Posted on 05/03/2008 4:38:34 PM PDT by NYer
Uh no. The catechism specifically says, 'union of the mother WITH the Son IN THE WORK OF SALVATION.....' making Mary part of the salvation process. The only way that is possible is to make her GOD. If you can't see that, I can't help you.
However, since united here means "harmonious mutual action, cooperation" it makes perfect sense
No, my defintion makes perfect sense, its yours that doesn't. Again, harmonious MUTUAL action, COOPERATION....only makes sense if both were God. There can be no harmonious mutual action or cooperation if one isn't God. Again, if you can't see that I can't help you.
That's quite the anti-intellectual streak you flashed there.
But what verse are you referring to??? I've posted a few...
I was replying a post of yours. Did it not occur to you that I was speaking of the verse you posted there?
I heartedly disagree. Children, especially newborns, have a great capacity for selfishness.
The key word is "choice," the learned exercise of the will.
Children lack that, that's why we don't imprison them for stealing from fellow kids.
I do but apparently you don't. There is only one who is sinless - Christ - and He's God. Anything else is extra-biblical teaching.
You are pulling the paragraph out of the context of the Catechism and distorting it to fit a conclusion you'd probably already drawn. I CAN see that.
Nonetheless, despite your spin and exegetical gyrations, Catholic teaching does not make Mary a deity, neither explicitly nor by effect.
Yes, it says that she was in union with Him in His work of Salvation. It DOES NOT say that she is a "co-savior" or anything else you may extrapolate from your misinterpretation of the Catechism.
Mary had to be God in order to become the mother of Jesus?
That's an interesting theory.
Mary was part of the salvation process. How can you deny that?
Paul says he consulted NO ONE other than Jesus Christ in his instructions for his ministry...So it was from Jesus to Paul to elders...
Just as it was from Peter to likely the elders...
And when the scripture was completed, one can see it's all over the scripture for pastors, deacons, and anyone in leadership positions...
So no, I didn't cancatenate anything...My understanding is right on track...
I don't know. And neither do you.
Do you realize that humanity and divinity are two entirely different "species"?
I do but apparently you don't. There is only one who is sinless - Christ - and He's God.
Why do you make me ask a second time?
Do you think a human without sin is the same as God?
Please answer. Thank you.
Then you must deny your own catechism because it does.
In giving birth you kept your virginity; in your Dormition you did not leave the world, O Mother of God, but were joined to the source of Life. You conceived the living God and, by your prayers, will deliver our souls from death.509
Her role in relation to the Church and to all humanity goes still further. "In a wholly singular way she cooperated by her obedience, faith, hope, and burning charity in the Savior's work of restoring supernatural life to souls.
Only God can 'deliver our souls' only God can 'restore supernatural life to souls'. If you can't see the blasphemy in these statements there is no help for you.
There aren't all that many definitions for 'unite'...Perhaps your church should change the word instead of you having to defend your church for using the wrong definition...
Except your posting of Mat 16:18.
What about the unborn? Do they sin? What sin do you imagine a one minute old baby to have committed? Please be speciic.
The ONLY "extra-biblical teaching" discussed on this thread is the 16th Century invention of sola scriptura.
Prior to Gutenberg's invention of the printing press in the 15th Century ALL Bibles had to be scribed by hand. This made them extremely rare and affordable to only the most wealthy. God KNEW that it would be impossible for everyone to have their own Bibles for fifteen centuries AFTER His Resurrection. So, why do you believe that the Lord is so cruel as to have a plan for Salvation that He KNEW would be impossible to implement for a millennium and a half? Why do you believe He would make people suffer for so many centuries?
It does not.
AMEN, AMEN, AMEN!
Perhaps no one connected with the translation of the Catechism could anticipate so hair-brained a misreading as we've been shown here.
Why? You don't respect the position of Protestants over sola scriptura. You attack that and claim its not biblical and tell us what to believe, even though it is biblically supported. This entire thread was posted as an attack. You honestly didn't expect those who believe this to sit back and say nothing did you???? Something like this thread gets posted, expect to get some heat in return.
You again misinterpret the teaching of the Church.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.