[JohnHuang2]

Saturday, November 23, 2002

Quote of the Day by Common Tator

[WRhine]

Bush to push for amnesty

Very predictable, totally disastrous. Bush is going to push this assault on America’s sovereignty through come hell or high water. In the meantime I'm going to check into what laws I can safely break and get an Amnesty for it. I’m not hopeful I’ll find much.

[eldoradude]

I like GWB & think he's doing a fine job in a lot of areas. BUT!!! What the F is he thinking regarding "amnesty"? What part of 'illegal' immigrant is so hard to understand? It's about sovereignty, stupid. Why waste billions on Homeland Security spying on citizens when it would be much more cost effective and productive to have secure borders. America First!

[patriciaruth]

More and more we are going to be seeing articles with a thrust of dividing President Bush from his base of support as the Dems are going to be increasingly desperate.

I'm not going to let these people jerk my chain all the time. I'm going to wait until the President actually does something, and judge him on the act, not the rumor, because there are going to be plenty of rumors.

So far, I've sent money to the NRA to finance lobbying for arming pilots and for fighting CFR, and we have a Homeland Security bill now waiting signature that allows arming pilots (and I have a nice letter from my Congressman informing me that we were going to get it) and we have the Supreme Court recently deciding to take the case against the CFR law (Bush strategery to get the parts he didn't like declared unconstitutional and keeping the parts he did like that raised individual contribution limits).

PLUS, and a HUGE plus, we now have a Republican Senate again! Mostly due to the hard work and strategery of President Bush.

So, I'm not going to let these articles yank my chain every few days with rumors.

[Sabertooth]

Tony Garza, sworn in this week at the White House, told reporters in Mexico City that reaching an accord legalizing the status of Mexican immigrants — without giving them citizenship — continues to be a top administration priority...

"If we don't do something about their status, we will be admitting that our country has a permanent underclass," Mr. Garza said.

Mr. Garza told Mexico's Reforma and El Universal newspapers that the United States could offer legalized residency to as many as 15 percent of the undocumented aliens who have been here for more than 10 years.

"What I would like to see is us have a debate to establish some criteria to legalize these people who have been part of our community," Mr. Garza told Reforma. "I believe we should recognize them, giving them some sort of status."

Our new Ambassador to Mexico, Tonly Garza is not a nobody, he's been tight with GWB since the earliest Texas gubernatorial days. He's being fast-tracked in the GOP farm system for future national aspirations.

He is hardly a loose cannon, shooting his mouth off right after being confirmed. He's speaking with the full knowledge and approval of Karl Rove and President Bush.

A senior State Department official said he was unaware of any pending immigration proposal involving Mexico, and questioned whether it was wise to make recommendations that Congress might not approve...

But the senior official noted that Mr. Garza "came directly from the White House, so maybe he knows something we don't."

Ya think?

[ppaul]

Border Patrol

Amnesty? Like hell!

[goody2shooz]

ping!

[politeia]

"If somebody is willing to do jobs others in America aren't willing to do, we ought to welcome that person to the country, and we ought to make that a legal part of our economy," Mr. Bush said at White House ceremony with Mr. Fox. "We ought not to penalize an employer who is trying to get a job done, who hires somebody who is willing to do that kind of work."

This is the argument that gets thrown down to trump any assertion that we should deport illegal aliens or punish businesses that hire them: Americans will not do these jobs! This argument is the BIG LIE that corporations and political elites of both parties keep trumpeting to convince us, without ever having to prove it, that open borders and the resulting terrorism and lawlessness is the price we must be willing to pay for a healthy economy.

What Bush and other pro-illegal immigration people never say is that illegal immigration guts the wage market in every sector that illegals are employed in. Wages in these jobs are held down to subsistence level or below by the very immigration that the elites demand for their own self-interest. I believe there are plenty of native and legal Americans who will take these jobs if they can make a decent, livable wage.

I have a personal example. When I hired a nanny in the early 1990's, I interviewed several young American citizens who were willing to work for one thousand a month ($12,000 a year, not exactly high pay). At the same time I was offered help in obtaining an illegal immigrant from Guatemala who would work for $400 (without of course Social security or unemployment taxes). When I asked them what they would do if their nanny who they brought from Guatemala got sick, they told me they would take them to the local public hospital for free (tax supported) care. I was appalled.

We chose to hire an American citizen and my experience disproves George Bush's assertion that no Americans want these jobs. They don't want them at the same rate paid to illegal workers and I don't blame them. We hired an American citizen, paid her a decent wage (even though it took about half of my middle-income salary) and paid all the required taxes because that was the right thing to do. George Bush evidently would think I was a fool for doing this. Indeed, at the same time that I paid a legal nanny a good portion of my salary, many extremely wealthy members of the political and professional elite were making news for hiring illegal nannies and refusing to pay the required taxes (remember Zoe Baird and nannygate).

Our nanny’s situation was made worse by the fact that her husband worked in landscaping and his salary was also held down by the competition of many illegal immigrants he worked with. Even on their combined salaries, they barely got by. They could not afford dental care for their son and rarely went to the doctor and, they told me, they were not eligible for any welfare type programs such as food stamps. Here were two citizens working in jobs that George Bush tells us no Americans want. The truth is that American citizens have been forced out of these jobs by low wages. Multiply this story by the millions of illegal immigrants and you see how open borders is destroying the ability of an entire class of Americans to become even marginally self-sufficient.

The political and business elites like to blame the refusal to do anything about illegals on ordinary Americans. They say that “we” will not pay the prices for goods and services that it would take to pay American citizens a decent wage. “We” demand mass quantities of cheap goods. I believe this is untrue and furthermore I believe it is a mass slander against most ordinary Americans who would not begrudge a fellow citizen a livable wage, even though they had to pay more for goods and services.

I think it is the very wealthy professional and corporate elites who are not willing to pay livable wages or sacrifice any degree of corporate profit to employees. As a substitute for the failure to create jobs that allow citizens to become self-sufficient, these elites of both parties gladly support welfare and income redistribution policies that spread the cost of their open borders policies to all taxpayers. They get the best of both worlds: cheap labor for their estates and businesses and votes from the millions of people they keep dependent on them for daily living. It is an outright scheme to create a permanent underclass to serve their personal and business interests and to prop up their hold on political power.

In the end, we are all deluding ourselves in thinking that the cheap goods and labor costs afforded by illegal immigrants are a good bargain. I think most Americans understand this. We are subsidizing this insanity with our very lives (as the families of those who died on 9-11 can attest), with massive crime rates and prison costs, with skyrocketing welfare, defense and education costs, and most importantly with the destruction of the very economic and social conditions (an independent and self reliant population) that are required to maintain democratic self-government. If we added all these costs of illegal immigration to the prices of the goods and services they are involved in providing I doubt anyone would consider us better off in the bargain

This is the second and , in my opinion , the more important reason why pro-open borders elites in both parties are wrong to oppose controlling immigration -- because it is destroying our ability as a people to maintain sufficient consensus about our own political creed to continue to maintain not only our liberty but our very existence. It has already resulted in a massive failure of democratic theory as illustrated by the fact that the two parties have imposed on us for decades an open borders policy that a vast majority of us have never supported. They have accomplished this by never offering candidates that reflect what the majority of Americans want on immigration and by a media campaign to smear any opposition to illegal immigration as racist. To many Americans, this proves that our democratic process does not work, that the majority cannot prevail against the will of the ruling elites.

We all know that a few high profile prosecutions of employers will put an immediate brake on the lure of employment and would do more than anything else to stop illegal immigration without the need for draconian law enforcement measures or “roundups.” But Bush and the majority of other politicians of both parties will not support enforcing even the light employer sanctions that already exist. Think of why this is happening. Congress gets the credit for passing the laws but their refusal to demand enforcement of them lets the executive branch off the hook. It is a perfect scheme to avoid doing what the vast majority of Americans want done -- stop illegal immigration!

The widening economic and philosophical divisions between the interest of these elites and ordinary Americans and the dwindling consensus about our own founding principles that result are illustrated perfectly by this problem of illegal immigration. Either we deal with this issue in a way that respects majority opinion and restores confidence in the principles of democratic self-governance and simple self preservation or we sit by and wait for the completion of the destruction of our political heritage of liberty.

[Hostage]

JH2,

In all seriousness, the GOP seems to have given Rove a thumbs up for the election results.

I saw the election outcome as a result of swing voters staying at home.

Personally, I think Rove must go if he promoting amnesty for political purposes.

Wouldn't you think that had Rove pushed for amnesty in the last election the results would have been different?

Hostage

[Hostage]

The new mantra:

The threat they pose is not that they fail to assimilate or that they assimilate slowly.

The threat is:

they can provide a beachhead for the importation of not thousands, not tens of thousands, not hundreds of thousands but *millions* upon *millions* upon *millions* of illegal aliens.

The threat is not:

that they can create daisy chains of alleged relatives for immigration under family reunification

that they can house and otherwise find support for illegal aliens who may want to kill Americans

that they retain loyalty to a foreign government or culture

Because all of these reasons could be applied to many immigrant groups who have settled in America.

To repeat:

The threat is in the *numbers*.

[TheRedSoxWinThePennant]

mrs malkin paging mrs malkin please forward one of your books to 1600 pennsylvania ave

[nicmarlo]

BTTT; this is wrong, rewarding illegal behavior.

[madfly]

ping

[glock rocks]

[madfly]

ping

[RGSpincich]

Mr. Garza told Mexico's Reforma and El Universal newspapers that the United States could offer legalized residency to as many as 15 percent of the undocumented aliens who have been here for more than 10 years.

Does anybody read the details? Why are so many people here against Bush getting rid of 85% of the established illegal aliens and 100% of the illegals with less than ten years here? Even the Bush bashers must admit that many of the problems that plague our border areas' infrastructure would be solved if this group of the illegals were gone. Bush is bad because he proposes to expel 90+% of the illegals? Why are some complaining about this program?

[madfly]

ping

[Jimmy Valentine's brother]

I find this article most disturbing. On the one hand the Department of Defense has establed a data base under the control of Admiral Poindexter (remember him) to track the activities of U.S. Citizens (something about being secure or whatever in the Constitution comes to mind) and on the other hand the Bush administration continues to send signals about amnesty for illegals.

on rant- NAFTA was supposed to cure the cross border incursions. Bush should be putting pressure on Vincente Fox to create a middle class in Mexico. Of course hopes for that were dashed during the Clinton Administration when the IMF pressured Mexico to devalue the Peso destroying out middle class savings. -off Rant

I recommend that the DC Chapter discuss at our next Chapter meeting.

[Merdoug]

I live in Nashville, TN. In the past ten years it has become Mexico. Even billboard signs are in Spanish now. I don't mind Mexicans if they want to become AMERICANS, but they DON'T. They want to bring Mexico here. Bush is a traitor to the American People in this area. He is taking the side of Big-Business over our soverenty. Just my opinion.

[Fiddlstix]

Bump

[Nuke'm Glowing]

Bush to push for amnesty

A headline which might as well read 'Bush surrenders Southwest United States to Mexico". Pathetic and disgusting. Why doesn't he just call a time out and ask the terrorists really really nice to please leave since they came into our country illegally too? What a pile of chicken bleep we have in our positions of leadership in this nation now.