Well see, it's like this: She turned me into a newt!
I got better.
Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.
There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.
Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).
Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.
Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.
I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.
But do I WORSHIP them?
No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.
I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.
There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?
I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.
Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.
In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.
At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.
It is impossible for God to heal someone at the behest of one of His saints in heaven.
Well see, it's like this: She turned me into a newt!
I got better.
lol, if you like, you can call me "Thou"
OLD REGGIE: Please check your facts. Father Phleger has a long history.
And further note Father Phleger still has a church and a pulpit. Rev. Wright has been retired.
lack of leadership for non-catholic Christians
No lack. No king but Christ.
And I notice, mgist, that you capitalized the "c" in "non-Catholic," but not the "c" in "christian."
Does that show where your priorities lie?"
I don’t want anyone praying for me who does not believe that God heals and that He WILL heal. He’s doing something new and for the first time I have the faith to believe that I will be healed. Now it may be through surgery or it may be a divine healing. Of course, I prefer the divine...LOL.
Adam's spouse was not his mother. Christ's spouse is also not his mother. Spiritual Israel is the true spouse and the "woman" spoken of both here and in the book of Revelation.
AMEN!
Sigh...
LOL. This could be fun.
They aren’t theology, just little feel good idol stories. what’s with the horns?
I had the Inquisition in mind. :)
BTW I sent you a super secret "Private Mail" a while ago. Please keep it secret.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8lZeIp-B0s/
This isn't official. I haven't seen it, but I think it provides insight. There are plenty of books and websites with info., I wouldn't even know where to start.
that’s interesting. Never thought it was a HE. Hmmm. That changes things.
Hey, don’t reveal my secret identity here or I’ll plame you.
Well, we know what happened to the little boy who wouldn't fall down playing "soldier" and the little girl whose "dad could beat up your dad."
They grew up and got "saved."
LOL. Exactly right!
From the RCC catechism...
"Being obedient she (Mary) became the cause of salvation for herself and for the whole human race." (494)"Taken up to heaven, she (Mary) did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation." (969)
Do Catholics even read this stuff? It is blasphemy. Regardless of how the RCC tries to twist these words into something palatable, they still stick in the throat and stop the breathing.
For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned." -- Matthew 12:36-37"But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.
I can’t read them without holding my breath. wow. Even reading them feels like blasphemy.
I can sing. You can take my job instead...whatever that is.
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