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Astronomer saw shuttle apparently in trouble over California
San Diego Union Tribune ^ | 02/01/03 | John Antczak

Posted on 02/01/2003 2:25:26 PM PST by socal_parrot

By John Antczak
ASSOCIATED PRESS

12:03 a.m., February 1, 2003

LOS ANGELES – Space shuttle Columbia appeared to begin trailing fiery debris as it passed over Eastern California early Saturday, well before its destruction over Texas, according to a California Institute of Technology astronomer who witnessed its fiery transit.

Anthony Beasley observed the shuttle's re-entry from outside his home in Bishop, Calif., near Caltech's Owens Valley Radio Observatory, where he is project manager of the Combined Array for Research in Millimeter-wave Astronomy.

"As it tracked from west to east over the Owens Valley it was leaving a bright trail. As it actually moved over the valley there were a couple of flashes. ... Then we could see there were things clearly trailing the orbiter subsequent to that," Beasley said.

Beasley said he, his wife, Anne, and mother-in-law, Anne Finley, had gone outside in the early morning darkness to watch the re-entry from the small town 225 miles north of Los Angeles. He said the sky was clear and dark, and the shuttle was immediately visible when it cleared the Sierra Nevada peaks to the west of Bishop.

He said he had never witnessed a shuttle re-entry before and is not an authority on shuttles, but he immediately thought Columbia was having problems.

"In particular, there was one very clear event where there was a piece that backed off the orbiter. ... It was giving off its own light, then it slowly fell from visibility," he said.

Beasley said he thought the shuttle might be losing some of the heat-resistant tiles that protect it during the fiery re-entry. He said he did not learn of the shuttle's destruction until he went to the observatory and compared notes with two news photographers who had arranged to photograph the re-entry through a telescope.

Beasley said they compared notes and all agreed they had seen what he termed "the bright event, the third event."

"The analogy, I think, is it looked like the shuttle dropped a flare," he said.

He described the scene again: "Pretty soon after we started to see it track there were brief flashes of light. It would sort of flash a little bit and there was an indication of material trailing the orbiter. They would sort of disappear from view. ... That happened two or three times. One of these was very bright. It was a very clear thing. It separated itself from where the orbiter is. It sort of fell behind in the trail and it was burning itself. It was hot itself ... and then the orbiter continued heading toward Texas."


TOPICS: Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: columbia; columbiatragedy; feb12003; nasa; spaceshuttle; sts107
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To: CWOJackson
Grab a grip on reality. This is what's gonna happen, like it or not.

I don't like it either.
221 posted on 02/02/2003 12:05:23 AM PST by Fred Mertz
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To: Jael
What was the problem with freon? Don't tell me it was replaced to prevent deterioration of the ozone layer....
222 posted on 02/02/2003 12:05:49 AM PST by unspun
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To: TLBSHOW
Todd, For a long time now, I have held back from telling you what I think of you and your flip flopping positions on this forum, But now I'm damn sick and tired of your double talk and playing both sides of the issues.

Todd, On any given day, you filp flop on where you stand from thread to thread, If one of the rabid Bush Bashing libertarians post a thread on a subject blaming President Bush for things like todays space shuttle disaster, you agree with them 100%, And on another thread on the same subject, posted by a Bush supporter, you will agree with that poster as well. It's almost sad to see a FReeper like you, who is in dire need of a backbone and some principles to stand for.

I'm not quite sure who or what can help you, But one thing is for sure.... you need a professional

223 posted on 02/02/2003 12:07:24 AM PST by MJY1288 (In God we trust)
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To: Jael
I will lay ya all 10 to 1 rught now that the official cause will be the insulation that came off during Launch...

(I have no idea if this is true But I bet that is what we hear as official)...

Then somebody will be fired...

President Bush will appoint someone new...

Congess will hold hearings....

and then we will start the merry go round up again...

In other words after all the smoke clears we will have the same Circus... different Clowns!

I am not laying blame on any one faction and certainly not President Bush, but NASA has become just another government agency...

Nothing more!

224 posted on 02/02/2003 12:08:23 AM PST by Mad Dawgg (Fire all the Bureaucrats at NASA and lets get some innovators in charge!)
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To: MJY1288
What's that all about?
225 posted on 02/02/2003 12:09:23 AM PST by Fred Mertz
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To: Mad Dawgg
In other words after all the smoke clears we will have the same Circus... different Clowns!

You nailed it! And you're learning too. A+ for you.

226 posted on 02/02/2003 12:11:15 AM PST by Fred Mertz
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To: TLBSHOW
Todd, I don't know this don guy and I don't know what was in .. I don't even know if Bush saw it

But I do know you have going over the top with this letter thing

and I do know as long as I can remember NASA has always been asking Congress and the WH for more money .. just like every other department that this government over sees
227 posted on 02/02/2003 12:13:42 AM PST by Mo1 (I Hate The Party of Bill Clinton)
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To: Fred Mertz
Of course it's going to happen. I have no doubt what-so-ever that the I hate Bush at any excuse crowd will use this and Miss Cleo's predictions to try attack the President. Bottom line is that this person's letter is simply one of many, many thousands of letters received by the White House by ever so qualified experts...all of whom are righteously convinced the future of everything rests with their opinion.

We know very little about the author of this letter other then he has credentials of unknown value. We don't know the real value of his credentials or the reason he resigned. To be giving the letter any sort of credit at this point is very premature.

Beside that, a little common decency would cause most people to wait a few days before going on their tirades of blames. There will be plenty of time for finger pointing and scoring of political points in the months to follow...a decent interim period of calm in honour of the dead doesn't hurt.

228 posted on 02/02/2003 12:15:30 AM PST by CWOJackson
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To: Mo1
Richard Bloomberg is another name to look into besides Don and of course the rats are involved too.

Check back on the NASA hearings for more information! Better prepared than not!


229 posted on 02/02/2003 12:20:48 AM PST by TLBSHOW (God Speed as Angels trending upward dare to fly Tribute to the Risk Takers)
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To: Mo1
You might as well save your breath. He's like the hyper poodle with the over active bladder. He's too happy running around piddling everywhere to listen.
230 posted on 02/02/2003 12:22:11 AM PST by CWOJackson
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To: MJY1288
You have never been one to hold back. Show me where I flip flop? Thanks!

FYI
If you are not interested in helping head off a major rat attack that is coming I would have to ask you why? Why don't you write Fox for printing the story or the Guardian who we already know is left wing.
231 posted on 02/02/2003 12:24:21 AM PST by TLBSHOW (God Speed as Angels trending upward dare to fly Tribute to the Risk Takers)
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To: CWOJackson
AMEN, It's almost predictable who will be the first to start pointing fingers on this forum anymore. Just do a search on "Bush Knew" and read the threads, They're on all of them.

I mean WTF, We haven’t even gathered enough of the remains suitable for burial and these tinfoil hat wearing Bush Bashing imbeciles are out in full force.

232 posted on 02/02/2003 12:28:58 AM PST by MJY1288 (In God we trust)
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To: unspun
I don't know all of the details, not yet anyway.
233 posted on 02/02/2003 12:29:03 AM PST by Jael
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To: Fred Mertz
Yes, it should be. I hope to be able to do that. :-)
234 posted on 02/02/2003 12:30:52 AM PST by Jael
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To: TLBSHOW
Let it go and let us just morn those that were lost on the shuttle .. there will be an investigate and we will find out what cause this terrible accident ..

As for the attacks from the left .. if they had an ingrown toe nail, they'd blame that on Bush also ..

235 posted on 02/02/2003 12:33:41 AM PST by Mo1 (I Hate The Party of Bill Clinton)
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To: Mo1
Let it go

Its your call and like the Lott affair don't say I did not put out a warning. I hope your right and its nothing, but this isn't a simple rat attack, the whole nation wants an answer to what happened yesterday morning and why. Add the liberal attack that is to blame The President well the mixture is there for a mighty big fire. Like I said check who was the vocal ones in the NASA hearings. Yep the rats!
236 posted on 02/02/2003 12:42:29 AM PST by TLBSHOW (God Speed as Angels trending upward dare to fly Tribute to the Risk Takers)
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To: TLBSHOW
Like I said they would blame Bush for their ingrown toe nail

As for what caused this .. I am no expect .. far from it but IMO it has to do with the titles .. we shall see

As for now, I am going to pray for those that were lost and for their families
237 posted on 02/02/2003 12:53:43 AM PST by Mo1 (I Hate The Party of Bill Clinton)
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To: TLBSHOW
Bush wanted money for nasa when he ran for president.
He has NOT had a majority in both houses of congress til three weeks ago.
His administration was touting a potential mission to mars and nuclear rockets, a week and a half ago to get more money for nasa...
http://www.nuclearspace.com/a_stafford.htm
How much sooner could we get funding through the congress?

For that matter, we HAD to fly the shuttle mission as this was the #5 satellite in the critical military high tech satellite constellation we needed for Iraq. this was a MUST DO mission... or so I HEARD.

We had to fly it. We don't have the backing of congress... and as a result SEVEN died. Perhaps that satellite was worth thousands of lives. Perhaps they took pictures while they were up there.

In any case YOU cannot blame bush.

we might find out that the tiles were intentionally contaminated by espionage at the last inspections...

We KNOW it was NOT shot down... but you can bet if the commies have penetrated los alamos... they could have gotten a janitor into JSC or Edwards with a can of spray contaminant, disguised as windex...

I don' think THAT kind of sabotage can be ruled out yet.
And if it WAS discovered to be that kind of sabotage, we would never admit it... but the chinese would lose another satellite or two of their own... probably in proximity to beijing.

Who knows? I know it was not bush's fault and that he has wanted more money for space exploration and perhaps militarization since before the election of 2000... I believe the article written about the concept was by a guy named Joel Achenbach.

It was discussed here back in 2000
238 posted on 02/02/2003 12:56:03 AM PST by Robert_Paulson2 (clintonsgotusbytheballs?)
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To: Robert_Paulson2
The Stafford Commission and Nuclear Propulsion

by Rick L. Sterling

The SEI program was announced by President George H. W. Bush on July 20,1989 at a speech he gave at The National Air & Space Museum. The President's plan called for the completion of Space Station Freedom, the construction of a lunar base & a manned expedition to Mars. Later the President called for detailed studies about how to achieve these fascinating goals. One of these research groups (The Stafford Commission) requested that the general public submit proposals for lunar & Mars exploration.

I had been interested in nuclear rockets since I first read about them in science fiction novels as a child. I knew that The Rover Nuclear Rocket Program was started by Senator Clinton P. Anderson in 1960. It had tested nuclear rockets such as Kiwi & Phoebus for many years with much success. In addition, President Kennedy had called for its accelerated development in the same speech that he proposed the moon landing (May 25,1961). Finally, Dr. Wernher Von Braun had proposed the use of NERVA for a manned Mars expedition to the Space Task Group in 1969. Thus, I knew it had a rich history in the US. I wondered if given the President's speech, the time was now right to revisit the issue of nuclear propulsion systems.

A nuclear rocket's primary advantage over chemical powered rockets was the fact that they could generate many times more specific impulse (ISP). Specific impulse is similar to miles per gallon in automobiles in that it is a measure of the efficiency of the fuel. Greater specific impulse means less travel time to Mars & thus more protection for the astronauts from the effects of microgravity (bone loss, muscle loss, etc.). If the US Government were seriously interested in manned interplanetary travel, it would have to consider nuclear propulsion.

NERVA Reactor RocketGiven these facts, I decided to submit a research paper that stressed the advantages of nuclear power over chemical propulsion. My paper emphasized the NERVA (Nuclear Thermal Rocket) but also discussed other types of nuclear rockets (Nuclear Electric, Gas-Core Nuclear Rockets & even Nuclear Fusion Systems). I discussed not only the technical aspects of nuclear propulsion systems but other issues such as international cooperation in the development of space nuclear propulsion (Russian development of nuclear electric rockets & joint funding), the positive effect that its development would have on our country's young people (Manned interplanetary travel & NERVA, etc. would increase their motivation to study math, physics & space science) & the economic & commercial consequences of manned interplanetary travel that utilized nuclear propulsion systems. I took about two weeks to research & write my paper. I sent it to The Stafford Commission in June,1990, but I really didn't think they would support my proposals. I was to be pleasantly surprised. The Commission adopted just about everything I had recommended in my paper. Regarding NERVA system The Stafford Commission stated. "Based on experience gained in this program and the Space Exploration Initiative requirements, nuclear thermal rockets, with further development, are the choice propulsion technology for the interplanetary phase of a Mars Mission." (America At The Threshold-America's Space Exploration Initiative - Page 66). In addition regarding my proposal to use the NERVA system & the SEI concept as an academic motivator for our country's young people, The Commission stated, "The Space exploration Initiative will rejuvenate interest in science & engineering & The Space Exploration Initiative will motivate and inspire the new generations on which our future as a nation depends." (America At The Threshold-America's Space Exploration Initiative-Pages 12-13) For the next decade nothing was done about Nuclear Rockets.

Then a few months ago President Bush proposed his Nuclear Systems Initiative. This program will cost almost a billion dollars over the next five years & will include the development of nuclear electric rockets. I had discussed nuclear electric rockets in my 1990 research paper, and I knew they could produce a specific impulse 10 times that of chemical rockets. With this type of program President George W. Bush was laying the groundwork for many of the manned interplanetary missions of the early 21st century. It's been a long time coming.

Bush has been trying to get money for quite a while now... even before he got the majority installed in Congress...

239 posted on 02/02/2003 1:03:28 AM PST by Robert_Paulson2 (clintonsgotusbytheballs?)
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To: Robert_Paulson2
I DON'T blame the President.......


but thanks for the post and links!

240 posted on 02/02/2003 1:03:57 AM PST by TLBSHOW (God Speed as Angels trending upward dare to fly Tribute to the Risk Takers)
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