The lineage of the Catholic Priesthood back to the original twelve is historical, not ludicrous.
Posted on 08/17/2009 9:10:31 AM PDT by AnalogReigns
Personal attacks such as that are forbidden on the Religion Forum.
I don’t.
Because no one worships that statue. It’s like a photo of your child. It’s to remind one of Jesus.
If no one intended to “worship” that statue, then it is not idolatry, because that is not the intent.
Saying that Catholics “worship” Mary because of one’s own interpretation is the same as people saying we are bigots because we don’t like Obama. They say it’s because of the color of his skin. That’s what it looks like to them. So it must be true.
How absolutely wrong.
From this link: Catholic-resources.org
Disciple = "learner, pupil, student" (Gk. mathetes, from the verb manthanein, "to learn")
Jesus is not the only "teacher" to have "disciples" in the New Testament; there are also "disciples of John [the Baptist]" and "disciples of the Pharisees" (Mark 2:18; 6:29; Matt 9:14; Luke 5:33).
In the ancient world, students/disciples usually sought out a teacher (cf. Luke 9:57-62); but Jesus usually reverses the dynamic, "calling" people to become his disciples (Mark 1:16-20; 2:14-17; 3:13; etc.).
Jesus did not establish a "school" in a particular location, but was an itinerant (wandering) preacher/teacher; thus, his disciples literally had to "follow" him around (Mark 8:34; 10:21; Luke 9:57-62; John 1:43).
The word "disciples" is used 233 times in the Gospels for Jesus' followers, but one should not assume that it refers only to "the twelve"; the phrase "twelve disciples" occurs only three times (Matt 10:1; 11:1; 20:17), and "disciples" often refers to this core group; but other people are also called "disciples" of Jesus (Matt 8:19-22; Luke 6:13, 17, 20; 19:37; John 4:1; 6:66; 8:31; 9:28; Acts 6:1-7; etc.).
If Jesus charged his Disciples are you then NOT one? Are not ALL Christians at least Disciples?
Quack quack quack!
>>You truly are an arogant little person.
My discussion with you is over.<<
*sniff* Another one bites the dust.
To be specific, the Gospel of Matthew does not say when Judas killed himself, so it is quite possible that he was alive at that time, though I doubt it.
More to the point, the issue was about apostolic lineage, which is irrelevant to the authority of Christ. The salient point is that the Great Commission is for all disciples, not just those who were at Christs ascension, otherwise, there would be no gospel being preached today.
Forgive me for being so pedestrian about injecting Judas into the discussion, but the argument that priests can trace themselves back to the original 12 is ludacris and similar to the argument the the LDS bishopric uses.
If it looks like a bigot
And it talks like a bigot
It’s a bigot.
I wasn’t there.
Yours was an informative and helpful post. Thanks very much for writing it.
Bookmarked!
How so? Simply because I choose to not engage with someone who posts adolescent arguments and childish retorts?
Are you of the same ilk? Or is this representative of the Catholics who post on FreeRepublic? I would not like to believe the latter.
The lineage of the Catholic Priesthood back to the original twelve is historical, not ludicrous.
STOP FIGHTING, HERE’S THE DEAL.
Most Catholics believe the Immaculate Conception is that Jesus was concieved by a miralce, not so though, the Immaculate Conception in Catholic folklore is that Mary was born without Sin, so she should have never died, therefore, the Assumption was “made up” and not that long ago either.
This is not true, there was no Assumption of Mary, why the Catholics insist on worshipping someone who is barely mentioned in the totality of the text is beyond me. However, it comes from a mistake in the translation they made 100’s of years ago think “She” will crush his head, a long story, but there was no Assumption.
So even today, you are not a “Student” of Christ? You do not study, learn, and apply his teachings? Is Jesus Christ NOT your teacher, just because you “weren’t there”. WHO may I ask is the source of your Religion?
The Apostolic succession has been propagated for just under two thousand years through the Sacrament of Ordination, by the laying-on of hands from one generation to the next.
It’s not ‘ludacris’, it’s what happened.
Flat out incorrect. What you're talking about in the "she will crush your head" is, as far as I know, in the Latin Vulgate only. I am not aware it is in the Septuagint, the Peshitta, or any Ethiopic or Armenian translations. If it happened like you said, the Latin Church would have made the "error" and then everybody else would have said "Balderdash, that's just your translation bub."
That's not at all what actually happened. As the manuscript tradition spread on the Assumption it was UNIVERSALLY accepted by all the Churches from Armenia to Gaul to Arabia and Ethiopia. And in fact, apparently our earliest account is in Greek: the De Obitu S. Dominae, which I am trying to track down as we speak.
I don’t play gotcha games.
Thanks so much....glad it was useful!
says...um...nothing...says nothing at all about me.
But this thread isn’t about me.
It’s about the doctrine that Mary was allegedly...”assumed”
lol
< heresy>That she was without sin. </ heresy>
And therfore, since only Jesus is shown to be without sin, by definiton is an attempt to make < heresy> her, a mere created sinful mortal, co-equal with Christ</ Heresy>
I do note however that nobody has refuted that some actually pray to her for forgiveness, as though she is somehow capable to forgive the sin agains the Father. Which, again, by definition is claim < heresy>her to be co-equal to Christ </ heresy>
What I posted, that you relpied to, speaks VOLUMES about the attempted deification of Mary as those who participate in such doctrine.
Beliefs have consequences.
For instance...
One cannot believe that everone should make the same salary, that everyone should be forced to be qual in all matters, that government is the final authority on what our rights should be, etc and then, in the same breath claim to be for liberty. Simple logic and the law of no-contradicitons refutes the letter claim. The two are not compatable.
So too...
Believing that Mary is sinless as Christ, though no one is good, no, not one...
and also believing that Mary is a Savior from sin, or able to forgive, sin, as Christ does, for One died for our sins; Christ Jesus...
and also believing that Mary was conveived by the Holy Spirit, as only Jesus was...
and further blieving that Mary can interced on our behalf as Christ does as our one mediator between God and man.
...and then having the temerity to actually say that one believes all that but doesn’t see and cannot understand that they believe that they have verneated mary to that of the Godhead is simple blindness on that person’s part. Or, even more probably, the belief system is so strong that one must blindly deny what is so obvious to even the most casual observer.
Look, folks may believe as they wish, however, when they come into an open area of debate and propose poppycock, then they shouldn’t get their feathers in such a wad when others, who are invited into the debate, chuckle with amusement in the duplicity of the doctrine presented. It just stands to reason that when you ask others for their oipions that they’ll give it to you. If you don’t want ot hear the opinons of others, then don’t ask. bel;ieve what you like and just move along.
p.s. On a personal note...Nice try in the attempt to change the subject into my knowledge about the catholic church though! Weak and transparent, but entertaining anyway.
Best wishes
Well then I think it’s about time some Protestants stop that Book worship.
Wow, I am assuming you mean God’s Word?
That is a failed attempt at interception. It was not thrown to them and they did not catch it. Christ was addressing His gathered apostles and disciples, the bishops and priests of the Catholic Church.
Wow they were bishops and priests even though they were Jewish and some were married that is quite a stretch to try to prove that Christ started the “Catholic Church”.
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