at the time of the chastisement is possessed by demons from hell!

During the Vatican's release of the "vision" portion of the Third Secret in June 26, 2000, Cardinal Ratzinger(now the Pope) wrote for the commentary: "Here it would be appropriate to mention a phrase from the letter which Sister Lucia wrote to the Holy Father on 12 May 1982: “The THIRD PART of the ‘secret' refers to Our Lady's words: ‘If not, [Russia] will spread her errors throughout the world, causing wars and persecutions of the Church. The good will be martyred; the Holy Father will have much to suffer; various nations will be annihilated'”

Ratzinger's words in June 2000 explicitly reveals that the Third Secret vision pertains to RUSSIA'S errors "causing wars and persecutions of the Church".

Therefore in order for a FUTURE fulfillment of the Third Secret of Fatima that involves a violent religious persecution and a Pope killed by soldiers...RUSSIA must in the FUTURE, become politically transformed into the tool that serves as the primary cause that brings about the period of religious persecution prophesied by the Fatima Prophecies. It is Russia that God uses to punish the world with war and persecution, suffering of the Pope, and annihilation.

If the Vatican considered there was even a 1% chance the Fatima Prophecy were a divine message from God, despite the conspiracy to hide the existence of the "words" of the Third Secret in June 2000, they would have certainly taken precaution against God's wrath by hedging their bet and actually reveal the gist of the Secret albeit less directly. Which they did in the commentary when Ratzinger included that quote attributed to the seer(Lucia), once again being: "Here it would be appropriate to mention a phrase from the letter which Sister Lucia wrote to the Holy Father on 12 May 1982: “The THIRD PART of the ‘secret' refers to Our Lady's words: ‘If not, [Russia] will spread her errors throughout the world, causing wars and persecutions of the Church. The good will be martyred; the Holy Father will have much to suffer; various nations will be annihilated'”

So the real secret is that the Third portion of the Secret and the Second portion are actually two parts of one single unified secret. The reference to world war I and world war II in the second secret would be brief mentions of the two wars that would precede a separate Russian driven chastisement. Previous events regarding Russia and world war II would be shadows of future events to come.

Malachi Martin, Secretary of high ranking Cardinal Bea, was shown the Third Secret in the 1960's.

Eight years before Ratzinger's June 2000 commentary, in Malachi Martin's 1992 book "The Keys of this Blood" (pg630-631), he indicated the role of Russia with the comments :

i)"Russia, according to the text of the 'Third Secret,' was the regulator of the timetable."

ii)"Lucia's single-page written formulation of the "Third Secret" covers three main topics. (1) A Physical chastisement of the nations...(2) A spiritual chastisement...(3) A central function of Russia in the two ...(which)..In fact, the physical and spiritual chastisements, according to Lucia's letter, are to be gridded on a fateful timetable in which Russia is the ratchet."

Long before Cardinal Ratzinger wrote the June 2000 commentary, the Cardinal released a book containing an interview given by him to Vittorio Messori which included some questions about the Third Secret. The interview occurred in the mid 1980's.

-"Cardinal Ratzinger, have you read the so-called 'third secret of Fatima'...?" -The reply is immediate and dry: "Yes, I have read it."

At the end of the question's pertaining to the Third Secret, after Ratzinger states "to publish the 'third secret' would mean exposing the Church to the danger of sensationalism" Vittorio Messori then writes: "that Perhaps also political implications, I venture, since it seems that here, also, as in the two other "secrets," Russia is mentioned? At this point however, the Cardinal declares that he is not in a position to go further into the matter and firmly refuses to discuss particulars."

-Cardinal Ratzinger's reaction to the mention of the word "Russia" in the context of the Third Secret demonstrates Vittorio's question hit a nerve. if Russia was NOT mentioned in the Secret, Ratzinger would have no need to react as such. His reaction seemed to indicate at that time that he was instructed in 1984 not to reveal that Russia was part of the Secret and not to falsely deny that Russia was part of the Secret. That would explain Ratzinger's choice to evade the subject at the mere mention of Russia.

For his 1947 book "Our Lady of Fatima" author William Thomas Walsh interviewed Sister Lucia in 1946 --a year she was not yet forbidden to give interviews.

"she said more than once and with deliberate emphasis: "What Our Lady wants is that the Pope and all the bishops in the world shall consecrate Russia to Her Immaculate Heart on one special day. If this is done, She will convert Russia and there will be peace. If it is not done, the errors of Russia will spread through every country in the world.' " "Does this mean, in your opinion, that every country, without exception, will be overcome by Communism?" "Yes."(replied Lucia)."

Mary told Lucia that Russia's "errors" will spread to every country of the world, but in the 1940's to 1990 pretty much every believer in the world including Sister Lucia herself, would have assumed that Russia's errors were equatable with communism.

I would consider "Russia's errors" to be the tactics of a yet to arrive Russian Hitler that would rebuild the ego and glory of the Russian empire at the expense of the weak. These Russian errors could/would include such things as persecuting religious minorities at the behest of the majority, the blackmail of weaker nations, persecution of every kind of minority, declaring might as right/war to achieve all the needs of the state(attaining food, wealth, gas, slaves etc,) or something. Russia's tactics/errors that would spread to every country would be for egoism, diversion of attention, and ultimately to pacify the voting public during times of economic collapse, hunger, and chaos. The future Russia, possibly led by Vladimir Zhirinovsky, may echo some of the ways of the former communists, but it's behavior would be more extreme and frightening.

If divine forces are responsible for the Apparitions of Mary to Portugal in 1917, it is clear in context, that the major reason the year 1917 was selected for the Apparition to arrive was for the reason that Vladimir Lenin and the anti-religious Communists forced their way into power to take control of Russia less than one month after the Miracle of the Sun/Final Apparition.

Thus the Apparitions in the year 1917 establishes a connection between the Fatima Prophecies to a present and future transformation of Russia into a godless religious persecuting state.

From there, Mary indicates that even though she knows the Church officials will refuse to obey her requests thus dooming itself, she provides the remedy for world peace:

Her remedy given to the Church requires that the Pope in union with all the Bishops of the world in a public event "Consecrate Russia to her Immaculate Heart."

"If my requests are heeded, Russia will be converted, and there will be peace; if not, she will spread her errors throughout the world, causing wars and persecutions of the Church."

The request to Consecrate Russia appears as a simple test of faith imposed by Heaven to show faith in God's messenger and God...by forcing the Vatican to choose whether to risk some worldly interests for the sake of spiritual interests.

With the anti-religious communists in power in Russia, the request to consecrate Russia with the world watching, forces the Vatican to risk irritating and provoking the Soviet Union.

Releasing the WORDS of the Third Secret poses a significantly bigger threat to the Vatican's worldly interests. It's a bigger test of Faith. Not only does it's publication risk infuriating Russia, it risks making the Vatican lose substantial credibility if the dated prophecies seem to fail to materialize.

The noose seems to tighten even further around the Vatican's neck. Setting the stage for an extremely bad outcome when the moment of belief is finally reached. By having lied about the Third Secret in the year 2000, lied about Lucia's words in the year 2000, and lying in a book about the subject released in 2007(The Last Secret of Fatima-Cardinal Bertone)--as the abhorrent sexual scandal in the Church reaches it's climactic point in the future--the Vatican would be compelled to finally release the suppressed words of the Third Secret once the events have arrived and there is no longer doubt...but in doing so, the Vatican will have revealed to the entire world that it lied to protect it's earthly interests over Fatima thus appearing to much of the world that it is equally guilty of lying to protect it's skin in the explosively shocking sex scandal near the top of the Church that would have revealed itself at that time.

So...in order for the Pope to finally obey God and release the Third Secret, the cost in the end will be epic. It would be seen as a declaration of guilt over the future sex scandal, risking opening a floodgate of litigation that would impoverish the church coffers. It could doom someone very close to the Pope, Cardinal and friend, to prison. It would be seen as an abhorrent tactic to divert attention away from the sex scandal. It would be perceived as an abhorrent tactic to terrify everyone back to the Church at a desperate moment in time. It would bring down the wrath of Russia against the Vatican.

what on earth makes you think that JPII did by not even mentioning Russia?

I’ve been answering this question throughout the thread so here’s a brief recap:

1. Sister Lucia acknowledged this in a letter (The letter is not a forgery)

2. I’ll take the word of JPII and Pope Benedict XVI that the secret has been revealed and the Consecration to Russia is complete.

3. Since 1984 there have been a series of events that would confirm this

That’s your flawed personal opinion

Pardon me, I didn’t realize your opinions were infallible.

and your example is also in error.

Try this example.

2 Peter 3:8 “But do not ignore this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years and a thousand years like one day.”

This thread is starting to go in circles so this will be my last post. You can have the last word since I know it will help you decompress. Good Day.

If Pius XII did not do it right 1942 by his consecration of the world, nor in 1948 by his consecration of specifically Russia, then what on earth makes you think that JPII did by not not even mentioning Russia?

1. Sister Lucia acknowledged this in a letter (The letter is not a forgery)

We have her testimony that the consecrations of Pius XII were incomplete, yet Pius XII went firther than JPII by specifically mentioning Russia.

What happened that would make sister lucia change her stance of 34 years?

2. I’ll take the word of JPII and Pope Benedict XVI that... the Consecration to Russia is complete.

Where is JPII's word? He specifically said it has not been done:

"Two years later, this evasive approach was taken again when the Holy Father once more consecrated the world to the Immaculate Heart of Mary in a ceremony before 250,000 people in Rome in March of 1984. But this time, the Pope made his position clearer. In a departure from his prepared text, he asked Our Lady of Fatima to "enlighten especially the peoples of which You Yourself are awaiting our consecration and confiding." The Pope thus publicly acknowledged that the consecration requested by Our Lady had still not been performed. These words were included in an official report of the event in L’Osservatore Romano on March 26, 1984. A similar report appeared the next day in the Italian bishops’ newspaper Avvenire, describing the Pope praying in St. Peter’s several hours after the consecration ceremony, asking Our Lady to bless "those peoples for whom You Yourself are awaiting our act of consecration and entrusting."

re: You joined FR just to post this?

The article is more than just "this". I've read the entire article and it is accurate in all details, after all, he is quoting other sources, all real and accurate. The article is very good, except the following two parts which are the writers own speculation. He does however honestly state that it is his own opinion:

"Mary told Lucia that Russia's "errors" will spread to every country of the world, but in the 1940's to 1990 pretty much every believer in the world including Sister Lucia herself, would have assumed that Russia's errors were equatable with communism. I would consider "Russia's errors" to be the tactics of a yet to arrive Russian Hitler that would rebuild the ego and glory of the Russian empire at the expense of the weak. These Russian errors could/would include such things as persecuting religious minorities at the behest of the majority, the blackmail of weaker nations, persecution of every kind of minority, declaring might as right/war to achieve all the needs of the state(attaining food, wealth, gas, slaves etc,) or something. Russia's tactics/errors that would spread to every country would be for egoism, diversion of attention, and ultimately to pacify the voting public during times of economic collapse, hunger, and chaos. The future Russia, possibly led by Vladimir Zhirinovsky, may echo some of the ways of the former communists, but it's behavior would be more extreme and frightening."

Sister Lucia always focused on the eternal loss of souls, due to the errors of Russia. The same goes for the conclusions of every authentic Fatima expert. After all, for a Catholic, the spiritual is always the most important. The spiritual is all we have to worry about, the loss of our eternal life. The earthly part, "the bombs", we have no control over, nor should we loose 1 minute of sleep over it, for it's despair, a sin, and not Catholic.

I don't understand what you mean by "if the dated prophecies seem to fail to materialize". The disclosure of the 3rd secret is now 50 years past due, it's a prophecy that's 50 years old! Revealing it now should reveal what has already happened.It should be "old news" now.

The noose seems to tighten even further around the Vatican's neck. Setting the stage for an extremely bad outcome when the moment of belief is finally reached. By having lied about the Third Secret in the year 2000, lied about Lucia's words in the year 2000, and lying in a book about the subject released in 2007(The Last Secret of Fatima-Cardinal Bertone)as the abhorrent sexual scandal in the Church reaches it's climactic point in the future--the Vatican would be compelled to finally release the suppressed words of the Third Secret once the events have arrived and there is no longer doubt...but in doing so, the Vatican will have revealed to the entire world that it lied to protect it's earthly interests over Fatima thus appearing to much of the world that it is equally guilty of lying to protect it's skin in the explosively shocking sex scandal near the top of the Church that would have revealed itself at that time.

I guess you are saying that the "sex scandal" was revealed in the real 3rd secret, which was to be revealed in 1960?

re: It would be perceived as an abhorrent tactic to terrify everyone back to the Church at a desperate moment in time. It would bring down the wrath of Russia against the Vatican

I don't see where proof of "hiding a scandal" would terrify anyone back to the Church, on the contrary, it would repel people from joining the Church. By the way, revealing the truth, would bring to light what the SSPX and traditionalists have been saying all along, that the progressives within the Church are wolves in sheep's clothing, enemies of the Church. Revealing the full 3rd Secret would expose the progressives, and force them to make a stand, and to attempt to take with them their followers to start a new church. Thus, it would not hurt the Catholic Church, but would reveal to everyone who in the that the post Vatican II hierarchy were the wolves in sheep's clothing.

It is my understanding that war required to start near the end of last century serves as the unrealized beginning of predicted global misery to come. Upon future delvings, the matter should become clear when Russia shocks Europe with warplanes sent to destroy Kosovo's independence on behalf of the Serbs. It could have happened yesterday already, it could happen after perceptual or political changes in the relevant regions.

I guess you are saying that the "sex scandal" was revealed in the real 3rd secret, which was to be revealed in 1960?

The La Salette secrets speak about the bad behavior of priests and the vengeance at their doors. The Fatima secret probably repeats such warnings.

Pope John Paul II himself indicated the parallels between La Salette and Fatima. Father Alonso, an official archivist of the Fatima documents stated 30 or so years ago about the third Secret: "Does the unpublished text speak of concrete circumstances? It is very possible that it speaks not only of a real crisis of the faith in the Church during this in-between period, but like the secret of La Salette, for example, there are more concrete references to the internal struggles of Catholics or to the fall of priests and religious..."/((Note to anyone: be wary of English La Salette translations without examining the original French. There are critical differences between the two.))

The outbreak of the recent sex scandal coincided with Pope Benedict XVI's (possibly insincere) trip to Fatima indicating at first blush a connection between the two. He planned the trip before the outbreak arrived.

Another more recent development had displayed itself to anyone that was paying close attention to the right place and time that screams out direct connection between the Fatima prophecies and the sex scandal. However, I cannot prudently repeat the information over the internet for the simple reason that a single person or two could nefariously use such information to, at the proper time, attempt to forcefully fulfill a certain relatively easy to fulfill prophecy. I don't expect anyone to take my word for it, so people can ignore (especially!) this last paragraph.

I don't see where proof of "hiding a scandal" would terrify anyone back to the Church, on the contrary, it would repel people from joining the Church.

I guess my point is that that many people would get their excuse to continue to be hardened against Fatima by believing the Pope released a fabricated version of the 3rd secret for the express purpose of stopping people from leaving the Church over the big scandal and to terrify them and their wallets back to the pews and back to the Pope that has suddenly become the apocalyptic messenger of the Virgin Mary. I hope I'm wrong on this!!!!!!!! Unless Mary appears to the Pope in a vision and forces his hand, the release of the secret would undoubtedly occur at the early stage of fulfillment when the Pope can no longer deny the predicted events have arrived : a moment the world is desperately afraid of the new Russian Fuhrer being further provoked.

Many people would hate the Pope for resorting, over the sex scandal, to such heartless 16th century diversionary tactics that "preys on people's superstitions and deepest fears" at such a delicate moment in history. They would view it as the most unequaled self-serving, outrageous, and uncaring act...ever!

It is the type of scandalous situation that would boil up enough anger against the Pope that people would go to the large building housing the Pope and release their fury against him by hurling curses and throwing stones towards the crying Pope, in fulfillment of Jacinta's vision.

And yet the Pope would know the Fatima message is being fulfilled and is the Truth of God. In such a possible expected situation as described in this post, the Pope would "suffer" the pain of being unbelieved and being accused of a monstrous fabrication. Genuine regret of his role and the effects of the "lies" that damaged the perceived credibility of the third secret would be another source of suffering for him. The perception that he is lying about and guilty of allowing/knowing about the mega sex scandal would be yet another source of suffering. And that would be just the beginning as the Pope would have much to suffer.

Believers would recognize that to reveal the secret, the Pope risked everything: flesh, bone and home, credibility, embarrassment and possibly imprisonment....all out of the fear of God, fear for his soul, fear for the fate of mankind.

The Church goes underground in a time of persecution, lead by a transformed Pope that offers his life as a sacrifice to God.

Sorry for the speculation.

I was puzzled by the fact that pf707 joined FR - a primarily political forum - last week and has posted only on this "Fatima" thread.

The archives at FreeRepubilc contain plenty of threads posted over the years regarding Fatima.

As to timing:

Before December I could reasonably state that Russia would NOT YET take surprise military action in a manner or location that means something extraordinarily relevant to prophecy, as I see it.

If I cared to post BEFORE the risk of materialization arrived, I could not wait another week.

For example, if interpreted signs and geopolitical landscapes suggested a certain something would occur within a four year period I would not want to wait until the second or third year to present such information for fear the events would occur in the first year and I would miss the chance to present the information beforehand.

To present the information after the fact is to invite the accusation that the Fatima secret is simply being force fitted to square with present day events for the unreasonable 3rd time, failing to recognize that the whole time it was primarily about those future current day events and not the secondary shadows manifested in the past.

In fact, I delayed posting such an article here, until the last moments before the perceived risky period arrived as I saw it.

Neither am I particular interested in whether others agree or disagree with my assessment of this upcoming period of risk involving Russia.

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