Jewish and Christian leaders launch countermissionary campaign [Fighting "Jews for Jesus" people]

Jerusalem Post ^ | Aug. 27, 2003

[yonif]

B'nai Brith Canada today announced the launch of a campaign to inform members of Toronto's Jewish community about the activities of "Jews for Jesus."

Calling it the "Proud to be Jewish" Campaign," B'nai Brith's goal is to warn members of the Toronto Jewish community about the presence and methods of the missionary group and to advise them of their rights.

"This isn't about free speech," said Rochelle Wilner, president of B'nai Brith Canada. "Targeted missionizing, especially when done in a manner calculated to deceive the unsuspecting, is offensive to our community. Christianity is not a branch of Judaism it's a different religion altogether, and any attempt to portray it as anything but a different religion is subterfuge. "The term 'Jews for Jesus' makes about as much sense as 'Baptists for Buddha' or 'Catholics for Krishna,'" she said.

"We didn't want this to be just another lesson in how to answer," said Frank Dimant, executive vice president.

"Some in our community are simply not capable of countering missionaries because they have received little formal Jewish education.

"We want members of our community to know that they don't have to defend Judaism to Christian missionaries they have an absolute right to not be subjected to these ministrations in the first place."

Dr. Charles McVety, president of Canada Christian College and a leader in Canada's evangelical Christian community, spoke as well. "As a committed Christian I support the idea of preaching Christianity, but preaching Christianity under the guise of Judaism to those who are in fact seeking Judaism, is plainly wrong," said McVety.

"We unequivocally denounce any and all deceptive tactics."

[malakhi]

I personally have no objection to proselytizing efforts, provided those engaging in them are forthright and do not use deceptive tactics.

[tang-soo]

... but preaching Christianity under the guise of Judaism to those who are in fact seeking Judaism, is plainly wrong, ...

I have friends who belong to a Messianic Temple and their web site lists their doctrine and it is every bit as conservative and orthodox Christianity as any Evangelical church I've seen. It seems this "church leader" is himself, plainly wrong. Jews for Jesus do not practice Christianity under the guise of Judism, they are Jews that recognize Christ as Messiah. Seems like some others did this many year ago.

[Dataman]

One of the main tennants of Judism is that the messiah has not come, and we're still waiting for that event. When one acknowledges that Jesus is the messiah, then that person has abandoned his faith for another. I'm not saying that it's right or wrong. Just stating a fact.

Is "Jew" only a religion? If I am a German pagan and convert to Christianity, am I no longer a German?

[pgkdan]

YEs, but it is very deceptive to try and trick Jews into conversion

Oh for goodness sake. How can one be "tricked" into conversion since conversion requires an understanding and an acceptance of the salvation brought to the world by Jesus Christ. You can't become a Christian except by accepting Christ.

[Toonces T. Cat]

"When one acknowledges that Jesus is the messiah, then that person has abandoned his faith for another."

Sorry Mark, but you're wrong...I have not stopped being a Jew by accepting Christ as my savior. That is not conjecture. It is a simple fact. I attend a Baptist church, but that doesn't mean that I never darken the door of synagogue. It also doesn't mean that I have ceased my prayers or in any other way discarded my heritage.

-Toonces

[At _War_With_Liberals]

The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.The VICTIM scenario again. The VICTIM scenario again.

Nothing new here. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

[cookcounty]

"it is very deceptive to try and trick Jews into conversion instead of an honest presentation and plea for their salvation. "Jews for Jesus" is no different from Scientology in its approach."

Could you please walk us through one of these "deceptive" tricking of Jews "into conversion" episodes? I'd be very interested to know how this works. All the Jews for Jesus I've met are bluntly up-front about their beliefs.

[Disclaimer: I am, by marriage, related to one who could be considered a Jew for Jesus, as she worked as a volunteer for that organization for a summer]

[Dataman]

As for me, God had to kick me in the head three times before I figured it out. I've always felt that if he was willing to give me two extra shots, then the least I can do is try to bring other Jews into the fold.

Thank you. I appreciate your comment.

[adam_az]

Buddhism isn't a religion, in the western sense.

[fishtank]

Bologna.

And that's not a city in Italy.

[Russell Scott]

Hey Jewish folks listen up. Without accepting Christ's atonement for our sins, you, me, and every other person on the planet has zero chance of living forever in Paradise.

Galatians 3
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

[MarkL]

I've heard many Jewish folk refer to themselves as non-practicing Jews. According to the logic of those in this article that is not a valid position.

It's not any different than being a "lapsed Catholic," or any sort of Christian who doesn't go to church, even on Easter or Christmas. It simply means that one has chosen not to participate in a religion, but you still relate to that religion, at least periferally. It's not, however the same as atheism.

In many cases, it's simply a lack of interest or laziness.

Mark

[Hegemony Cricket]

Great questions - I think the central issue here is the question that "lews" asked "yonif" above in post #15. You seem to be leaning toward defining "being Jewish" by belief or practice. I think many others are defining it by ethnic heritage. I guess there will always be a dichotomy between the two, and your answer to that question will more than likely determine your reaction to JFJ.

[adam_az]

You are one messed up dude.

[cookcounty]

"The VICTIM scenario again.... Nothing new here. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

If you knew how much people calling themselves "christians" and carrying crosses beat the crap out of Jews over and over again for centuries, you'd not take this attitude.

Rochelle Wilner deserves a response, but not this attitude. Nonetheless, the message of the gospel is for all (...even lost "cultural christians") and thus we have an obligation to tell all men (and Jews are part of "all men").

[rmlew]

There is a difference between pride and supremicism.
I have no problem with Christian pride or Euro-American pride.

[Steve_Seattle]

"Calling it the "Proud to be Jewish" Campaign," B'nai Brith's goal is to warn members of the Toronto Jewish community about the presence and methods of the missionary group and to advise them of their rights."

From what I've seen, "Jews for Jesus" are very proud to be Jewish, so the title of this campaign doesn't seem appropriate. And the woman's comment that the title "Jews for Jesus" is inherently contradictory is also false - the first Christians were all Jews, and regarded themselves as such until their deaths. If an atheist can still be called a Jew, so can a "Jew for Jesus." And there are many Jews who practice Buddhism - what would the woman call THEM?

[Steve_Seattle]

"What about "Jews for Buddha?" I don't recall the Jewish community ever getting worked up about the trend of liberal Jews to explore things like Buddhism."

For historical reasons, Jews obviously haven't internalized resentments about Buddha the way they would have about Jesus. But as a matter of logic, you are quite correct; using the woman's own examples, she would have to deny that Jews can be Buddhists.

[adam_az]

In Buddhism, the Buddha is not worshipped. There is no "god" or "devil" or supernatural entities in Buddhist terms. With time it's become practiced by some with dogmas and rituals, but that's not what was taught by Gautama Buddha. I'm not Buddhist BTW, but I know quite a bit about it (my girlfriend studies the ancient languages, like sanskrit and pali, and archaeology of that region.)

[Toonces T. Cat]

The fear is the fear of loss of identity. My wife is not Jewish...Hence, my three children are not Jewish. It is the idea of dilution and downsizing of the community that stirs up the folks that rail against Jews for Jesus. The most vehement "Jews against Jesus" that I know are NOT practicing Jews. They are reformists of the worst ilk that as a child I would have never recognized as being Jewish. The Orthodox Jews that I speak with always give me a fair hearing.

-Toonces