Texan arrested in Turlock (CA) in sting for Web pedophiles

Modesto Bee ^ | 2/2/03 | Pat Giblen

[sinclair]

Didn't say any of that stuff. All i said was; don't solicit children for sex. No problem. I don't see a constituional crisis every time someone gets caught breaking the law.

[Phantom Lord]

If a young-looking adult woman claiming to be 15 had sex with an older man, would he be committing statutory rape?

That is one of the reasons that SCOTUS made the right ruling last year regarding "virtual" child porn, and allowing it. The way the law they struck down was written, if a 20 year actress portrayed a 15 year old girl and appeared nude or in sexual acts, that, by law was child pornography! Never mind that the actress was 20!

Or, if the actress "appeared" to be under the age of 18. Never mind her age. If she "appeared" to be under 18 to the judge, it is child pornography.

[Excuse_My_Bellicosity]

I'm not real sure about the entrapment part. The FBI has to show in court that the guy was seeking contact with the "girl", made the first offer for sex, and wasn't just merely being led on by the "girl".

[Phantom Lord]

Didn't say any of that stuff. All i said was; don't solicit children for sex. No problem. I don't see a constituional crisis every time someone gets caught breaking the law.

And I also said that I have no problem with them nabing someone who did solicit. But i have a feeling that chat rooms are loaded with agents of the government actively seeking out men to engage in conversation, not sitting back waiting for one to engage them. And that is what I think is wrong.

[banjo joe]

would not be surprised if there are FBI agents sitting in chat rooms typing "13 year old girl looking for older man to chat with" to see who bites their hook.

I cruised some boards and rooms back when I was single. Occaisonally you'd see that '16 y/o'...

Not only would I not respond, I would log out and come back another day.

[MrCraig]

EXACTLY!, thats my problem with the whole thing as well. Just like the drug and prostitute stings you see on the cop shows. Entrapment indeed.

[Phantom Lord]

Outside of FreeRepublic and a very small number of other political "chat rooms", I can not think of any other chat room I have ever been in. So I actually have no idea how they operate or what is said in them. I could be way off in my thinking of how they work.

[Bloody Sam Roberts]

I am still a little uneasy with federal officals lying about who they are.

Mmmmm. And it sound as if it was a fairly expensive investigation to boot.

Either way, the right guy is in irons.

[CanisRex]

I guess the part that bugs me is that there are no children actually involved. The "crime" takes place exclusively in the mind of the pervert. He solicited no child, but rather a cop posing as a child.
,
Exactly! I think that what this guy's "intentions" were were dispicable but this entire "crime" was baloney. This is no different from punishing someone for telling someone else they are going to speed in a vehicle

[VRWCmember]

What could they have spent their resources on that would have benefited you and I? Could any of this be construed as entrapment?

... that would have benefited you and me. Personally, I find that removing a pedophile like this from the community benefits my neices (I don't have a daughter but I have five neices).

I'm sure a sleezy lawyer will try to argue the entrapment angle, but unless they contacted him first, sought him out and tried to lure him into the encounter (seems a little pushy for a 13-yr old girl so it probably wouldn't be a very effective technique for catching pedophiles who tend to be predatory by nature), I doubt such a defense will fly with even a gullible jury -- let alone a judge who would rule on such questions.

[Excuse_My_Bellicosity]

I wouldn't say that I'm 100% comfortable with FBI agents posing as other people in the internet, but people who try to lure little girls into having sex are a serious danger to society and they need to be stopped.

I'm sure the FBI has to be really careful about how they approach something like this. Cases have been thrown out because the judge ruled that the FBI was engaging in entrapment. The FBI has to be able to prove that the perp was actively seeking a meeting and wasn't just being led on.

I personally don't buy the entrapment argument in a case like this. Even if the agent posing as a young girl was trying to initiate a meeting, a guy should have the discretion to say 'No, this is wrong, I shouldn't be doing this.'

[Restorer]

OTOH, as the proud father of two girls, I wouldn't mind a few minutes alone with this guy.

[Bloody Sam Roberts]

I have no problem with that. Any man that would want to hook up with a young person like that is a criminal.

I wonder if an FBI agent pretending to be a 13 year old girl has ever hooked up with an FBI agent pretending to be a perv on the prowl. That'd be a hoot. Wouldn't you love to be there when they meet at the local Burger King?

[JudyB1938]

Trust me. You are.

[krb]

I gotta go with Phantom Lord on this one.

You statement is really like the whole "if you aren't doing anything wrong..." argument for no privacy, etc.

I know pederasty is nasty and properly illegal, but this law enforcement technique does seem to border on entrapment.

[VRWCmember]

I am still a little uneasy with federal officals lying about who they are.

Law enforcement officials, Intelligence and Security agents, etc. often have to disguise their identities in order to apprehend drug dealers, smugglers, terrorists, kidnappers, rapists, serial killers, and other sorts of low-lifes -- including this pervert. I'm glad he encountered a federal official lying about who he was rather than an impressionable and gullible little 13-yr old girl starved for fatherly affection who would turn to a stranger in hopes of attention.

[Excuse_My_Bellicosity]

That would be pretty wild.

[banjo joe]

Most of it's b.s., PL. But it can be entertaining. The main thing is always assume everyone else is lying.

[mg39]

"I'm sure a sleezy lawyer will try to argue the entrapment angle."

I personally don't consider it entrapment, and I'm glad this creep has been arrested. However, lawyers are hired/appointed to vigorously represent their clients, so we should all bear in mind that when they put forward arguments to help their client, they are not being sleazy, they are being (believe it or not) ethical attorneys, i.e., doing their job regardless of their personal beliefs.

People love to bash lawyers, but the alternative is anarchy and vigilantism.

Anyway, are pedophiles the stupidest criminals around? This kind of sting has been going on for years.

[VRWCmember]

but this law enforcement technique does seem to border on entrapment.

Perhaps it would be better to (1) wait until after the pedaphile successfully lures away, abducts, molests, and probably murders a few 13-yr old girls, (2) collect enough evidence from the documentation of the arrangements via chat room logs, (3) hopefully recover the bodies, and (4) prosecute the creep for kidnapping, rape, and murder thereby sending him away for longer.

We lose a few children along the way but we make sure the perverts' civil rights are protected and there is no hint of entrapment.