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To: B-Chan
How can we know anything? I believe it because the Church teaches it, and because the reasoning behind the teaching has convinced me of its truth. If you want more than that, sorry.

Likewise, I could not prove the truth of the Torah to someone who doesn't believe it. My problem with chr*stianity (all forms of it) is that it claims to believe the Torah. This being the case, how does one read from the front of the Book and arrive at the conclusion that J*sus fulfilled all the criteria of the Torah and Na"KH without somewhere just jumping to the conclusion? And this is what chr*stianity does. It would make more sense if it didn't claim to believe the Torah, if it just popped out of nowhere. Because it does not fulfill the Torah's criteria. It fulfills its own interpretation of the Torah's criteria. And that's about all that can be said.

221 posted on 12/17/2009 10:23:01 AM PST by Zionist Conspirator (Vaya`an Yosef 'et-Par`oh le'mor bil`aday; 'Eloqim ya`aneh 'et-shelom Par`oh.)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

While I don’t have time to discuss your opinion on a point by point basis, I can say this:

1. The Church does not recognize the Torah as such. It recognizes the Hebrew Scriptures (the Old Testament) as an integral part of the complete scriptural Word of God, which is the whole revelation of Truth.

2. Christianity is not centered upon Scripture. It is centered upon the Person of Jesus Christ, who claimed to be the I AM and demonstrated it by healing the sick and lame, raising the dead, controlling the weather, transmuting matter, forgiving sin in His own right, establishing a Church and imbuing it with infallibility, and by bodily and physically returning from the dead in front of hundreds of eyewitnesses. It was only after His ascension into Heaven (again, in front of eyewitnesses) that His followers began to record His earthly words and deeds; later, these were collected into a series of writings which His Church deemed to be the completion of the written Word of God. It was during the course of compiling these Scriptures that the learned men of the Church carefully mapped out and noted how our the various circumstances of our Lord’s life, death, and resurrection were the fulfillment of the prophecies of the Hebrew Scriptures.

In other words: Man met God face to face in the Person of Jesus. It was only through meeting Him that Man is able to understand what the Hebrew Scriptures really meant when prophesying of the Messiah.

The fulfillment of the Torah is a Man, and that Man is also God, in the Person of Jesus of Nazareth, He who conquered the grave, Death and Hell. In the end, all human history, all life, and existence itself centers upon Him.


232 posted on 12/17/2009 10:51:08 AM PST by B-Chan (Catholic. Monarchist. Texan. Any questions?)
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To: Zionist Conspirator
Because it does not fulfill the Torah's criteria.

Just what IS (are?) the criteria?

285 posted on 12/17/2009 2:51:14 PM PST by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

“It would make more sense if it didn’t claim to believe the Torah, if it just popped out of nowhere. Because it does not fulfill the Torah’s criteria.”
______________________________________________________________

What are the Torah’s criteria?


302 posted on 12/17/2009 3:48:50 PM PST by mrreaganaut (Sticks and stones may break my bones, but lawyer jokes are actionable.)
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