I ask myself, “If some of these Mormon leaders or members lied, therefore, what?” I reject a “therefore” which asserts or implies that this example shows that lying is morally permissible or that lying is a tradition or even a tolerated condition in the Mormon community or among the leaders of our church. That is not so.Elder Oaks does not justify "lying for the Lord." Far from it—he says that such behavior is sinful and impermissible.I suppose most mortals employ some exaggeration and a little of what someone called “innocent after-mindedness.” But does this mean we condone deliberate and important misrepresentations of fact in a circumstance in which they are clearly intended to be believed and relied upon? Never! Lying is sinful, as it has always been, and there is no exempt category for so-called “lying for the Lord.” Lying is simply outside the range of permitted or condoned conduct by Latter-day Saints—members or leaders.
So I must amend my previous statement about "lying for the Lord." Except for a speech by Elder Oaks in which he denounces the notion of "lying for the Lord," I have never known Latter-day Saints to use the phrase, much less recommend the practice.
More partial quotes that don’t tell the whole story from these guys? Imagine that. They often ask for examples of where they misrepresent. The last couple of days have provided a bevy of such examples.
Most of these guys are actually pretty bright folks and I believe good people. It’s a shame they feel the need to resort to these kinds of tactics, rather than a civil, reasoned discussion that would benefit all.
The ends must justify the means, regardless of what the means entail. Sad really
The simple fact that HE associates it with past practices - specifically polygamy - AND relates to it as an ONGOING PRACTICE speaks volumes in itself. He acknowledges it was an accepted practice.
Yes, he SAYS it is not permissible - yet the teaching and practice is NOT to tell the whole truth about things - milk before meat - isn't it logos.
One item stands out from Oak's talk
! Lying is sinful, as it has always been, and there is no exempt category for so-called “lying for the Lord.” Lying is simply outside the range of permitted or condoned conduct by Latter-day Saints—members or leaders.
Yet this WAS the conduct condoned by smith in regards to polygamy wasn't it. Smith and his inner circle lied about practicing it, the mormon church officially condemned the practice of polygamy during the very time Joseph practiced it.
I am glad you do not recommend the practice - are you going then commit to telling the whole truth or just the milk to avoid embarrassing doctrines of the mormon church
Perhaps you can illuminate the ends of the range alluded to?