The LDS vision of themselves:
The LDS membership in real terms:
Posted on 10/15/2010 5:39:02 PM PDT by delacoert
|
Most of us have had a Mormon Missionary knock at our door. If you have ever invited them in and listened to a presentation of their beliefs, you probably found most but not all of what they said very similar to those beliefs held by Christians. However, while trying to convince you that your Church is wrong and the Mormon Church is right, there are several points they intentionally leave out. Below is a list of Mormon beliefs the missionaries will be reluctant to tell you about: |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that the God they worship was not always God. |
|
"We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea, and take away the veil, so that you may see." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 345) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that they believe Jesus Christ is the spirit brother of Satan: |
|
"The appointment of Jesus to be the Savior of the world was contested by one of the other sons of God. He was called Lucifer, son of the morning. Haughty, ambitious, and covetous of power and glory, this spirit-brother of Jesus desperately tried to become the Savior of mankind." (Milton R. Hunter, Gospel Through the Ages, pg.15) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that, according to Mormonism, Jesus Christ was a polygamist. |
|
"I discover that some of the Eastern papers represent me as a great blasphemer, because I said, in my lecture on Marriage, at our last Conference, that Jesus Christ was married at Cana of Galilee, that Mary, Martha, and others were his wives, and that he begat children." (Orson Hyde, Journal of Discourses 2:210) |
|
|
|
The grand reason of the burst of public sentiment in anathemas upon Christ and his disciples, causing his crucifixion, was evidently based upon polygamy, according to the testimony of the philosophers who rose in that age. A belief in the doctrine of a plurality of wives caused the persecution of Jesus and his followers. We might almost think they were 'Mormons'" (Jedediah M. Grant, Journal of Discourses, 1:346) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that for at least half a century church leaders were teaching that Adam was really God and the only God with whom we have to do. |
|
"Now hear it, O inhabitants of the earth, Jew and Gentile, Saint and sinner! When our father Adam came into the garden of Eden, he came into it with a celestial body, and brought Eve, one of his wives, with him. He helped to make and organize this world. He is Michael, the Archangel, the Ancient of Days! about whom holy men have written and spoken--He is our Father, and our God, and the only God with whom we have to do." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 1:50) |
|
|
|
"I have learned by experience that there is but one God that pertains to this people and he is the god that pertains to this earth--The first man. That first man sent his own son to redeem the world..."(Heber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses 4:1) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that Brigham Young, who held the office of President of the Mormon church longer than any other man, taught that men must practice polygamy in order to become Gods. |
|
"The only men who become Gods, even the Sons of God, are those who enter into polygamy." (Journal of Discourses 11:269) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that the book of Mormon fails to contain any Mormon doctrine |
|
Many portions of this Mormon Scripture even contradicts Mormon theology. |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you about their secret temple ceremonies which, until April 1990, portrayed Christian ministers as hirelings of Satan. Nor will they tell you about the sacred underwear they are wearing which, they believe, actually protects them. |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that Mormon leaders have taught that Jesus was conceived by way of a sexual relationship between God and Mary. |
|
"..how are children begotten? I answer just as Jesus Christ was begotten of his father. The difference between Jesus Christ and other men is this: Our fathers in the flesh are mortal men, who are subject unto death: but the Father of Jesus Christ in the flesh is the god of Heaven" (Joseph F. Smith, Family Home Evening Manual, 1972, pg. 125) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that they believe the bible has been corrupted throughout the centuries and cannot be trusted fully by itself. |
|
"I believe the Bible as it read when it came from the pen of the original writers. Ignorant translators, careless transcribers, or designing and corrupt priests have committed many errors." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph smith, pg.327) |
|
"But the Bible has been robbed of its plainness; many sacred books having been lost, others rejected by the Romish Church, and what few we have left, were copied and recopied so many times, that it is admitted that almost every verse has been corrupted and mutilated to that degree that any two of them read alike." (Orson Pratt, The Seer, pg.213) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that the Book of Mormon and the Doctrine and Covenants, which they claim to be both sacred and without error, contradict each other many times. |
|
For example, in the Book of Mormon, God called David and Solomon's act of polygamy an abomination, whereas in the Doctrine and Covenants He claims to justify it. Jacob 2:24 in the Book of Mormon says, "Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord." Section 132:1 in the Doctrine and Covenants, however, states: "Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you my servant Joseph, that inasmuch as you have inquired of my hand to know and understand wherein I, the Lord, justified my servants Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as also Moses, David and Solomon, my servants, as touching the principle and doctrine of their having many wives and concubines." |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that they use Christian terms with Mormon meanings. |
|
For example, a Mormon would probably agree with you that a person must be born again. To the Mormon, however, "born again" is a process which begins with water baptism. Another example are the words "salvation" and exaltation," which are synonymous in the Christian's mind. However, general salvation to the Mormon merely means the resurrection which everyone in the world will receive at death. Exaltation, or individual salvation, is the reward earned by the Mormon by following the laws of the Moron church. "Eternal Life" to the Mormon means Godhood. Regarding the word "scriptures," the Christian thinks of the Holy Bible while the Mormon could be thinking of not only the Bible but the Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants and Pearl of Great Price as well. |
|
|
|
They won't want to tell you that in order to gain entrance into the highest form of Mormon heaven, the Celestial kingdom, you must accept Joseph Smith, Jr. as a prophet of god. Faith in Jesus alone, Mormonism teaches, will force you to spend eternity in a lower form of heaven. |
|
|
|
Tenth LDS President Joseph Fielding Smith stated in his book, doctrines of Salvation, that there is "No salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. The word "salvation," used in this context, must really mean "exaltation" because former Mormon apostle Bruce R. McConkie stated in his book Mormon Doctrine that general salvation is given to everyone regardless of belief. Personal salvation or exaltation to the highest form of Mormon heaven comes only by accepting Joseph Smith as a prophet of god and by following the laws of the LDS church. |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that their founder, Joseph Smith, Jr., made many false prophecies which, according to the Bible, would classify him as a false prophet rather than a true prophet of God. |
|
|
|
For instance, in 1835 Smith claimed that the Lord would again come in just 56 years. We would gather from this "prophecy" that Jesus Christ would again come to earth on or before 1891; no doubt Joseph Smith was incorrect (History of the church 2:182). In 1832 Joseph Smith claimed he had a revelation concerning the building of a temple in Independence, Missouri. According to section 84, verses 4 and 5, of the Doctrine and Covenants, he stated this "temple shall be reared in this generation. For verily this generation shall not pass away until an house shall be built unto the Lord, and a cloud shall rest upon it..." to this day the spot consecrated by Smith fails to be the sight of a great temple, but instead is covered with a well-kept lawn. In fact, the Mormon church does not even own the land. |
We wouldn’t have an issue with the LDS, except they not only want to be called Christians, they believe they are the only ‘true’ church. If they quit trying to co-opt Christ and replace Him with a watered down version (created being, spirit brother of Satan, not omnipotent, had to earn his Godhood, a lesser god), then we would be so adamant. But since they want to be considered equal to us (Christians) then we MUST investigate their beliefs and compare them to the Bible and they are found very wanting.
We agree they have a right to worship as they please, we also have a right to preach against their false teachings. Freedom of Religion works both ways.
Jesus is The Word made flesh Who dwelt among us. He is the Redeemer, the Great High Priest by Whom a believer/faither in Him needs no other atonement made for sin. Mormonism teaches a very different gospel and the god the father of Mormonism is taught as having 'gained' the attributes of godhood, having been a man who became exalted. And that's just scratching the surface of the heresies in mormonism!
So I'll ask again the same questions which generated your diversionary response. And I'll add, do you think ecumenism is the best way to bring people along to a saving knowledge of Jesus The Christ?
So your real issue is Is 14:16.
I will read that passage over and get back to you.
I take off my glasses and take out my hearing aids before going to bed, that way I can neither see nor hear my dreams.
At least you just learned about it, I LIVED it. (shudder).
The Mormans sure are reluctant a lot!
Leave them alone! Never!
“I marvel that ye are so soon removed from Him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that that which we have preached unto to let him be accursed.
As we said before, so say you I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.”
(Galatians 1:6-10)
Catholics have indulgences, voting people in as Saints, purgatory and transubstantiation just to name just a few (none of which is biblical). Yet I don’t see Catholic bashing on here much. I wonder why?
The LDS vision of themselves:
The LDS membership in real terms:
Funny.
This is what I am called to do here. And I am not on FR as much as I used to be because I am now working in counter-cult ministry full time (unpaid).
And unlike me, you were never Mormon and don’t know what they believe so you don’t know that I am judging unjustly or not now do you?
Reads the entire chapter in Isaiah and in the context about which he was writing. Then look at what Jesus said of Himself in addressing the Churches, found in Revelations. Lucifer was the name given to the phrase in Isaiah, but the person being described was a real king troubling the region, not satan of angel evil.
We don't HATE Mormons.
As Christians we are to be “ambassadors” for Christ. That is an obligation of a Christian.
How do you think Christianity survived if we didn't speak of it or debate others who might be curious about it or think we were wrong?
To convert is a CHOICE. No one is forcing anyone to CONVERT to anything by discussing Christianity or Mormonism. Surely people have more confidence in their beliefs or lack of belief to discuss this topic.
I could debate with a few other religions and not be the least intimidated or feel as though I should CONVERT to another belief. If a person doesn't want to debate their belief or be part of this discussion, they are free to leave the thread and people will still “respect them”.
I smell troll, I smell people sowing ill feelings. Or nutcases. Not sure which. But tolerance is in short supply lately. ANd I don’t know that the kind of info spouted of here by some people converts anyone or does anything other than spread a kind of insular paranoid reality.
- - - - - -
Here, let me enlighten you. The ‘anti Mormon’ group on here has seen at least 3 people leave Mormonism, two of which have become Born Again Christians and one who returned to the Catholic faith of her youth, so people are being converted by this.
Second, why would Christians be ‘tolerant’ (such a PC term) of a group that tells us we are all ‘apostates’ and of the devil at the same time saying they are the only ‘true Christians’ while spouting heresies and secret handshakes?
I love Mormons too much to let them be and let them go to Hell. This isn’t about minor points of doctrine, the differences between the LDS and Christianity are HUGE and salvific.
“Who knows what the point of this is?”
This is posted in the Religion Forum. I think they talk about Religion here...
I will need some time to do that properly.
I do see what you are saying ...
In Isa 14:12-16 (KJV, NKJV), why is Lucifer mentioned here?
A: The Hebrew term here is “shining one”, and the name Lucifer means “shining one”, so Jerome, in translating the Vulgate, put the name Lucifer in here.
The NASB says “star of the morning”,
the NIV says “morning star”,
the NRSV says “day star”,
and Green’s Literal Translation says “shining star”,
the Septuagint says “dawn-bringer” and
the Syriac Peshitta says the name ‘Aylel.
http://www.biblequery.org/isa.htm
Now I will need to read the passage.
Having a nice day is a revoltingly misguided fake politeness.
Having a nice day is a revoltingly misguided fake politeness.
Gee, you sound like you support a Mosque near 9/11, or is that somehow different?
“Mormons have a perfect right to believe what they believe in a free country, to state it however they wish and to be as different from you as they wish.”
I agree.
Freedom of religion also means that when mormonism condemns Christianity and perverts its teachings, Christians have the freedom of religion to point it out.
Exactly. Freedom. Speech. Religion.
I don’t see a problem with allowing freedom.
Thank you , you exlain it well.
And loving thy neighbor also means respecting thy neighbor and thus not trying to convert him.
- - - - - -
Ummmm....no it does not. Nowhere in the Bible does it say that. If fact, loving someone means telling them the truth about Salvation through Jesus.
Are you a Universalist? Or a Mason?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.