Elizabeth Smart Reuninted with Her Mother**picture***

THE SALT LAKE TRIBUNE ^ | March 13, 2003 | Elizabeth Neff

[Kentucky]

Police found Elizabeth Smart alive and in the company of a transient panhandler Wednesday, some nine months after she disappeared from her Salt Lake City home. Sandy police located Elizabeth in the suburb with Brian David Mitchell, who had worked odd jobs for the Smarts for five hours in November 2001 and was wanted for questioning. Salt Lake City Police Chief Rick Dinse said investigators are convinced Elizabeth was kidnapped, and released the name of Wanda Eileen Barzee as a second suspect in the crime.

[Freedom2specul8]

That's true..it is embarrasing to be associated with it...

[Freedom2specul8]

Boy does that sound familiar.. I aint sayin another word. Will check in later.

[Catspaw]

Well, he *is* crazy. He should be locked up all the same...and should have been before he comitted a crime.

Sarah, I don't know about the mental committment statutes in Utah, but I do know about them in my state (Wisconsin). Once a person is either adjudicated mentally ill by a jury or judge or has an involuntary committment, the case is reviewed every six months. If the person who's committed can convince a psychologist or psychiatrist that that person is sane, there's a review hearing and if the judge agrees, the person is released. Yup, they walk.

This would've applied to Jeffrey Dahmer had the jury found him insane by reason of mental disease or defect. In fact, our county has a man on trial right now for the murder of two police officers--he rammed his truck into their parked police car. If he's found guilty (and he's admitted he did it), they'll move into the "is he crazy or is he sane" part of the trial. If he's found insane, he goes to the state mental hospital with the same terms--a review every six months. Because Tyson Kruescher is claiming he's depressed and wasn't taking his meds, because he's on his meds now, if they find that he was insane at the time of the crime, how long do you think it'll be before he's out of the state mental hospital? Yup, six months--six months for two murders.

[Illbay]

From all we have been told, MK said that there was a gun. There was no gun.

Again, the assumption that "what you have been told" is correct, and if it differs from what comes out later it means the discrepancy is the fault of the ORIGINAL WITNESS and not the inevitable filtering of the rumor-mill sometimes euphemistically referred to as the media.

This is an example of what I'm talking about: Too many people, like you, are so wedded to their pet theories that they discard what is obvious in favor of their personal concoctions.

Please understand this (and it isn't the first time I've said it on these threads): WE DON'T KNOW THE REAL STORY OF WHAT WAS SAID AND WHAT WAS TESTIFIED BY MARY KATHERINE OR ANYONE ELSE!!!

All we know is what the Police allowed us to know. Misinformation is typically left to percolate, because it is better to have some details not generally known in order to aid the investigation.

I took Smart's comment about the knife, and about the window, to mean "now at last I can tell you the truth because the perp is caught!"

And the article in the Trib about Mary Katherine demonstrates beyond a doubt that she was THE most reliable of witnesses whose story never wavered.

[landerwy]

AMT = Admin mod therapy!

[Lib Buster]

You can bet there will be a trial. Not if the two creeps who snatched and held her plead guilty. Perhaps they will surprise us and spare her the ordeal of a trial. We can dream, right?

[Goodman26]

Ed Smart says the family is not pressuring her to talk about what happened to her over the last 9 months. He feels it will all come out when she is ready.

Part of the problem here is that Ed probably took this same position with respect to getting the younger daughter to talk more promptly about what she saw the night of the "abduction."

I'm being blunt, rather than politically correct.

[GovernmentShrinker]

Let 'em taunt away. Easier to arrange more Admin Mod therapy for them that way.

[Illbay]

Strangely, I've noticed that the Mods don't "moderate" those who complain about being moderated.

It is illogical, imo, but that's what I've seen.

[Illbay]

Smart acknowledges this, but he says--and I agree--that they probably got the information from her earlier than they would have had they badgered her incessantly.

[Lael]

Contrary to opinions of a couple who shall remain nameless, I did NOT click the abuse button. I didn't even think of it actually

My remark wasn't intended to be abusive...I'm sorry it was interpreted that way.

In Halley's book Uncommon Therapy, Milton Erickson, perhaps the greatest Hypnotherapist/ Psychiatrist of all time, describes the actual, noticeable changes that occur in a female on 1, first unprotected sexual intercourse, and 2, continuing sexual intercourse.

A mere comparison of the 'Before' and 'After' photographs reveals this...it is obvious to the trained eye.

And, given that most abducted children don't survive 9 hours after being snached, my question about 'resistance/cooperation' would seem to be apt.

[Lib Buster]

I don't know about Utah, but some states have a statute that allows a person to be found "guilty but insane". Should they ever be judged to be mentally fit, they are released from the "nut house" and go straight to the "big house".

This is a big improvement over "not guilty by reason of insanity" which puts them back on the street to repeat their crimes.

[RnMomof7]

MSNBC is saying this guy is an excommunicated LDS. He is a fundamentalist Mormon and is preaching to the cops holding him. Seems he had a handwritten document that he had done proclaiming himself a prophet..thus the excommunication. The leaks say this was an intended plural marriage ..that the guy seems "sane" ( meaning I hope he can stand trial)

Just thought you'd be interest in the latest news..

I do not think the weapon or means is sugnificant Bill..this was a child and even if she was brain washed and went willingly..it was STILL kidnapping..a kid can not make that kind of a descision..He needs a long time in prision IMHO

[bonfire]

"this was a child and even if she was brain washed and went willingly..it was STILL kidnapping..a kid can not make that kind of a descision..He needs a long time in prision IMHO"


AMEN.

[Illbay]

Thanks for the update. I've seen some of this info already.

It sounds like this guy actually went from being somewhat normal, to quite nuts.

Mental illness, no doubt.

We have the ACLU and other Leftist groups to "thank" for the gradual move away from forced treatment of the mentally ill starting in the early 1970s.

[Iwo Jima]

I take most of your comments in good stride. You are right that we don't know what MK has said exactly, but if we can't believe the report that she said there was a gun, then how can we trust anything at all?

I do wish, however, that you would reconsider statements such as "Too many people, like you, are so wedded to their pet theories that they discard what is obvious in favor of their personal concoctions." You may not mean to be, but that sort of statement could be inflammatory to some (I'm pretty thick-skinned myself) and not always conducive to a rational discussion of the issues. Certainly you are free to disagree with my views or those of other posters, but why must we all toe the party line like a bunch of syncophants? Sometimes the minority or less obvious opinion turns out to be correct or at least food for thought.

Just throwing that out for your consideration.

[Catspaw]

I don't know about Utah, but some states have a statute that allows a person to be found "guilty but insane". Should they ever be judged to be mentally fit, they are released from the "nut house" and go straight to the "big house".

Those states are in the minority, unfortunately. I hope more states adopt the "guilty but insane" laws.

I've pinged Utah Girl to see if she knows or knows someone who does know what kind of insanity laws Utah has.

[Illbay]

Well, since you've already had at least one post pulled, I suggest you might want to rethink your "enlightened" opinions.

[Catspaw]

Did MSNBC say if he or his wife/girlfriend/companion had lawyers yet? If they do have lawyers, they'd be clamming up pronto.

[RnMomof7]

Well let just hope he is "sane " enough to stand trial..and his "wife" too..I really suspect this was a woman that wanted a replacement child, so like sarah she wanted another 'wife" ..this was one and one that could produce a baby to boot..She needs a long time away too..IMHO