In Joseph Smith's day prominent Americans were disgusted with the creeds of Christendom. (excerpt)

[restornu]

In Joseph Smith's day some of the most prominent Americans were disgusted with the creeds of Christendom. Thomas Jefferson said:

I [Jefferson] am a real Christian, that is to say a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus, very different from the preachers . . of the gospel, while they draw all their characteristic dogmas from what its author never said or did.

They have compounded from the heathen mysteries a system beyond the comprehension of man of which Jesus, were he to return on earth, would not recognize one feature. . . . It is the speculations of crazy theologians which have made a Babel out of religion (Saul K. Padover, Thomas Jefferson on Democracy, 1939, pp. 122-123).

Writing to S. Hales in 1818, Jefferson wrote: "The truth is that Calvinism has introduced into the Christian religion more new absurdities than its leaders had purged it of old ones" (Ibid., p. 219).

On Jefferson's monument in Washington, D.C., is inscribed: "I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." If his complete quotation were on the monument it would bring out the fact that Jefferson was speaking against the dergy of his day (Ibid., p. 119).

Benjamin Franklin, replying to a letter from Ezra Styles, president of Yale, said shortly before his death:

As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of morals and his religion, as he left it to us, the best the world ever saw or is likely to see; but I apprehend it has received various corrupt changes (Carl Van Doren, Benjamin Franklin, 1941, p. 777).

The first great work expressing the deistic feeling in America was Thomas Paine's Age of Reason, considered to have generated the greatest stir of any book of its day. It made clear that Paine was not an atheist as some claimed, but a deist because of the tyranny and bigotry he found in the existing churches (Thomas Paine, Age of Reason, 1793, p. 287).

Speaking of the period in America between 1670 and 1830, renowned theologian Paul Tillich has said, "First among the educated classes, then increasingly in the mass of industrial workers, religion lost its 'immediacy,' and it ceased to offer an unquestioned sense of direction and relevance to human living" (Roland N. Stromberg, Religious Liberalism, 1954, p. 1).

Carlyle has said of the Colonial Period: "An age fallen languid and destitute of faith and terrified of skepticism" (Ibid., p. ix).

Of this time Carl L. Becker has said, "What we have to realize is that in those years God was on trial" (Ibid., p. 1).

On another occasion, Thomas Jefferson said:

The impious presumption of legislators and rulers, civil as well as ecclesiastical, who being themselves but fallible and uninspired men have assumed dominion over the faith of others, setting up their own opinions and modes of thinking as the only true and infallible, and as such endeavoring to impose them on others, have established and maintained false religions over the greatest part of the earth (Peter H. Odegard, Religion and Politics, 1960, p. 110).

It is also true that in Colonial America only about 5 percent of the population belonged to any church and that those who did come to America for religious reasons did not come here initially to seek freedom of religion except for themselves. This is certainly an indictment against religion in Joseph Smith's day.

Peter Odegard also maintains this position:

Nowhere in the old world at the beginning of American colonization was there anything like religious toleration. . . . It is sad but not surprising to recall that even the religious dissenters who found refuge in America were, with notable exceptions, no more disposed toward toleration than the oppressors of the old world Obid., p. 9).

Historian William Warren Sweet says, "The rise of an intense anticlericalism was another cause of opposition to the churches." Further he relates: "The United States began as a free and independent nation with organized religion at a low ebb" (William Warren Sweet, Religion in the Development of American Culture, 1952, p. 92.).

[cruise_missile]

Yes I did watch it. But did restornu watch it?
So who is the most biased the person that watched it or didn't watch it? :-)

[Stourme]

“Now the Spirit explicitly says that in the last times some will turn away from the faith by paying attention to deceitful spirits and demonic instructions.”

I Timothy 4:1

That is not what the real 1 Tim 4:1 says.

Here's the real 1 Tim 4:1
1 Timothy 4:1 - 3
1 NOW the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.

Forbidding to marry is doctrine of devils. Do we know of any church that teaches that some of it's members shouldn't marry?

[restornu]

This is not the subject of this thread

It seems so many want to change the subject instead of trying to understand the why those prominent Americans were disgusted with the creeds of Christendom.

They DO NOT have trouble with Christianity, it is Christendom!

[cruise_missile]

So you didn’t watch the video?

[fishtank]

In all charity, the Mormon religion is a counterfeit. Maybe it's a "better" counterfeit than Monopoly money, but a counterfeit all the same.

I continue to pray for your deliverance from this spiritual bondage.

[Tennessee Nana]

Saying that LDS does not have a set of creeds is fundamental dishonesty.
____________________________________

Yes, you are right...

And also consider...

Credo...from which we get our English word..credible, credibility..

The mormon doctrines have no credibility...

Joseph Smith was not credible....

So Resty is subconciously right in what she is suggesting...

[restornu]

Amazing none can not stick to a topic which even in today's a few in Christendom can not live what they claim.

[Tennessee Nana]

Wow! How was Jefferson able to read Free Republic way back then?
______________________________________

Joseph Smith would slip him a printed copy when he had finished with it ...

[Stourme]

Amazing none can not stick to a topic which even in today's a few in Christendom can not live what they claim.

Sorry Restornu.... /slapsOwnHand :(

[Stourme]

Ok, it's easy to see why the founding fathers rejected the creeds of Christendom. These were men of great minds.

Take the Presbyterian creed for instance...errr ok..let's pick one of the Presbyterian creeds.

Presbyterians of Wales
CONFESSION OF FAITH 1823

Attributes of God
"God is a pure, invisible, self-subsisting Spirit (d); without body, parts, or passions; eternal, without beginning, change, or end; infinite, and incomprehensible; "
So, according to the Presbyterians, God has no body, or parts and is incomprehensible. How can you have a personal savior that is incomprehensible to you???

But when they talk about the trinity they say:
Godhead THREE Persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost; that these three are co-eternal and co-equal, not one before or after another, not greater or less than another, but one God (a).

If one is like the other and not greater or less then they must be the same....Now the last I saw in my Bible, Christ died, came back and took His body up and ascended into heaven with it. And He promised to return just like He left...that means with His body.

So according to the Presbyterians, He has a body...but it has no parts. Whaaa?

Deuteronomy 4:28
28 And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men's hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell.

So according to the Lord Himself, the true God does see, hear, eat, and smell...which require parts. Again, Jesus after the Resurrection.

So I can see why the founding fathers rejected stuff like this...it just doesn't make sense.

[Elsie]

I [Jefferson] am a real Christian, that is to say a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus, very different from the preachers . . of the gospel, while they draw all their characteristic dogmas from what its author never said or did.

They have compounded from the heathen mysteries a system beyond the comprehension of man of which Jesus, were he to return on earth, would not recognize one feature. . . . It is the speculations of crazy theologians which have made a Babel out of religion (Saul K. Padover, Thomas Jefferson on Democracy, 1939, pp. 122-123).

Dang!

Ol' Tom sounds just like Ol' Joe!!

Neither can point to ANYTHING that is out of whack with SCRIPTURE!

Just a bunch of ACCUSATIONS and SMEARS.

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And today; Joseph Smith's followers carry on in the Grand Tradition of the Founder.

[Elsie]

In Joseph Smith's day prominent Americans were disgusted with the creeds of Christendom.

 

 

In our day, the BIBLE is disgusted with the beginnings of MORMONISM...

 

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KJV

 Galatians 1:6-9

 6.  I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
 7.  Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
 8.  But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
 9.  As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
 

 

 

 

ANYBODY???

 

Like this fine looking fellow???

 

 

 

 

 

2 Corinthians 11:12-15

 12.  But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.
 13.  For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
 14.  And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
 15.  Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

 

 

Like THESE guys??

 

 

 

 

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/js_h/1/19#19

 

 

17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!

 

 

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Ephesians 2:1-2 

1.  And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

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1 Corinthians 4:17
  For this cause have I sent unto you Timotheus, who is my beloved son, and faithful in the Lord, who shall bring you into remembrance of my ways which be in Christ, as I teach every where in every church.

 

1 Corinthians 11:2
   Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.

 

2 Thessalonians 2:15
   Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

 

2 Timothy 1:13
   Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

 

2 Timothy 3:14-15
 14.  But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
 15.  And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

[Elsie]

Please spell out your motives and purposes for posting this article, restornu.

Simple; Gentile.

It's posted so that Biblw believers will try to DEFEND against these accusations; thereby letting MORMONISM's severe problems seem a bit more bearable.

--MormonDude(what is your answer?)

[Elsie]

I find it odd that when the Mormons wished to setup their own territory and state where they could practice their faith like unto the Quakers and Puritans who left the oppression of the English and European systems of state religions, They were told that they would have to conform to the religious beliefs of the sate, by doing away with multiple wifes.

Well, they can still migrate to ANY islamic country and HAVE their MULTIPLE wives if they had any courage!

[Elsie]

Creeds are not scripture!

 

YES they are - if you are a MORMON!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here is the creed of the LDS Organization; based in Salt Lake City:

 

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Articles of Faith

The Articles of Faith outline 13 basic points of belief of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
The Prophet Joseph Smith first wrote them in a letter to John Wentworth, a newspaper editor,
in response to Mr. Wentworth's request to know what members of the Church believed.
They were subsequently published in Church periodicals.
They are now regarded as scripture and included in the Pearl of Great Price.

 

 

 

THE ARTICLES OF FAITH
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
History of the Church, Vol. 4, pp. 535—541

 

 

1. We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.
   
2. We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam's transgression.
   
3. We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
   
4. We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
   
5. We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.
   
6. We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.
   
7. We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.
   
8. We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.
   
9. We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.
   
10. We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.
    
11. We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.
    
12. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.
    
13. We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Joseph Smith

 

 

 

Definitions of creed:

• From the Latin word "credere" -- to believe. A short statement of religious belief, usually motivated by a desire to emphasize church teaching as opposed to a heresy.
• A formal summary of religious belief; an authoritative statement of doctrine
• Any system of principles or beliefs
• Religious doctrine: the written body of teachings of a religious group that are generally accepted by that group
• A creed is a statement or confession of belief — usually religious belief — or faith.
• A statement of religious beliefs agreed by the church to be true.
• A system of religious beliefs, including moral or ethical beliefs about right and wrong, that are sincerely held with the strength of traditional religious views.
• A statement of faith binding upon a given religious body.
• A statement of faith. 
• A formal statement of religious belief/proclamation of faith 

 

 

[Elsie]

The churches created had all kinds of wierd heresies.

Oh??

Give us a list of them...

[Elsie]

please repaste the creed below and detail what it is that is not scripturally supported

Good luck!

Rush calls 'em Drive-by Posters...

[Elsie]

The capacity for or the practice of recognizing and respecting the beliefs or practices of others

 

HA Ha ha....

 

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/js_h/1/19#19   17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!   18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.   19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”   20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, “Never mind, all is well—I am well enough off.” I then said to my mother, “I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.”

 

 

 

 

[Elsie]

By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

By this shall all men know that ye are false prophets...

 

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http://scriptures.lds.org/en/js_h/1/19#19

 

 

 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!

 

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Galatians 1:6-9
 6.  I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel--
 7.  which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ.
 8.  But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!
 9.  As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

 

 

2 Corinthians 11:12-15
 12.  And I will keep on doing what I am doing in order to cut the ground from under those who want an opportunity to be considered equal with us in the things they boast about.
 13.  For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ.
 14.  And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.
 15.  It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.

 

 

 

[Elsie]

LDS only have an Article of Faith no creeds.

"Mother; I have found for myself that Restorianism is untrue."