Posted on 10/15/2010 5:39:02 PM PDT by delacoert
|
Most of us have had a Mormon Missionary knock at our door. If you have ever invited them in and listened to a presentation of their beliefs, you probably found most but not all of what they said very similar to those beliefs held by Christians. However, while trying to convince you that your Church is wrong and the Mormon Church is right, there are several points they intentionally leave out. Below is a list of Mormon beliefs the missionaries will be reluctant to tell you about: |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that the God they worship was not always God. |
|
"We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea, and take away the veil, so that you may see." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pg. 345) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that they believe Jesus Christ is the spirit brother of Satan: |
|
"The appointment of Jesus to be the Savior of the world was contested by one of the other sons of God. He was called Lucifer, son of the morning. Haughty, ambitious, and covetous of power and glory, this spirit-brother of Jesus desperately tried to become the Savior of mankind." (Milton R. Hunter, Gospel Through the Ages, pg.15) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that, according to Mormonism, Jesus Christ was a polygamist. |
|
"I discover that some of the Eastern papers represent me as a great blasphemer, because I said, in my lecture on Marriage, at our last Conference, that Jesus Christ was married at Cana of Galilee, that Mary, Martha, and others were his wives, and that he begat children." (Orson Hyde, Journal of Discourses 2:210) |
|
|
|
The grand reason of the burst of public sentiment in anathemas upon Christ and his disciples, causing his crucifixion, was evidently based upon polygamy, according to the testimony of the philosophers who rose in that age. A belief in the doctrine of a plurality of wives caused the persecution of Jesus and his followers. We might almost think they were 'Mormons'" (Jedediah M. Grant, Journal of Discourses, 1:346) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that for at least half a century church leaders were teaching that Adam was really God and the only God with whom we have to do. |
|
"Now hear it, O inhabitants of the earth, Jew and Gentile, Saint and sinner! When our father Adam came into the garden of Eden, he came into it with a celestial body, and brought Eve, one of his wives, with him. He helped to make and organize this world. He is Michael, the Archangel, the Ancient of Days! about whom holy men have written and spoken--He is our Father, and our God, and the only God with whom we have to do." (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 1:50) |
|
|
|
"I have learned by experience that there is but one God that pertains to this people and he is the god that pertains to this earth--The first man. That first man sent his own son to redeem the world..."(Heber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses 4:1) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that Brigham Young, who held the office of President of the Mormon church longer than any other man, taught that men must practice polygamy in order to become Gods. |
|
"The only men who become Gods, even the Sons of God, are those who enter into polygamy." (Journal of Discourses 11:269) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that the book of Mormon fails to contain any Mormon doctrine |
|
Many portions of this Mormon Scripture even contradicts Mormon theology. |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you about their secret temple ceremonies which, until April 1990, portrayed Christian ministers as hirelings of Satan. Nor will they tell you about the sacred underwear they are wearing which, they believe, actually protects them. |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that Mormon leaders have taught that Jesus was conceived by way of a sexual relationship between God and Mary. |
|
"..how are children begotten? I answer just as Jesus Christ was begotten of his father. The difference between Jesus Christ and other men is this: Our fathers in the flesh are mortal men, who are subject unto death: but the Father of Jesus Christ in the flesh is the god of Heaven" (Joseph F. Smith, Family Home Evening Manual, 1972, pg. 125) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that they believe the bible has been corrupted throughout the centuries and cannot be trusted fully by itself. |
|
"I believe the Bible as it read when it came from the pen of the original writers. Ignorant translators, careless transcribers, or designing and corrupt priests have committed many errors." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph smith, pg.327) |
|
"But the Bible has been robbed of its plainness; many sacred books having been lost, others rejected by the Romish Church, and what few we have left, were copied and recopied so many times, that it is admitted that almost every verse has been corrupted and mutilated to that degree that any two of them read alike." (Orson Pratt, The Seer, pg.213) |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that the Book of Mormon and the Doctrine and Covenants, which they claim to be both sacred and without error, contradict each other many times. |
|
For example, in the Book of Mormon, God called David and Solomon's act of polygamy an abomination, whereas in the Doctrine and Covenants He claims to justify it. Jacob 2:24 in the Book of Mormon says, "Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord." Section 132:1 in the Doctrine and Covenants, however, states: "Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you my servant Joseph, that inasmuch as you have inquired of my hand to know and understand wherein I, the Lord, justified my servants Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as also Moses, David and Solomon, my servants, as touching the principle and doctrine of their having many wives and concubines." |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that they use Christian terms with Mormon meanings. |
|
For example, a Mormon would probably agree with you that a person must be born again. To the Mormon, however, "born again" is a process which begins with water baptism. Another example are the words "salvation" and exaltation," which are synonymous in the Christian's mind. However, general salvation to the Mormon merely means the resurrection which everyone in the world will receive at death. Exaltation, or individual salvation, is the reward earned by the Mormon by following the laws of the Moron church. "Eternal Life" to the Mormon means Godhood. Regarding the word "scriptures," the Christian thinks of the Holy Bible while the Mormon could be thinking of not only the Bible but the Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants and Pearl of Great Price as well. |
|
|
|
They won't want to tell you that in order to gain entrance into the highest form of Mormon heaven, the Celestial kingdom, you must accept Joseph Smith, Jr. as a prophet of god. Faith in Jesus alone, Mormonism teaches, will force you to spend eternity in a lower form of heaven. |
|
|
|
Tenth LDS President Joseph Fielding Smith stated in his book, doctrines of Salvation, that there is "No salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. The word "salvation," used in this context, must really mean "exaltation" because former Mormon apostle Bruce R. McConkie stated in his book Mormon Doctrine that general salvation is given to everyone regardless of belief. Personal salvation or exaltation to the highest form of Mormon heaven comes only by accepting Joseph Smith as a prophet of god and by following the laws of the LDS church. |
|
|
|
They will be reluctant to tell you that their founder, Joseph Smith, Jr., made many false prophecies which, according to the Bible, would classify him as a false prophet rather than a true prophet of God. |
|
|
|
For instance, in 1835 Smith claimed that the Lord would again come in just 56 years. We would gather from this "prophecy" that Jesus Christ would again come to earth on or before 1891; no doubt Joseph Smith was incorrect (History of the church 2:182). In 1832 Joseph Smith claimed he had a revelation concerning the building of a temple in Independence, Missouri. According to section 84, verses 4 and 5, of the Doctrine and Covenants, he stated this "temple shall be reared in this generation. For verily this generation shall not pass away until an house shall be built unto the Lord, and a cloud shall rest upon it..." to this day the spot consecrated by Smith fails to be the sight of a great temple, but instead is covered with a well-kept lawn. In fact, the Mormon church does not even own the land. |
it was real fear,-—OK, thank you The Jews should not have done that.
I maintain I believe I have a pretty good idea of the poster's soul, and would also maintain that the poster has little idea of mine.
If I had to choose between an L. Ron Hubbard clone, Mitt, a Hare Krishna adherent, a Wicca practitioner, and a Muslim, I'd write somebody else in.
You know, we really don't have to choose a cultist or occultist.
What? Are they riding their bikes around 2-by-2 with white shirts & ties & backpacks selling those things again?
(Just have the Mormons conjure up the spirit of Martin Luther, since they have dead folks visit their temples frequently, and he can pound another 95 theses on the RC doors Oct. 31...like he did almost 500 years ago!)
voting people in as Saints,
I'm an Evangelical; not Catholic...but from what I understand...while I don't like saints in heaven being treated as intermediaries in place the Christ, the "voting" you mention is called canonization. And basically, just as the process of canonizing the distinct books of the Bible wasn't so much a "vote" as it was a confirmation of what was already recognized as "Scripture" by the church, I think some parallel descriptions should carry over to how the RC church treats saints.
IOW the RC church in many of these cases is simply recognizing/confirming who was already impactful via their lives. It's not like these saints are alive and are auditioning for this status -- unlike Mormons who are auditioning for godhood status, which pollutes even the good works they do because it can be a boomerang bounce-back done for their own sake/own glory purposes!
...purgatory...
If you compare RC teaching of purgatory to Mormon teaching about Baptism of the dead, what Mormons regard as "second-chance post-death salvation opportunities" I think the false security and terrible implications of Baptism for the dead are much, much worse than the teaching of purgatory. I'm not defending purgatory as a teaching. I'm simply contrasting and comparing.
and transubstantiation just to name just a few (none of which is biblical). Yet I don’t see Catholic bashing on here much. I wonder why?
I don't believe in transubstantiation. But you know what? When you read Jesus' words in John 6:32-68, it seems at least the RC are closer to upholding what Jesus taught there than many Christian churches which treat communion/The Lord's Supper/Eucharist in 100% symbolic terms.
My question to you: As you read the end of John 6, as Jesus was losing some of his wider pool of disciples over this teaching, did He say, "Hey, come on back. I was only talking symbolically?"
No He didn't. He let them leave their role as His followers over it. That would seem to tell me that whatever the true teaching is on this subject, that both RC and some Christian churches need to move toward each other...
John 6:32-68:
32Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, it is not Moses who has given you the bread from heaven, but it is my Father who gives you the true bread from heaven. 33For the bread of God is he who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world." 34"Sir," they said, "from now on give us this bread." 35Then Jesus declared, "I am the bread of life. He who comes to me will never go hungry, and he who believes in me will never be thirsty. 36But as I told you, you have seen me and still you do not believe. 37All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. 38For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all that he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day." 41At this the Jews began to grumble about him because he said, "I am the bread that came down from heaven." 42They said, "Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How can he now say, 'I came down from heaven'?" 43"Stop grumbling among yourselves," Jesus answered. 44"No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. 45It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me. 46No one has seen the Father except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father. 47I tell you the truth, he who believes has everlasting life. 48I am the bread of life. 49Your forefathers ate the manna in the desert, yet they died. 50But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which a man may eat and not die. 51I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world." 52Then the Jews began to argue sharply among themselves, "How can this man give us his flesh to eat?" 53Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. 54Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. 56Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in him. 57Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me. 58This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your forefathers ate manna and died, but he who feeds on this bread will live forever." 59He said this while teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum. Many Disciples Desert Jesus 60On hearing it, many of his disciples said, "This is a hard teaching. Who can accept it?" 61Aware that his disciples were grumbling about this, Jesus said to them, "Does this offend you? 62What if you see the Son of Man ascend to where he was before! 63The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life. 64Yet there are some of you who do not believe." For Jesus had known from the beginning which of them did not believe and who would betray him. 65He went on to say, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled him." 66From this time many of his disciples turned back and no longer followed him. 67"You do not want to leave too, do you?" Jesus asked the Twelve. 68Simon Peter answered him, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69We believe and know that you are the Holy One of God."
LOL
(And now Hickman and especially Rockwell are "Western folk heroes" among many contemporary Mormons...a restaurant named after Porter in Utah, a favorable book about him by a descendant of his, other favorable media products etc.)
MHG, I know some of the problems here. And commentators certainly disagree. But if you look at Ezekiel 28, describing an earthly king, you have the exact same issues. Except there this "ruler of Tyre" was in the Garden of Eden and is labeled a "cherub" and had many qualities only Satan could don:
12 "Son of man, take up a lament concerning the king of Tyre and say to him: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: " 'You were the model of perfection, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty. 13 You were in Eden, the garden of God; every precious stone adorned you: ruby, topaz and emerald, chrysolite, onyx and jasper, sapphire, turquoise and beryl. Your settings and mountings were made of gold; on the day you were created they were prepared. 14 You were anointed as a guardian cherub, for so I ordained you. You were on the holy mount of God; you walked among the fiery stones. 15 You were blameless in your ways from the day you were created till wickedness was found in you. (Eze. 28:11-15)
Anyway, if you rule out Isaiah 14 because of its reference to an earthly ruler, then why not the same in Eze 28?
(Have all of the various churches' missionaries got your memo about this yet? So they can all return home to their families?)
Oh, and BTW, that includes 52,000 Lds missionaries out and about at this time. (I guess your slam about their "disrespectfulness" applies to Mormon missionaries, too, eh?)
Well, then, cajungirl, are you "running" for the Tolerance Pied Piper position? Maybe Obama can appoint you as the "Tolerance Czar." That's assuming, that is, that you have an overabundance of tolerance.
But wait a minute. You don't seem to be overly "tolerant" about a lot of religious opinions being expressed on this thread. So tell us. If people are supposed to be "tolerant" of Mormon beliefs, no matter what they are, why aren't you modeling "tolerance" for us re: other religious beliefs being expressed on this thread, no matter what they are?
Isn't "tolerance" an equal-opportunity employer? Or is it that your "tolerance" signs being erected say "One Way Street. Do not Enter"???
ANd I don’t know that the kind of info spouted of here by some people converts anyone...
(Oh. We're sorry. You didn't send us a memo that your sense of Sovereign Omniscience needed daily updates on this...either that, or since we assumed you knew it all already, anyway, that you didn't need such updates...either way, we'll correct that problem and from now on, will report all internal, in-the-heart conversions to you...once we find out how to be sovereign enough to discern that, that is)
I agree with you, BigSky. Surely, if one does not like Mormon doctrine, one can give it a miss. Most of them seem to be pure living and hard working people, and they are willing to found families, which is a blessing in itself.
Their undies seem to cause a storm of hatred. But I do not care. The explanation which I heard (from a Mormon lady, not someone who had a case against them), is that “the garment” is worn by both men and women, and is a reminder to keep chaste.
Although their training, and abstaining from some drinks,etc., might seem odd, the truth is that most religions impose rituals and prohibitions on people. In fact, following such rules can be of benefit and give a bit of structure to life.
My wife is/was Mormon. No longer active in the church so is not authorized to wear her garments.
The Mormons also believe that we were married before we came to the earthly realm.
They also believe that there was a great Mormon civilization in America long ago and that the second coming will be in Independence, Missouri.
The believe the Meso American deity Quetzacoatl was in fact Jesus.
Tried going there for services once, not for me. Too much emphasis on Joseph Smith being deified.
Tolerance is not equity.
Worship as you please but first above all it is a Christian nation. Ny the words of the Savior himself Christians are to “go ye unto all the world” to spread the faith and we are instructed BY GOD HIMSELF, to contend for and defend the faith, point out flase teachers and snatch from the fire the lost.
Sadly that entire concept seems to be getting lost in the politically correct “don't offend anybody” ways that have become the current fashion.
And it is destroying this nation and taking us further and further away from his good graces.
There’s a lot of misinformation out there—this thread included... I do hope though that you will take the opportunity though to learn firsthand what we share about the Lord Jesus Christ. If you are interested, the Church’s websites are good place to start:
http://lds.org
http://lds.org/conference/display/0,5234,23-1,00.html
http://scriptures.lds.org/
This talk is a good one too:
http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?hideNav=1&locale=0&sourceId=1e31a1615ac0c010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD
This is what we believe about the bible:
http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?hideNav=1&locale=0&sourceId=e4a1b5658af22110VgnVCM100000176f620a____&vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD
Because there is a lot of miss information out there, I’d suggest checking-out the church firsthand: http://lds.org.
As a Mormon, I can affirm that I am on the right road—and that road leads to Christ.
“For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.” Romans 1:16 (KJV)
It’s unfortunate that there’s a lot of misinformation out there on the web about what Mormon’s believe—including in this thread.
Lds.org is a good place to learn firsthand:
http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?hideNav=1&locale=0&sourceId=00d51b3e50cf5110VgnVCM100000176f620a____&vgnextoid=f318118dd536c010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD
There is no basis of truth to that claim whatsoever:
Anyone who knows ANYTHING about Mormonism would know otherwise.
It is true only to the point that our view of the Godhead breaks with post–New Testament Christian history:
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.