The Worship of Mary? (An Observation)

[Ultra Sonic 007]

Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.

There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.

Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).

Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.

Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.

I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.

But do I WORSHIP them?

No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.

I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.

There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?

I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.

Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.

In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.

At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.

[Quix]

Perverse DENIAL

of Biblical Truths

does NOT alter nor remove The Truths.

Great post. Thx.

[Quix]

INDEED.

Yet some would have us believe that a bunch of power mongering politicians meeting in Committee know better than John.

LOL.
GTTM

[Petronski]

You have failed. None of those individually or together amount to sola scriptura.

[Forest Keeper]

They know what we mean. It has been spelled out 100’s of times over.

Yes indeed, you are very right.

[LordBridey]

There never appears to be much substance in your posts. Just a lot of "oh, yeah???"

Oh, yeah? I've seen you make that claim with other posters. I've explained your role in that before.

[OLD REGGIE]

You have expressed some anti Catholic thoughts in the past. I’d have to pass, but thank you for your kind off.

With an attitude like that you'd not be suitable as Jesuit candidate in any event.

[OLD REGGIE]

You have expressed some anti Catholic thoughts in the past. I’d have to pass, but thank you for your kind off.

With an attitude like that you'd not be suitable as Jesuit candidate in any event.

[wmfights]

Excellent point. I didn't even think of that. :)

Thank you, I suspect you are just being gracious.

BTW, I've been enjoying your posts. You have much greater patience than I when encountering such fierce obstinacy.

[OLD REGGIE]

That’s not the point, Dr. E. and others want to say that the Assumption didn’t exist for 1800 years. This was demonstrated to be false.

Wrong! NEVER existed!

[OLD REGGIE]

I am gratified that you understand the difference between belief and knowing. It is not ‘sufficient’, yet it is better than the nothing that you claim to know.

Once again you make no sense. Keep up the good work.

Do you think there is a perfect translation of the Bible?

If so, which one?

[Petronski]

Your post is false.

[OLD REGGIE]

You’re claiming you’re a Jesuit?

If I told you I'd have to kill you.

[OLD REGGIE]

These guys stole much of your stuff. The Berean Call

The nerve!

[OLD REGGIE]

These guys stole much of your stuff. The Berean Call

The nerve!

[OLD REGGIE]

Thank you for this wonderful post.

The contradictions are explicit; the lies are exposed and the illogic is highlighted. It is not a matter of logic and reason and Scripture. It is a matter of pride and hubris and personal advancement.

Jesus came for all men - the crime of Calvinisim is that they deny that and therefore crush the hopes of men to be saved by God. Only the elite get saved; screw all the rest.

Too bad it's not original.

UNAM SANCTAM

[Quix]

INDEED

. . . according to the solid evidence.

. . . according to the rubber histories . . . anything goes.

[OLD REGGIE]

You have failed. None of those individually or together amount to sola scriptura.

OK, you've answered to your typical one-line zinger. Now - to your "Mary" proof.

[OLD REGGIE]

Your post is false.

Proof?

[Petronski]

QED

[Petronski]

Now - to your "Mary" proof.

Where did you get the idea I was providing that?

That would be the act of a sola scripturist. Tagline ↓↓↓