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1 posted on 12/21/2002 3:32:28 PM PST by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow
Kind of always wondered why Planned Parenthood and NARAL want to keep African-American young women totally ignorant of alternatives to abortion.
2 posted on 12/21/2002 3:36:38 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: marshmallow
read later
3 posted on 12/21/2002 3:39:22 PM PST by LiteKeeper
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To: marshmallow
"I didn't realize that's something inside of you," ...I could see the hands and the feet, and I could hear the heartbeat.
 
Reality: 1
Propaganda: 0 

4 posted on 12/21/2002 3:40:50 PM PST by Jeff Chandler
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To: marshmallow
Goody....another out of wedlock baby that tax dollars can help support.
6 posted on 12/21/2002 3:55:41 PM PST by Sungirl
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To: marshmallow
Poor women provide better prenatal care after seeing them (this helps explain why three pro-choice black members of Congress, who represent poor districts like Newark, New Jersey, and the south side of Chicago, support Glessner’s legislation)

This makes sense...

7 posted on 12/21/2002 3:57:55 PM PST by syriacus
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To: marshmallow
I remember when I first saw the GE 4D ultrasound commercial. I was truly amazed and thought good news for the Pro-life movement.

Sorta ends the "it's just a blob of tissue" argument, doesn't it?

9 posted on 12/21/2002 4:05:08 PM PST by lizma
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To: marshmallow
It says something wonderful about our culture that our "underclass" would see their unborn children as something wonderful...as opposed to China and India, where ultrasound is used for sex-selection abortions.

QUESTION: Can someone please explain to me why a young woman would choose abortion over carrying the child to term and putting it up for adoption?

Is is the discomfort/pain of pregnancy and childbirth? The altered body?

11 posted on 12/21/2002 4:13:02 PM PST by NativeNewYorker
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To: marshmallow
bump
21 posted on 12/21/2002 4:49:01 PM PST by Diago
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To: marshmallow
Dear Fellow Freepers: Please donate to the anti-abortion cause of your choice this holiday season.

Abortiontv.com

I don't necessarily mean the one above in the link, but here's another one that needs help:

The Human Life Foundation,Inc.

215 Lexington Ave, 4th Floor

New York, NY 10016

They also have an outstanding Journal Review, which seems to accompany any donations.

In fact, I will match any pledges up to 100 dollars total that you make me aware of, to any pro-life organization, meaning $100 total.

Let's save some lives.

35 posted on 12/21/2002 5:42:44 PM PST by Dec31,1999
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To: exit82
Thought you would and your helpmate would like to read this.
60 posted on 12/23/2002 5:01:17 AM PST by sonrise57
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To: marshmallow
I've always said the way to end abortion is to change "Hearts and Minds". I guess I should make it "Hearts, Minds and Technology" now.

Either way is light years better than the hard-core anti-abortion freaks who do nothing but SCREAM "ALL OR NOTHING" and scare women away from the GOP, thus hurting their own cause.

61 posted on 12/23/2002 5:09:29 AM PST by Johnny Shear
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To: marshmallow
I will never forget the first time I saw my first child, my son, literally bouncing up and down like a kangaroo inside his mother's womb at about 5 months thanks to ultrasound. A magical, mystical experience which enriches me everytime I recall it...

He is six now and i cannot imagine a more precious gift from God. That every child were so treasured.

62 posted on 12/23/2002 5:22:51 AM PST by chilepepper
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To: nickcarraway
ping
64 posted on 12/23/2002 7:21:46 AM PST by Desdemona
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To: marshmallow
oh NO we can't have INFORMED decisions in this area! (*GASP*)

Great article. I wish men and women would stop buying the lie that parenthood is somewhat of a curse.
72 posted on 12/23/2002 6:42:52 PM PST by Terriergal
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To: marshmallow
So a mother has to see a shadow of her baby on the ultrasound before she understands that it is indeed a live baby? Maybe I'm a little dense....but I just don't get that. Women aren't that shallow...are they??
92 posted on 12/23/2002 9:15:40 PM PST by hove
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To: marshmallow
My daughter has a "high risk" pregnancy so she has a level 2 sonogram done last week. Her husband could not go so I went with her.

With wonder and awe we looked at tiny feet and little hands that looked like they were clapping in joy ..We decided it looked like it daddy...both our hearts were warmed..

It is real, it is a baby and it belongs to our family...Thank you Jesus!

98 posted on 12/23/2002 10:28:50 PM PST by RnMomof7
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To: marshmallow
See 3-d movie http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/692754/posts
131 posted on 12/25/2002 6:12:08 AM PST by miltonim
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To: marshmallow
powder..Patch..Ball FIRE!

Man oh man, wish I could donate a machine to every crisis pregnancy center in the US... and provide the training to run it....

136 posted on 12/26/2002 12:42:26 PM PST by BallandPowder
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To: marshmallow; Terriergal
Here is a letter to the editor from 1985 that touched on the issue of ultrasound. It's nice to have been at least a little prescient.
September 16, 1985

Dear Editor,

In the abortion debate many pro-abortion and not-quite-anti-abortion proponents have said the humanity of the fetus is “the central question”, “the central issue”, but never define humanity or human being except as something that is sentient, the killing of which would be murder. And? By their own words sentience does not define humanity for cows are sentient and humans may feel no pain if certain nerves are severed.

In the above context the case for first trimester abortions depends upon the experience of pain. Are they saying that denying life is not to be permitted if the experience is painful? For whom? Surely after the fetus is dead it will no longer feel or remember feeling pain. This reminds me of the question of whether one would rather be given a drug before an operation that would prevent pain or be given one later that would erase from the memory the pain experienced during the operation. Such questioning is secondary to the fact of the operation. What will be its result? In the case of abortion the result will be the death of the fetus whether it feels any pain or not.The experience of pain, then, is not bad in itself if its cause brings about a better state of being or prevents a worse one. To grant or deny a fetus (the term here used generically) a future life outside the womb as a sentient human being by its present ability to experience pain seems more than bizarre--It’s okay, you know, it didn’t feel a thing because it wasn’t sentient. Yeah, which is better, to exist having felt no pain of abortion or to not exist having felt no pain of abortion? To be or not to be, that is the question, isn’t it?

Some have said “The case against abortion in the first trimester must rest entirely on metaphysics and philosophy.” I think the case for or against abortion at any time must rest entirely on metaphysics and philosophy. It appears that for many who wish to have nothing to do with metaphysics and philosophy “empirical reasons” are what they get when they pass the point at which they are no longer aware of (or have successfully forgotten) their philosophical and metaphysical reasons for selecting them.

The “empirical reason” appears to rest on cold fact, but the reason for using it rests on something entirely different. Any time one moves from the descriptive of “This is” to the prescriptive of “Do this”, one moves through the moral world of “This ought or ought not to be.” This is the world of motives and beliefs. It’s the world in which people actually live. It cannot be described in the same way that physics describes solar flares. This is central to the absurdity of “experimental” psychology’s attempts to explain human behavior by dissecting rat brains and measuring dog spit. There is that in human behavior which is man’s distinguishing characteristic which transcends the physical processes of reproduction, nourishment, and death.

When I was about five years old, I was taken to The Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago and ushered through the hall enshrining Human Reproduction, The Miracle of Life. On one wall I saw encased specimens (whether potentially human or just clever reproductions, I don’t know) arranged developmentally from conception to birth. I started at birth and asked my father if the baby, dying at that stage, would go to heaven. As I approached conception asking the same question, the answers changed from “Yes” to “probably” to “I don’t know” to “Probably not” to “No”. It gets down to the question of whether being human is something you are or something that you have become. I suspect that something akin to ethnocentrism (ontogenocentrism?) is involved here--those folks running around with bones through their noses aren’t like us and we’re civilized, so they probably aren’t, yet. Some say the fetus is “much more actually human after the first 12 weeks of gestation” and that it “little resembles a human being” during the first few weeks of gestation, meaning that it does not look much like, well, a post-birth body. It doesn’t look like me and I’m human, so it probably isn’t, yet.

It’s interesting how closely the question of the origin of man as an individual resembles the controversy about the origin of man as a species. Did man come fully human from the hand of G-d or was there a point at which, during eons-long evolution, the genetics defining the species Sapiens appeared? Was it “fully human” or was it merely human in appearance? Did there appear at the same time or later those characteristics which could be called “spiritual”? The first view holds all men of different languages, races, and cultures to be members of a common humanity. The second view makes possible all sorts of interesting self-justification from members of master races, true humans as opposed to sub-humans, for individuals personifying the new socialist man or the master race. And just as that distinction has made possible the genocide of whole groups who fell outside the official classification, so, too, have millions of pre-birth lives been defined into oblivion.

Over the years, I have heard people struggle with the question of when the fetus becomes a “human being” or an “individual” or a “person with Fifth Amendment rights.” Their error lies in attempting to make the term equivalent to some developmental stage. Really, for a long time I think it has been more a matter of "out of sight, out of mind" coupled with lack of thought than anything else. Before birth it was an “it”, after birth “he” or “she”. But sonograms and other technical means have extended our sight to the living pre-birth and have forced us to change our ideas of it.

Genetically speaking, there is a time before which an individual of a sexually reproducing species does not exist and after which it does, be it ever so humble. From that moment to the moment of its dissolution it passes through definable stages of development and degeneration. Here are some that apply to us: zygote, embryo, fetus, newborn, infant, toddler, child, pre-adolescent, young adult, mature adult, old-aged. Upon this continuum of development place an asterisk where “it” becomes “human” and perhaps another where its humanity ceases as far as the empirical world is concerned. Many would place the asterisks at conception and death (death defined as the irreversible disruption of the continuum). I do. It is this creature appearing at conception and disappearing at death that is human. Against this, talk about seeds not being trees and fertilized eggs not being chickens shows itself for the silly ontogenocentrism that it is-- the full-grown chicken is not a fertilized egg, but both are developmental stages of the same being. An acorn is not a tree, but both are equally oak.

If “human being” is a later stage of an individual’s existence, then what is the name for the being started at conception and ended at death? On the individual level the first view calls it human whether conscious or not, cripple, retarded, senile, diseased, sinful, intelligent, female, or male. The second view permits “quality of life and “value to society” to define the parameters of being human and those who have the power to do so to define those terms, whether a woman and her physician, N.A.R.A.L, or Big Brother.

The bottom line is that there is a struggle between equality under law and power as the law, between doing what we ought and doing whatever we can get away with, between submitting our desires to a higher moral law or enshrining our desires as the only moral law.

One will never find the answers in the charts and tables of science. And, for the modern man, that’s scary.

148 posted on 12/27/2002 1:38:39 PM PST by aruanan
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