Need Info on Wefare to Help My Arguement With Some Co-Wrokers

m1-lightning

[m1-lightning]

I can't seem to find anything on the net in the way of the history of welfare. I've come across some reform issues with Clinton and Congress but nothing more. I'm looking for who came up with the idea, what President implemented it, why it was started and so on....if any of you are history buffs or were around during the times please post your thoughts. Thanks!

[sausageseller]

A good rule of debate for you would be, " If you say something is not true, back it up with FACT!"

[sausageseller]

scisyhp signed up 2002-10-30. Troll?

[Mr. K]

Then dispute the facts as I have sted them...

1) The govt ADMITS welfare is only 30% efficient.

2) The average benefits (about $20K) are also a known fact.

3) The calculation is then very simple. For each person recieving about $20K in benefits, $42K is lost in the paperwork, or the equivalent of one full-time employee for each person on welfare.

Instead of insulting me, show me where I am wrong...?

[Mr. K]

geez I need to proofread beter

ooops there I go again!!@

[Mr. K]

FDR started it, LBJ completed it when he signed the 'great society' into law. When he did he was quoted as saying "I'll have them niggers voting democrat for years..."

Don't flame me folks- it is an actual quote- See Gary Aldrich's book.

[Mr. K]

#1 is a WELL KNOWN FACT reported on so often as to not need credit, but I will find a source for you

#2 look at the cost of an apartment, heat/electricity, food allowance, etc and it is EASILY over $20K a year in 'benefits'. I have used CONSERVATIVE estimates from PERSONAL EXPERIENCE.

#3) ok I was even MORE conservative in my calculation- $46K is much worse than $42K

I will find sources and post them, but after I do will you admit my argument is correct? It is a simple question: a yes or no answer will suffice- If #1 and #2 are correct then #3 is true, isn't it?? yes or no please...

[FITZ]

I think it's probably much higher than $20K on the average if you combine all the welfare programs --TANF, food stamps, Medicaid, WIC, Head Start programs, HUD, free milk and cheese, and all the rest. It's not just double dipping but quadruple dipping this is done, when they send their kids to Head Start to get free breakfast and lunch, they still get the same amount of WIC and Food Stamps.

[VOA]

bump

[xlib]

Try this: "The Tragedy of American Compassion," by Marvin Olasky. He looks back at church-based efforts of past centuries and compares them to the modern welfare state. This book was often cited by Gingrich and others during the welfare reform debate. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0891078630/qid=1040752271/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_1/102-3953035-9878548

[Publius6961]

Even you calculation is done wrong. If $20K is 30%, the remaining 70% would be 20x70/30 = 46.67. Don't you have a calculator?

I'm on your side, but...

Even a calculator won't help when you use the figures exactly backwards.
30% of $20k is only $6000

[Mr. K]

I know- i was trying to be CONSERVATIVE in my estimates, because I am speaking from memory.

I know the facts are true, can anyone remember where the US admits that welfare is only 30% efficient? I know it has been recognized for years. Talk show puncdits regularly refer to it as fact, but durned if I can locate a source right now...

[Mr. K]

you have it backwards- 30% efficiency means that the $20K a person recieves IS the 30% and the 70% is what is lost- about %46k

[FITZ]

Where do they find ANY efficiency in welfare?

[APBaer]

Hello Nugnut,
I believe you answered my post by error.
APBaer

[Mr. K]

ok, why weren't you so reasonable in your first (very insulting) replies?

My numbers are correct, I am just at work and cannot surf for sources... but I am confident in them.

So how do you feel about 1 full-time social worker for each person on welfare...?