Who are the Catholics: The Orthodox or The Romanists, or both?

Me

[the_conscience]

I just witnessed a couple of Orthodox posters get kicked off a "Catholic Caucus" thread. I thought, despite their differences, they had a mutual understanding that each sect was considered "Catholic". Are not the Orthodox considered Catholic? Why do the Romanists get to monopolize the term "Catholic"?

I consider myself to be Catholic being a part of the universal church of Christ. Why should one sect be able to use a universal concept to identify themselves in a caucus thread while other Christian denominations need to use specific qualifiers to identify themselves in a caucus thread?

[Petronski]

Mary did not sacrifice her son on the cross.

Nor did I say that.

You're just not very good with words, are you?

[Cronos]

Why would ANYONE willingly walk away from the Church and embrace heresy

I think you would have 3 classes of people in that:
1. Folks like Calvin etc. who did the work of the enemy and walked away from The Church
2. Those poor souls led astray by Calvin
3. Those descendents of the poor souls led astray, but now trying to defend their inheritance and they can only do this by attacking the good, i.e. The Church

[wagglebee]

Some people have intellectual ability, some people just know how to cut & paste or use HTML codes.

[Petronski]

It is the PRAYING and KNEELING and REQUESTS to the stone cold dead marble of the statues that is blaspehmy of which Rome should repent.

Thank God you're not describing the Catholic Church!

[Petronski]

I didn’t say they look similar.

Okay...

...I said they look like “the same person.”

And since they are NOT the same person, what you are saying--in different words--is that they look similar.

[Petronski]

I wish you would just come out and say what you really mean. . . .

That she hates the Catholic Church so much she cannot even utter its name?

[Quix]

Good, imho.

I think some might say . . . horror . . . abuses will abound etc.

. . . as though abuses don’t abound with the other struture. LOL.

[Quix]

Nobody prays to the depictions of the Reformers.
Nobody kneels to the depictions of the Reformers.

Nobody asks for anything from the Reformers.

And nobody would object to a statue of Mary just like they wouldn’t object to a statue of Jesus. It is the PRAYING and KNEELING and REQUESTS to the stone cold dead marble of the statues that is blaspehmy of which Rome should repent.

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Now, now, Dr E . . .

I suspect you know . . . the rabid cliques and more are not that interested in THE TRUTH.

They just have to DEFLECT the truth; dance around on the pin head of disingenuousness and throw dust in the air. Otherwise, they might have to replace their shattered mirrors and use one.

[Judith Anne]

Well said. Thank you.

“Who fits in my heart only by breaking it...” — just lovely.

[Quix]

FAR TOO TRUE.

I’ve never had blood children . . . but have had to sacrifice an extremely close emotional son or two. Horrendous.

However . . . I came into the world naked and will leave the same way. Nothing I’ve had to offer My Lord and God was inherently mine. Nothing was of my own creation or goodness. Anything I’ve offered God Almighty has been a RETURNed blessing that was His to begin with.

Mary’s “offering” was only her “REASONABLE SERVICE.”

She was obedient. Praise God. Her obedience was done.

Did she clutch Him to her as a controllable or even manipulatable possession?

No way.

He made clear HIS perspective when he evidently refused to go out to His Mother AND BROTHERS when they came to see him that time—noting that those who believed Him and The Father were his mother and brothers.

It still boggles my mind that such a GLARINGLY SIGNIFICANT SCRIPTURE FOR THAT CULTURE is missed, denied, rationalized into nothing etc. by folks most needing to receive it into their hearts.

I wonder how many billions of hours have been spent praying to Mary . . . robbing God of HIS RIGHTFUL FOCUS in the hearts, schedules and prayers of those who are supposedly putting HIM FIRST.

[Quix]

Dr. E. . . . maybe you can explain it to me . . .

Is there some sort of reverse manipulation thing going on here with the folks in the rabid cliques and maybe more . . .

Does this hand of Mary come down out of Heaven and flip a switch in their noggins turning major chunks of their brains off?

I’d have thought the stuff about ‘mental altar’ was self-evident. DOH!

Oh, that’s right. I forgot.

It wasn’t about altars or mental altars at all.

It was about shooting the messenger of truth.

Silly me.

[wagglebee]

I wasn’t aware that it was considered unusual for someone to look similar to one of their parents.

[MarkBsnr]

Just a Queen right?

The term we might use is Queen Mother; a role well documented in Scripture and in historical times right up through the Middle Ages in Europe.

[Quix]

I try. Thx.

Next, I expect to hear them accusing us of

Rosaries of encapsulated carpet lint in little glass spheres of holy water.

And they'll likely accuse us of hanging sphere's of encapsulated carpet lint from our mirrors as extra car insurance.

Then they'll likely accuse us of having encapsulated blue carpet lint to pray to and fondle as protection against respiratory diseases.

And maybe green encapsulated carpet lint to pray to and carress for lost articles.

And perhaps brown carpet lint to hang on poles around one's garden to insure a good crop.

And maybe red carpet lint for a red hot marriage.

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One kind of gets the impression that it's difficult to impossible for some to construe spiritual life without such . . . idolatrous 'aids' to worship.

Sigh.

Puke.

[Quix]

I think they figure she has a bigger, more comfortable

. . . lap.

[Quix]

It means you have FAILED yet again! The website you got that picture from is Cosepp Technology Online . The owner of the website appears to be a Catholic, but he certainly doesn’t speak for the Church
Looks like you FAILED to read my comment accurately, Wagglebee. I said the picture was from a “Roman Catholic’s website” and you have just agreed to that fact.

There are hundreds of variations of this picture with Mary standing on the entire planet earth with lightrays beaming from her arms. If the papacy doesn’t agree with this, tell it to the thousands of Roman Catholics who believe it.

They sure didn’t learn this error in a Christian church.

And somebody should report the following website and its 243,000+ visits to the See.

LADYOFALLNATIONS.ORG

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INDEED.

[Quix]

Of course I don’t think that.

I was speaking strictly of the structure more closely matching that depicted in I Cor 14.

[Quix]

INDEED . . . assuming that the clergy are faithful.

It is the responsibility of stewards of every “rank” . . . that they be faithful.

[MarkBsnr]

Altar?

It's what we call the front of the church--where the steps up to the stage plus about 12-15 feet in front of the steps (before the first row of seats), are.

That's one of the differences between us. We don't have a stage to be entertained on. We have a altar - which is a table, not a stage.

Folks--irregularly and as they individually wish . . . stand and pray there; stand and are prayed for with the laying on of hands there; . kneel there; recline against the steps there, praying; kneel at the steps; praying; . lie prostrate near the steps; lie prostrate near the first row of seats; dance between the first row of seats and steps;

You mean like these guys?

[Mad Dawg]

The whole psycho-dynamics of the Clergy — Laity thing is interesting and sometimes troubling. It’s also a real opportunity for growth on everybody’s part.

At least some of the same transactional stuff goes on whenever “card-carrying expert” encounters lay person. When I used to go out to shear small flocks I noted some of the same dependent/counter-dependent stuff I used to get when I was a clergyman.

What does one do, what do you do as a shrink, when you see that this client really has a NEED to adopt a dependent position. You can’t just blow him off. He’ll just go find somebody else to be dependent on. He’ll keep looking for someone who will enable him to avoid insight.

The only loving thing (if one has a PRAYER of having the skill and wisdumb) is patiently, slowly, carefully, prayerfully to try to comment on what’s going on until the picture comes together in the client’s mind, right? You’ve got to take the risk of allowing attachments (transference) to form to hold the client close enough to make abandoning the task almost as uncomfortable as accomplishing it.

IF you do that, somebody will say you’re making people dependent on you. If you don’t do it you won’t be much good to the client.

If you do that, you run the risk of crashing and burning. If you don’t do that, then what use has your life been anyway?

When I tell the joke about “Be quiet, I’m talking to your mother,” I’m looking around to see who doesn’t laugh. That just MIGHT be somebody on the verge of taking a step closer to Jesus. Maybe I can offer my arm for him to lean on.