Posted on 10/26/2007 9:00:59 PM PDT by topcat54
Replacement theology has become dispensationalism's latest prophetic boogeyman. If you want to end a debate over eschatology, just charge your opponent with holding to replacement theology. What is “replacement theology,” sometimes called “supersessionism,” and why do dispensationalists accuse non-dispensationalists of holding it? Here’s a typical dispensational definition:
Replacement Theology: a theological perspective that teaches that the Jews have been rejected by God and are no longer God’s Chosen People. Those who hold to this view disavow any ethnic future for the Jewish people in connection with the biblical covenants, believing that their spiritual destiny is either to perish or become a part of the new religion that superseded Judaism (whether Christianity or Islam).1
“Replacement theology” is dispensationalism’s trump card in any debate over eschatology because it implies anti-semitism. Hal Lindsey attempted to use this card in his poorly researched and argued The Road to Holocaust.2 He wove an innovative tale implying that anyone who is not a dispensationalist carries the seeds of anti-semitism within his or her prophetic system. This would mean that every Christian prior to 1830 would have been theologically anti-semitic although not personally anti-semtic.
As Peter Leithart and I point out in The Legacy of Hatred Continues,3 it’s dispensationalists who hold to a form of replacement theology since they believe that Israel does not have any prophetic significance this side of the rapture! Prior to the rapture, in terms of dispensational logic, the Church has replaced Israel. This is unquestionably true since God’s prophetic plan for Israel has been postponed until the prophetic time clock starts ticking again at the beginning of Daniel’s 70th week which starts only after the Church is taken to heaven in the so-called rapture. Until then, God is dealing redemptively with the Church. Am I making this up? Consider the following by dispensationalist E. Schuyler English:
An intercalary4 period of history, after Christ’s death and resurrection and the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70, has intervened. This is the present age, the Church age. . . . During this time God has not been dealing with Israel nationally, for they have been blinded concerning God’s mercy in Christ. . . . However, God will again deal with Israel as a nation. This will be in Daniel’s seventieth week, a seven-year period yet to come.5
According to English and every other dispensationalist, the Church has replaced Israel until the rapture. The unfulfilled promises made to Israel are not fulfilled until after the Church is taken off the earth. Thomas Ice, one of dispensationalism’s rising stars, admits that the Church replaces Israel this side of the rapture: “We dispensationalists believe that the church has superseded Israel during the current church age, but God has a future time in which He will restore national Israel ‘as the institution for the administration of divine blessings to the world.’”6
Dispensationalists claim that their particular brand of eschatology is the only prophetic system that gives Israel her proper place in redemptive history. This is an odd thing to argue since two-thirds of the Jews will be slaughtered during the post-rapture tribulation, and the world will be nearly destroyed. Charles Ryrie writes in his book The Best is Yet to Come that during this post-rapture period Israel will undergo “the worst bloodbath in Jewish history.”7 The book’s title doesn’t seem to very appropriate considering that during this period of time most of the Jews will die! John Walvoord follows a similar line of argument: “Israel is destined to have a particular time of suffering which will eclipse any thing that it has known in the past. . . . [T]he people of Israel . . . are placing themselves within the vortex of this future whirlwind which will destroy the majority of those living in the land of Palestine.”8 Arnold Fruchtenbaum states that during the Great Tribulation “Israel will suffer tremendous persecution (Matthew 24:15–28; Revelation 12:1–17). As a result of this persecution of the Jewish people, two-thirds are going to be killed.”9
During the time when Israel seems to be at peace with the world, she is really under the domination of the antichrist who will turn on her at the mid-point in the seven-year period. Israel waits more than 2000 years for the promises finally to be fulfilled, and before it happens, two-thirds of them are wiped out. Those who are charged with holding a “replacement theology viewpoint” believe in no inevitable future Jewish bloodbath. In fact, we believe that the Jews will inevitably embrace Jesus as the Messiah this side of the Second Coming. The fulfillment of Zechariah 13:8 is a past event. It may have had its fulfillment in the events leading up to and including the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70. Contrary to dispensationalism’s interpretation of the Olivet Discourse, Jesus' disciples warned the Jewish nation for nearly forty years about the impending judgment (Matt. 3:7; 21:42–46; 22:1–14; 24:15–22). Those who believed Jesus’ words of warning were delivered “from the wrath to come” (1 Thess. 1:10). Those who continued to reject Jesus as the promised Messiah, even though they had been warned for a generation (Matt. 24:34), “wrath has come upon them to the utmost” (1 Thess. 2:16; cf. 1 Thess. 5:1–11; 2 Pet. 3:10–13).
Before critics of replacement theology throw stones, they need to take a look at their own prophetic system and see its many lapses in theology and logic.
Read Part Two of this article...
2. Hal Lindsey, The Road to Holocaust (New York: Bantam Books, 1989). The address for Bantam Books is 666 Fifth Avenue, New York, New York.
3. Gary DeMar and Peter J. Leithart, The Legacy of Hatred Continues: A Response to Hal Lindsey’s The Road to Holocaust (Powder Springs, GA: American Vision, 1989).
4. Inserted into the calendar.
5. E. Schuyler English, A Companion to the New Scofield Reference Bible (New York: Oxford University Press, 1972), 135.
6. Thomas Ice, “The Israel of God,” The Thomas Ice Collection: www.raptureready.com/featured/TheIsraelOfGod.html#_edn3
7. Charles C. Ryrie, The Best is Yet to Come (Chicago, IL: Moody Press, 1981), 86.
8. John F. Walvoord, Israel in Prophecy (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 1962), 107, 113. Emphasis added.
9. Arnold G. Fruchtenbaum, “The Little Apocalypse of Zechariah,” The End Times Controversy: The Second Coming Under Attack, eds. Tim LaHaye and Thomas Ice (Eugene, OR: Harvest House, 2003), 262.
Not only do they stretch their Bibles far further than a new inner-tube would stretch . . .
They stretch credulity light years beyond the breaking point.
That they can believe what they spout and look the person in their mirrors in the eye still boggles my mind.
It’s like creating new Scripture out of whole cloth—and that very badly—not the least bit congruent with the whole counsel of Scripture.
Well, if you would use normal terms in a normal fashion once in a while, then maybe people like me might be able to understand you.
Ahhhhh yes . . .
The GREAT REPLACEMENTARIAN RUBBER FACTORY STRIKES AGAIN:
1. Rubber Bibles now stretch further than Pluto and back.
2. Rubber dictionaries are stretched beyond the fantasies of Alice In Wonderland.
3. Rubber logic has stretched that linear wisdom so far out of whack as to make it the cogitations equal to words joined together a la egg salad upset.
4. And now, HYPERBOLE has been stretched so far out of comprehension as to equal whatever Replacementarians dreams consist of after a 6 pack. . . . or . . . more usually—whatever the opposite of Dispies assertions would be at the moment.
Such admirable routes to Biblical Truth.
/s
not in the flesh second comings?
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Ahhhhh . . . well, when the whole Contrarian Preterist; Replacementarian; Amil; Postmil
theological house of cards is built virtually exclusively on flesh driven doctrines and fantasies of men and of demons . . .
they must feel some compulsion to try vainly and balance the whole mess out . . . so they dreamed up this insult to the Word of God—all this arrogant sounding pretense about “SPIRITUALIZED THIS’S AND THAT’S. . . . and now SPIRITUALIZED 2ND COMINGS???? What a travesty!
I don’t remember how many times an electric fence shocks a minute . . . but the Replacementarians are way beyond that.
Then who in hell is doing all the deceiving we see all around us?
and the saints are reigning with Christ.
Tell that to the saints in Burundi.
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I'm shocked that it is not realized by one and all that
1. This is wholesal UNSCRIPTURAL in terms of the meaning made of it by the Replacementarian/Contrarian Preterists.
2. Even if it were off the wall fantasized as true as the Replacementarians construe it to be . . . then they must be consciously or blindly insulting Christ because who ever is responsible for such binding per their fantasized prescription has OBVIOUSLY BOTCHED THE JOB BIG TIME.
3. Israel as The Nation has certainly been wholesale blind about satan's wiles against them as well as continuing blind about Christ.
4. The Nations of the whole planet have continued increasingly blinded to satan's globalist plans as predicted in many prophetic Scriptures in the UNrubberized Bibles.
5. Such a mangled fantasized convoluted trashing and thrashing of Scripture makes of Christ's disucssions of such out to be the rantings of an ineffectual clueless, blind, stark raving nut.
6. The Nations and their populations are more deceived than ever--as Scripture predicted. Good is called evil and evil good and such is taught under orders of the highest government levels and courts in the land around the world. This is evidence of satan being bound? What utter unmitigated nonsense!
7. The Nations and their populations are more deceived than ever about the desirability of a global government just as Scripture predicted for the era in which Israel became a Nation again in a day.
8. The Nations and their populations are more deceived than ever about the God of the Angel Armies and His capacity to display His all knowing power and might. The globalist puppet masters believe that satan will win and God will lose at Armageddon. Talk about unparalleled DECEPTION OF THE NATIONS! SHEESH!
9. The Nations and their populations are more deceived than ever that the God of Scripture has been explained away by the Fallen Angels/ Nephilium/ Watchers manipulating the globalists behind the scenes and seducing them with all manner of exhotic war making technologies.
10. The Nations and their populations are more deceived than ever that unless the global government takes control of all living things . . . man will destroy the planet . . . therefore the global power brokers and their fallen angel buddies must save us from ourselves instead of seeking Christ as our Savior. Talk about wholesale deception! Just as slick and seducing as prophecies in the UNRUBBER Bible warns us about.
The list could go on and on about how horrendous and massive are the deceptions from hell in the current era.
The whole Replacementarian rubber Bible constructions on current reality constitute one of the most horrendous set of deceptions from hell.
I’m sure your Thanksgiving bird is wonderful. Would love to enjoy some.
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However, there is some parallel philosophically . . .
Replacementarian constructions on reality do sort of resemble
a hodge podge of veggies, organ meats and nuts stuffed up the aft end of a bird brain.
Not only does the Replacementarian perspective make Jesus out to be a liar . . . it makes Him out to be a raving lunatic liar.
Very impressive, that.
/s
It should be obvious to anyone who interprets Scripture in light of Scripture that Jesus was using prophetic hyperbole.
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No! That’s only obvious to folks who use the highly secret Replacementarian decoder ring on the Rubber Bible—all bought cheap at a Joseph Smith garage sale.
It is amazing what you guys attempt to leave out.
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INDEED.
But we should be compassionate.
When their rubber Bibles get stretched so far and so thin so constantly, great gaping holes appear and all kinds of truth just falls through the holes. It’s a wonder they have any idea which way theological or any other “up” is. Oh, that’s right, they don’t!
So, in reality while you claim to compare scripture with scriptures, you simply change the words to make them fit your own preconceived theological system simply ignore the differences.
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Essentially correct.
Though I think their rubber dictionaries change the words for them. I think they must buy them in bulk at the Joseph Smith discount house in Salt Lake City.
I don't think "intellectual dishonesty" is a SUFFICIENT explanation. Some make reasonable earnest EFFORTS to be intellectually honest but just CANNOT make the grade for some reason(s). At some point, a big chunk of those reasons has to be demonic deception and blinding of believer's hearts and minds allowed through some flaw in the believer's focus; attitude; priorities or some such.
These threads quickly become disturbingly reminding of hours of experiences trying to make sense out of folks who's construction on reality was finely honed and practiced dissociative cluelessness and egg salad communications structures. And the harder one worked to make sense--ANY--interpretive sense out of the egg salad verbalizations, the more absolutely irrational they became.
MOST of the time in such cases, demonic forces have been evident . . . that or an extremely clever case of malingering--VIA an extremely askew construction on daily reality.
They tend to refuse to confront the fact that they just may be wrong. For them to be wrong, or to even take it under consideration, is to somehow join the dark side.
I could care less whether or not people are stupid enough to believe in preterism (full or partial). It makes no biblical sense whatsoever and makes Jesus out to be a liar. But their modus operandi is to question our integrity and accuse us of being dishonest in our firmly held beliefs. They somehow think that dispensationalism is on a par with satan worship and not only must be challenged by must be destroyed and driven from the church.
Well, it ain't going anywhere. I find the dispensationalist model to be the only truly consistent interpretive model for eschatology. I'm sure there are enough of us to keep the preterists from throwing us all into the bottomless pit.
Happy Thanksgiving Quix.
May God truly bless you.
Marlowe
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Another UTTER FALSEHOOD brought to us by the Replacementarian
1. Rubber Bible;
2. Rubber dictionary;
3. Rubber history book;
4. Rubber logic book;
5. Rubber reality testing
6. Rubber exegesis a la the Alice In Woderland School of Theology.
A) The time is not pe se indtermiate at all. B) Scripture makes clear that at the end of The Great Tribuation comes Armageddon. THEN comes the Millenial Reign of Christ bodily in this time/space dimension on this planet. Only Replacementarian blinders prevent one seeing such obvious UnRubber Bible Scriptural truths.
THANKS.
THE BEST OF THANKSGIVING DAY TO YOU AND ALL YOU LOVE.
May your relationships all deepen in their walk with The Lord and with each other in His Love and Intimacy.
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I think you are essentially right. Though I’m sure they would likely say ditto from their perspective regardng ours.
I still say . . . program a computer fairly and feed it the Scriptural and historical statements of fact . . . I have no doubt what the computer would assert as the MOST Biblical and MOST logical and MOST historically accurate.
But there’s something more than human irrationality going on, imho. And it IS evil. The deceiver of man is at work wholesale in that perspective.
And, as is often the case, his tools are dead religion; dead philosophies; dead GOD IN POWER AND MIGHT etc. etc. etc. The intellectualizations are hollow—devoid of Holy Spirit’s power, might, clarity, wisdom, Scriptural congruence. And they cannot see it. Some will not see it. But there is a startling amount of CANNOT see it, imho.
To me, there’s only one reason for CANNOT—demonic forces successfully seducing and deceiving.
Of course, those forces are usually behind the WILL NOT SEE as well.
If you are referring to the "thousand years" of Rev. 20, the answer is yes. Satan is bound from deceiving the nations, and the saints are reigning with Christ.
So Jesus has been working as the God of all creation for two thousand years to make His enemies His footstool...He seems to be having some trouble...Hasn't made any notable progress yet...
How long you s'pose this Millenium is going to last??? 20, 30,000 years??? A million??? Maybe Jesus meant a Millionenium
Now I am one of the saints...But it don't seem I'm reigning over anybody...I'm still having trouble with the dog...Who are you reigning over???
So Jesus has been working as the God of all creation for two thousand years to make His enemies His footstool...He seems to be having some trouble...Hasn’t made any notable progress yet...
How long you s’pose this Millenium is going to last??? 20, 30,000 years??? A million??? Maybe Jesus meant a Millionenium
Now I am one of the saints...But it don’t seem I’m reigning over anybody...I’m still having trouble with the dog...Who are you reigning over???
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Wonderfully put.
Thanks.
Hmmm...God created the earth, life, etc. in 6 days, and rested on the 7th day...We (actual bible believers) know that God says 6 days equals 6000 years...
We know that biblical history back to Adam and Eve goes back about 6000 years...That's 6 days on God's calander...
We know that even the Preterests look at a calender and acknowledge the 'Middle Ages'...And it's agreed that the Middle Ages runs from about 500 AD to 1500 AD...
If that's the middle, then we know that there were approx. 500 years at the beginning so there has to be 500 years at and to the end...That comes to approx. the year, 2000...Don't it??? That's 2000 years from Jesus and another 4000 back to Adam and Eve...
That leaves 1000 years, or 1 day on God's calender...And what' millennium mean to God, us bible believers, and Webster??? It means 1000...So isn't that weird??? God made all that Hyperbole all fit together...
Did you ever consider that maybe you're comparing and interpreting the right scripture with the wrong scripture???
Talk about blind faith...When God says we’ll be reigning, I expect God will provide something or someone to reign over...
But not to these guys...Reign apparelntly is more hyperbole and is a meaningless word that God threw in to make noise...
And since they don’t get it, they must figure we don’t get it as well...
The problem I see with the anti-Y-ist crowd here on FR is that they don't simply think Y-ism is wrong, they think that it (along with all those who believe in it) is EVIL.They tend to refuse to confront the fact that they just may be wrong. For them to be wrong, or to even take it under consideration, is to somehow join the dark side.
I could care less whether or not people are stupid enough to believe in X-ism. It makes no biblical sense whatsoever and makes Jesus out to be a liar. But their modus operandi is to question our integrity and accuse us of being dishonest in our firmly held beliefs. They somehow think that Y-ism is on a par with satan worship and not only must be challenged by must be destroyed and driven from the church.
Well, it ain't going anywhere. I find the Y-ist model to be the only truly consistent interpretive model for eschatology. I'm sure there are enough of us to keep the X-ists from throwing us all into the bottomless pit.
Hold up a mirror. Everything you've said applies as well to your side. You-all seem to be holding the same views about us as you accuse us of having about you. Replace the variables as you see fit.
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