Art Vanick on Glenn Beck and Mormonism

Out of Mormonism ^

[Amerisrael]

Art Vanick, co-author of The Spalding Enigma, Who Really Wrote The Book of Mormon, makes an appearance on Out of Mormonism to address the Glenn Beck Restoring Honor Rally.

Andy, Art, and Roger discuss the ramifications of the rally from a biblical Christian perspective.

Do Christians understand that Mormonism is different than biblical Christianity?

[ These are two separate "Out of Mormonism" radio podcasts from Mesa, Arizona. Very interesting.]

While Mormonism may not pose the violent / stealth and political threat that Islam does, from a spiritual standpoint, it is just as dangerous.

[Elsie]

More word games yay!

[Elsie]

Pshaw!

—MormonDude(Get real! That stuff ain’t SCRIPTURE!)

[Elsie]

What a joke. SZ has forthrightly asked you questions that you refuse to answer. We all see it.

[Elsie]

...Mormons with their arsenal of regurgitated propaganda...

[Elsie]

Just post links and say you gave an answer.

[Elsie]

I have given you all you need to research these claims.

And our RESEARCH has proven that MORMONism is a heresy.

Got any facts to DENY it?

[Elsie]

Go to http://www.fairlds.org/ and search Jesus Married.

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So THIS is a place that you send folks to find out about MORMONism?

 

Are you REALLY this STUPID?

 

 

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[Elsie]

Says the man with his head in the sand.

At least sand won't leave him with a smelly head - unlike MORMON apologetics!

[Elsie]

Marriage between a man and a woman; reinforced by Elder Boyd K. Packer in Sunday's General conference.

Now THIS is one hell of a leadoff line!

Don't you REALIZE what your GOD has COMMANDED?

[Elsie]

 

To even mention Mormonism and Islam in the same breath is outrageous.

 

 

Hey!

 

We don't LAY the eggs: we just COLOR them!

 

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In the heat of the Missouri “Mormon War” of 1838, Joseph Smith made the following claim,

“I will be to this generation a second Mohammed, whose motto in treating for peace was ‘the Alcoran [Koran] or the Sword.’ So shall it eventually be with us—‘Joseph Smith or the Sword!’ ”[1]

It is most interesting that a self-proclaimed Christian prophet would liken himself to Mohammed, the founder of Islam. His own comparison invites us to take a closer look as well. And when we do, we find some striking—and troubling—parallels. Consider the following.

· Mohammed and Joseph Smith both had humble beginnings. Neither had formal religious connections or upbringing, and both were relatively uneducated. Both founded new religions by creating their own scriptures. In fact, followers of both prophets claim these scriptures are miracles since their authors were the most simple and uneducated of men.[2]

· Both prophets claim of having angel visitations, and of receiving divine revelation to restore pure religion to the earth again. Mohammed was told that both Jews and Christians had long since corrupted their scriptures and religion. In like manner, Joseph Smith was told that all of Christianity had become corrupt, and that consequently the Bible itself was no longer reliable. In both cases, this corruption required a complete restoration of both scripture and religion. Nothing which preceded either prophet could be relied upon any longer. Both prophets claim they were used of God to restore eternal truths which once existed on earth, but had been lost due to human corruption.

· Both prophets created new scripture which borrowed heavily from the Bible, but with a substantially new “spin.” In his Koran, Mohammed appropriates a number of Biblical themes and characters—but he changes the complete sense of many passages, claiming to “correct” the Bible. In so doing he changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place. In like manner, Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, much of which is plagiarized directly from the King James Bible. Interestingly, the Book of Mormon claims that this same Bible has been substantially corrupted and is therefore unreliable. In addition, Joseph Smith went so far as to actually create his own version of the Bible itself, the “Inspired Version,” in which he both adds and deletes significant portions of text, claiming he is “correcting” it. In so doing he also changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place.

· As a part of their new scriptural “spin,” both prophets saw themselves as prophesied in scripture, and both saw themselves as a continuation of a long line of Biblical prophets. Mohammed saw himself as a continuation of the ministry of Moses and Jesus. Joseph Smith saw himself as a successor to Enoch, Melchizedek, Joseph and Moses. Joseph Smith actually wrote himself into his own version of the Bible—by name.

· Both prophets held up their own scripture as superior to the Bible. Mohammed claimed that the Koran was a perfect copy of the original which was in heaven. The Koran is therefore held to be absolutely perfect, far superior to the Bible and superceding it. In like manner, Joseph Smith also made the following claim. “I told the Brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding its precepts, than by any other book.”[3]

· Despite their claim that the Bible was corrupt, both prophets admonished their followers to adhere to its teachings. An obvious contradiction, this led to selective acceptance of some portions and wholesale rejection of others. As a result, the Bible is accepted by both groups of followers only to the extent that it agrees with their prophet’s own superior revelation.

· Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith taught that true salvation was to be found only in their respective religions. Those who would not accept their message were considered “infidels,” pagans or Gentiles. In so doing, both prophets became the enemy of genuine Christianity, and have led many people away from the Christ of the Bible.

· Both prophets encountered fierce opposition to their new religions and had to flee from town to town because of threats on their lives. Both retaliated to this opposition by forming their own militias. Both ultimately set up their own towns as model societies.

· Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith left unclear instructions about their successors. The majority of Mohammed’s followers, Sunni Muslims, believe they were to elect their new leader, whereas the minority, Shiite Muslims, believe Mohammed’s son was to be their next leader. Similarly, the majority of Joseph Smith’s followers, Mormons, believed their next prophet should have been the existing leader of their quorum of twelve apostles, whereas the minority, RLDS, believed Joseph Smith’s own son should have been their next prophet. Differences on this issue, and many others, have created substantial tension between these rival groups of each prophet.

· Mohammed taught that Jesus was just another of a long line of human prophets, of which he was the last. He taught that he was superior to Christ and superceded Him. In comparison, Joseph Smith also made the following claim.

“I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet.”[4]

 

Endnotes

[1] Joseph Smith made this statement at the conclusion of a speech in the public square at Far West, Missouri on October 14, 1838. This particular quote is documented in Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History, second edition, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1971), p. 230–231. Fawn Brodie’s footnote regarding this speech contains valuable information, and follows. “Except where noted, all the details of this chapter [16] are taken from the History of the [Mormon] Church. This speech, however, was not recorded there, and the report given here is based upon the accounts of seven men. See the affidavits of T.B. Marsh, Orson Hyde, George M. Hinkle, John Corrill, W.W. Phelps, Samson Avard, and Reed Peck in Correspondence, Orders, etc., pp. 57–9, 97–129. The Marsh and Hyde account, which was made on October 24, is particularly important. Part of it was reproduced in History of the [Mormon] Church, Vol. III, p. 167. See also the Peck manuscript, p. 80. Joseph himself barely mentioned the speech in his history; see Vol. III, p. 162.”

[MHGinTN]

Really now! You don't expect the blind followers daily twisting and deceiving at FR for a conman's fantasy religion to be honest, forthright, and consistent, do you? Wild goose chases, slight of hand, obfuscation, and blind sycophantic denial are the hallmarks of Mormonism as it was manufactured by the conman, sexual predator of married women, peepstone divination fraud, Joseph Smith.

Do you really expect people who believe the Book of Abraham fairy'tale' Smith imagined over an Egyptian hymn to the dead to be grounded in reality? Mormonism apologists are all about testifying of their feelings, not dealing in the reality set before them. Fortunately, only a few of these cult members are so determined to serve with their immortal souls the lies of a proven liar, conman, sexual predator, blasphemer. When the truth of Smith's and Young's actual teachings are exposed, some will awaken to the still small voice and come out of deceit and be free in Christ.

Please, we have ad nauseum examples of their efforts to impugn the Bible so their poorly written novel, the Book of Mormon, can be praised as 'another gospel'. And another gospel it is, the gospel of demonically inspire fiction known in Mormon circles as 'the doctrine of eternal progression'.

Are you not amazed at a squad of twisters who would worship a man who re-wrote the King James Bible, so he could fabricate a 'prophecy' of his 'coming forth in these latter days', yet these same airheads don't count conman-Smith's 'translation' of the King James Bible into King James English as one of their sacred texts?

Does the boldness with which they twist and denigrate the Bible not clue you in that these are the lost? These are the lost who will not be saved, but they are the means by which, as they are exposed for the deceit spewing goons they are, that some precious souls will come out from this mormonism/smithian fraud cult now straining nationally to be accepted as The true form of Christianity.

The Bible tells us plainly that some hearts are so darkened that God gives them up. But in witnessing their destruction, others may awaken to the reality that they've been fed lies by this cult. I'm still praying Glenn Beck can so awaken. I was not encouraged for Christian witness when many Christian leaders sank to endorsing Glenn as a Mormon born again. He may be born again, but his complete sell out to this cult's lies indicates otherwise.

God will judge Glenn Beck's heart/spirit, but we can and are taught to judge his actions and the 'gospel' he counts as his foundation. The opening remarks on 8/28 and his spurious treaching on 8/18 regarding the Indian mounds and Newark stones indicate he is lost in mormonism's lies.

[Elsie]

 Welcome to

MormonWiki

This is not an official website of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

 

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All material developed and placed on this page and associated subsections is copyrighted by Robert B. Vukich.

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[Elsie]

“Confernce” (Utah pronunciation) has a way of doing that.

Sittin' around between sessions, talking* about how those ANTIs on FR are making such inroads, MUST get discouraging!

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* (pissing and moaning would probably be considered coarse language)

[T Minus Four]

I too am interested in Eternal Progression. Is it true that your Heavenly Father is still progressing? How can God become MORE of a God. Just wondering.

[Elsie]

Also, I haven’t engaged in personal attacks.

HHMMmm...

[aMorePerfectUnion]

Normandy...

Your “testimony” is simply your opinion about your feelings. You credit God for your feelings, but so do ALL cultists.

You have provided
NO facts
NO evidence
NO logical argument

Just opinions about feelings.

Best ampu

[Elsie]

I suppose you could stretch some of my observations as such if you really wanted to but they were not meant to be.

AWww...

Your MORMON mind just can't control your HUMAN fingers; eh?

[greyfoxx39]

UG to caww: 

Please cite your sources where Mormons are colluding with the Islams and Muslim. I have no information on your ‘secret’ information, so please share.

Post #20 to which UG is responding:

You are in error on that matter.....LDS is kissing fanny with Islamic leadership. But of course the general membership would likely not be privy to that information unless presented as a "tolerance" issue to those of other faiths....the 'be nice to everyone crowd and they'll be nice to you.'....Unfortunately that is not how Islam looks at Mormons and they never will....however they will put on a good show...they always do.

Islamic leaders know that Mormons can be lead by the nose...they are already set up for that....and they know that Mormon leadership is interested in "peace" between them. (Though one should not loose sight that "Peace" to a Moslem is only thru Islam.) At any rate...Islam is interested in LDS co-operation...for obvious reasons they go after any groups where individuals can be easily mis-lead. Any who think that Islam leadership is foolish or dump has vastly underestimated their deception and their manner of achieving acceptance.

Sharia law would fit nicely into LDS in the beginning....minus the violence...the woman have their place, the men have their's and there are many rules and regulations in both Islam and Mormonism....the list could go on of the similarities...Islamic leadership identifies LDS as fertile ground for them...it is just a matter of time.

I don't see the word "collusion" in caww's post.

However, I ran a search at mormontimes.com on the word "muslim" with the following results and IMO "kissing fanny" is an apt description:

http://www.mormontimes.com/article/16673/LDS-church-gymnasium-open-for-Muslim-worship-services?s_cid=search_queue&utm_source=search_queue

 

LDS church gymnasium open for Muslim worship services

"The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, a Mormon church on Old Highway 94 in St. Charles,

 provides space every Friday in its gymnasium for Muslims to spread their prayer rugs and worship." (August 24, 2010)

 

http://www.mormontimes.com/article/631/BYU-publishes-classic-text-written-by-Islamic-philosopher?s_cid=search_queue&utm_source=search_queue

 

BYU publishes classic text written by Islamic philosopher

"The publication of Avicenna's work is "an acknowledgment of the great contributions Arabic and Islamic civilization have made to the world,"

Daniel C. Peterson said. "It is an expression of respect for Muslim tradition on the part of Latter-day Saints."

 

http://www.mormontimes.com/article/17289/Mormons-Muslims-get-along-by-creating-books-not-destroying-them?s_cid=search_queue&utm_source=search_queue

 

Mormons, Muslims get along by creating books, not destroying them

"The threat by Pastor Terry Jones to burn the Qur'an was all over the news. What if, instead of destroying Muslim books,

we were actually to create them, by translating the classic works of the Islamic golden age into English?

"That is the project Dan Peterson, a professor of Arabic at Brigham Young University has been engaged in for more than a decade,

 a project that has built tremendous goodwill and resulted in many lasting friendships between Muslims and those of the Mormon faith.

 

http://www.mormontimes.com/article/17020/McKay-Coppins-Why-I-defend-Muslims?s_cid=search_queue&utm_source=search_queue

 

McKay Coppins: Why I defend Muslims

 

http://www.mormontimes.com/article/16943/Muslim-Day-of-Dignity-observed-in-Baltimore?s_cid=search_queue&utm_source=search_queue

 

Muslim 'Day of Dignity' observed in Baltimore

"The Mormon Church donated some of the school supplies and all of the hygiene kits. While interfaith charity efforts are not uncommon,

the Muslim-Mormon team catches some people by surprise, Amin said."

 

http://www.mormontimes.com/article/16942/Orange-County-Calif-Muslims-Mormons-break-fast?s_cid=search_queue&utm_source=search_queueOrange

 

Orange County, Calif., Muslims, Mormons break fast (Sept. 7, 2010)

 

http://www.mormontimes.com/article/353/Make-LDS-part-of-Mideast-solution-rabbi-suggests?s_cid=search_queue&utm_source=search_queue

 

 

Make LDS part of Mideast solution, rabbi suggests

""If the (Quorum of the) Twelve were to approach the United States government and say,

'We really feel that the religious dimension should be engaged in any kind of process to seek a way

to bring about peace in the Holy Land' ... I think that would be very helpful," Rabbi David Rosen told an audience at BYU."

[Elsie]

I know that Joseph Smith was called of God to be a prophet — and through him the Church of Jesus Christ was restored in its fullness to the earth.

Whereas...

I know that Joseph Smith was called by someone to be a FALSE prophet — and through him, the Church of Jesus Christ was exposed to yet another heresy that claims ALL of Christianity to be corrupt and apostate.

[Elsie]

You need to go read your Bible as it starts way back in Genesis...

Genesis Chapter 3:

"Did God REALLY say..."