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To: Cronos

So, according to you, someone is a Christian based on lip service to a creed?

Interesting.

Was Jesus wrong then when He said it was through Him?

What about Pelosi, Kennedy, Mafia hit men, and the molesting priests? If they agree with the creed, they’re Christians? Would Jesus act like any of them?


6,992 posted on 01/11/2011 7:58:57 AM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom
1. A true Christian is a person who has put faith and trust in the person and work of Jesus Christ, including His death on the cross as payment for sins and His resurrection on the third day

2. The person i.e. nature of Christ, the nature of God is encapsulated perfectly in the Nicene Creed. Do you believe in God as described in the Nicene Creed? Do you believe in ONE God, creator almighty of all that is seen and unseen? Do you believe in ONE Lord, only begotten Son of God, God from God, Light from Light, True God from True God? Do you believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord and Giver of Life who with the Father and Son is worshipped and glorified? Do you believe in the communion of saints, the forgiveness of sins, the resurrection of the dead and life everlasting?

3. Note that neither the first definition nor the Creed talks about your deeds or actions -- you asked Would Jesus act like any of them? -- Is Salvation according to you based on Works? --> don't worry, that's not a gotcha, but I'm just bringing a point up that our definition of a Christian (whether Catholic, Presbyterian, Lutheran, etc.) is always based on what a person confesses to believe rather than their actions.

4. If one says the only true Christian is a person perfectly following Christ then that is a different matter. Is anyone in this current age perfectly following Christ? Everyone here on this forum and each living person on this planet is a sinner. None on this earth satisfy the lofy conditions to be trully Christ-like in actions or deeds

5. But Christ came for sinners -- so a sinner who truly strives to be like Christ, who trusts and believes in Christ and Christ's message is a Christian.

6. Are Ross Perot (Presbyterian), Clinton (SBC), Al Gore, Jimmah Carter etc. Christians? Are the molesting pastors like Reverend Young Key, 47 Gold Coast Presbyterian minister (received 8 years jail sentence after being found guilty in Brisbane District Court of rape, digital rape and indecent dealing with girl, aged 14, in 2000 at Nerang, south of Brisbane.) or the former pastor of Presbyterian Church of Mount Kisco The eight charges, unveiled at the presbytery's regional meeting at Webb Horton Memorial Presbyterian Church in Middletown, outline abuse of boys under 18. Among the allegations are that Miller invited a child into the shower with him, that he had oral sex with a minor on numerous occasions over two years and that he made inappropriate sexual remarks and propositions. (THE JOURNAL NEWS, December 5, 2002)) or Jeffrey Cheseboro Presbyterian youth minister at the Presbytery of Elizabeth at Pluckemin -- are they Christian?

7. I won't judge on these Presbyterian molesters except to say that I hope God has mercy on them and brings them to repentence. I say the same for the 1 %of bad priests, for the scout masters for the pastor of the ECUSA who said "abortion is a blessing" (actually wait, I don't say any good about that lady, I can't).

8. Mafia hit men, Russian Mafia, gangsters from various Protestant groups -- there were many from varied groups. Are they Christian? What if they as you say "have a personal relationship with Christ" or "confess their sins to God and accept Christ as their personal saviour" or "talk in tongues and confess God"? are they Christian? I think their actions disqualify them as representatives yet Christ came for sinners. If they put their faith and trust in Jesus Christ, I will leave their fate to their Maker.

9About Pelosi, I believe she should be hounded out and publically excommunicated yes, and I believe that her actions supporting baby murder no longer qualify her to be called Christian, let alone Catholic, hence I don't refer to her by either term. I'd rather call her CINO, Christian in Name only.

10. And, finally to the end point of this discussion which I indicated in points 1 and 2 -- the Nicene Creed perfectly encapsulates what we understand of the person and sacrifice of Christ. Groups that do not hold to this Creed are Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, Unitarians, etc. -- all of us here acknowledge that we do not consider these to be Christian. They may be good people, but they deny the divinity of Christ which we consider fundamental to our understanding of Christianity -- correct?
7,014 posted on 01/12/2011 1:04:24 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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