Posted on 01/05/2010 9:46:47 PM PST by the_conscience
I just witnessed a couple of Orthodox posters get kicked off a "Catholic Caucus" thread. I thought, despite their differences, they had a mutual understanding that each sect was considered "Catholic". Are not the Orthodox considered Catholic? Why do the Romanists get to monopolize the term "Catholic"?
I consider myself to be Catholic being a part of the universal church of Christ. Why should one sect be able to use a universal concept to identify themselves in a caucus thread while other Christian denominations need to use specific qualifiers to identify themselves in a caucus thread?
Yes. Please provide the back up of such claims.
That's not the point...Is it offical Catholic doctrine or no...And what is the official Catholic doctrine...Is your religion silent on the topic???
And if it's not in your catechism, why would you tell people to read your catechism to find out???
I agree Zone...but as we also know they will follow a counterfeit, a falsehood, one who will deceives. And the world is ripe for his arrival. Look at the throngs that came out for BO...worldwide. No, I do not believe he is that one. He doesn't fit the bill. But the response of the international puplic is what I think it will look like when he does finally emerge.
Put it another way: Some on your side don't git what THEY THEMSELVES say.
Falsehoods?? Do you NOT bow and pray to anyone other then God through Christ?
I'm not sure that scholarly ethics are high on the values list of some of our antagonists. They are a law unto themselves -- as Calvin morphs into Nietzsche, and refusing to submit their wills to God they finally shoot out into the void where even obeying themselves is not an option.
ph
That's all you need to know. They say "It is known." We should crawl back under our rock because "it is known that many of those works are forgeries."
Why would I pick up on something I know not to be true???
And I got news for ya...What is San Francisco was at one time in Mexico just as Antioch was in Syria...Yes, it sits on the Orentes river and has been referred to by that name but it also was called Antioch of Syria...
I just can't believe the twists and turns you will go thru to try to look as being right...
That is what scares me. So many to follow that hollow being. What on earth will happen when the real anti-christ comes along?
That's precisely the point. It's not in the Catechism, even the original article has been pulled. Who is asserting it is Catholic doctrine?
Well, Since we are, some of us, condemned by our minds to be excluded from a full appreciation of the truth, the kind available only to the simple, I think YOU should tell us what we think.
Why this sudden reluctance to so what is the bread and butter of your sides argument, misstate what we think and then mock it, with little bouts of "They worship Diana of the Ephesians," thrown in to protect anyone from taking your side seriously.
Dawg,
It is really not an issue of “tradition”...ALL churches have some tradition. The question is one the reformation asked in its cry “sola scripture” is the tradition one that can be upheld by scripture? (like baptism, or singing in a service or reading the word)
Sola scripture does not mean no theological study or tradition or the use of books to enrich your spiritual life . It means the final standard to which all practices and intellectual spiritual pursuits is the scriptures..
The problem we see in religions that the mainstream see as cults, like the JWs or mormons or some 7th day adventists is they have added.
to the bible extra biblical beliefs, practices and books.
To a protestant Romans is the theological book of the bible, there he summarizes mans fallen condition , how God sees them and the remedy in Christ. Most of his other writings are teachings directed at particular problems...
BTW I also see no rebuke in Jesus words to his mother.. I think there is a place where he rebuked her, but not this one.
What I know is that this miracle was not a surprise..God had ordained it..especially in light of the fact, as a friend just pointed out on another thread... the miracle points to Christ’s cleansing of the sin of man.
I guess Paul won't fit in with your iconoclastic group, would he?
Acts 19: 8 He entered the synagogue, and for three months debated boldly with persuasive arguments about the kingdom of God. 9 But when some in their obstinacy and disbelief disparaged the Way before the assembly, he withdrew and took his disciples with him and began to hold daily discussions in the lecture hall of Tyrannus. 10 This continued for two years with the result that all the inhabitants of the province of Asia heard the word of the Lord, Jews and Greeks alike. 11 So extraordinary were the mighty deeds God accomplished at the hands of Paul 12 that when face cloths or aprons that touched his skin were applied to the sick, their diseases left them and the evil spirits came out of them.
So objects can be used to effect the benisons of God. Or will you condemn the writer of Acts as unChristian? Both Elijah and Elisha also are examples of God working through relics.
Now, for the Rosary. It is a prayer aid. You don't like prayer aids, you say, because you can read? The Rosary began when the majority of the people couldn't read and developed as a prayer aid; the icons (including the one of the Virgin Mary that St. Luke "painted" (actually they are written, not painted)) were developed when 1% or less of the people could read. Prayer aids?
1 Thessalonians 5:17 Pray without ceasing.
Praying? How Scriptural is the Rosary?
1) The "creed" or profession of faith at the beginning of the Rosary is nothing else but the earliest baptismal profession still common to all Christian documentation.
2) The "Our Father"--also part of the Rosary--is literally biblical.
3) Among the "fifteen mysteries" there are very few which are not explicitly biblical, namely the Assumption of Mary and her crowning. The Assumption is related to Gen 3,15; the crowning is related to Apoc 12.1.
4) The first part of the "Hail Mary" corresponds to the Angel's salutation at the Annunciation and that of Elisabeth at the Visitation (Lk 1:28 and 2:42).
5) The second half, "Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death," might be understood as follows:
"Holy Mary" again corresponds to the biblical passage of the Annunciation (Lk 1:28: "full of grace") "Mother of God" is the very meaning of the biblical annunciation even if the term as such was approved at Ephesus (431) "Pray for us": although not explicitly mentioned in Scripture, the intercession can be related to the Wedding Feast at Cana where Mary intercedes with her Son for the young couple in trouble. See also Lk 18:13. The earliest prayer of intercession regarding Mary (Sub Tuum) dates from the fourth century. It was common to all Christian traditions for more than one thousand years, until the Reformation. It is important to remember that Mary intercedes for us only in and through Jesus Christ. "Now and at the hour of our death": these concluding words were added only in the ninteenth century. They are not in the bible but can be related to Mary's station at the foot of the Cross as refuge of hope.
6) Finally, the "Glory be to the Father" makes direct reference to the Trinity. It is not mentioned as such in the Bible but nobody would question Father, Son and Spirit and the praise due to them.
In terms of mediation, 2 Macabbees 12 tells us that the victorious army of Macabbeus prays for the unvirtuous dead, and also in the OT God explicitly instructs that Job pray for his three friends. Paul also prays for a virtuous dead man. All there, all Scriptural. And you guys still get it wrong. So much for Bible Believers (tm) and sola scriptura, eh? Cherry pick Paul and the OT and discard the teachings of Christ - that's the methodology of Calvin. With influence from Muhammed, of course.
What is more strange is the validity of the sacrament depends on the intent at that moment by the priest.. so much for God being in control
(”I know idols of false gods are mentioned, but not MY holy images.”)
Please refer to scripture where this exception is defined.
Thanks.
The only thing allowed in the OT was an altar to God...Made of unhewn stone...
I believe God when he said do not make a statue or image of ANYTHING in heaven or on the earth...
God did not say false gods...He said ANYTHING...And God did not say to disregard this command if you are a Catholic...
The command is simply stated and very, very clear...
It's like when God said don't eat pork...He didn't mean except a North Carolina Barbecue...
You may suggest it.
That wouldn’t make the suggestion right.
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