WSJ: Ford auto sales plunge 31% GM sales sink 32%, Chrysler’s 35%

MSNBC.Com / Wall Street Journal ^ | 11/02/2002 | Wall Street Journal

[Bobby777]

Vehicle sales plunge in October

Big 3 automakers’ figures drop over 30 percent vs. last year

THE WALL STREET JOURNAL

DETROIT, Nov. 1 — Auto sales fell in October, despite stepped up interest-free financing and other discounts, amid tough comparisons with an unusually robust performance a year earlier.

[Dataman]

Seems to me Daschle deserves some of the blame. W offered a stimulus package which might have had us out of this sluggish economy months ago but Tommy nixed it.

[grania]

my buddy just put one up a few blocks from me ... $400,000+ ... yowza ... I just hope he can survive the payments ...

If it's in your neighborhood, it's better that it's one $400,000 house than 4 $100,000 houses.

<^..^>

[kellynla]

Buying a new car from a dealership is a terrible investment. It's like buying a hooker. You get screwed for as long as you make the payments. The smarter move is to purchase vehicles at auction. Let someone else eat the depreciation. My first car was a Ford and my last car was a Ford, but when Ford flew the North Vietnamese flag over corporate headquarters when they opened a plant in Viet Nam I wrote Ford and told them I would never buy another Ford. I saw too many of my brother Marines maimed and killed fighting in Viet Nam to tolerate such a slap in the face by Ford. Especially when there remain over 2000 POW/MIA's unaccounted for from the Viet Nam war. Semper Fi

[RipSawyer]

What are you talking about? Checked the unemployment numbers lattely?

DO you believe everything you see on TV? Are YOU a software engineer?

I have recemtly started asking people in a casual way whether they believe that the economy is improving. I don't think I have gotten a yes yet. I still say that all I can see is negatives. Last year was supposed to be such a great year for new car sales but anyone with a brain could see that the sales were bought with special financing and rebates. Eventually even that had to be counterproductive and it looks like the time has arrived. I say batten the hatches folks, it is about to get rougher than anyone has imagined. We are about to pay the price for decades of living in lala land and thinking results can be seperated from causes. Guess what, the free bubble up and rainbow stew are just about gone.

[FormerLurker]

I saw too many of my brother Marines maimed and killed fighting in Viet Nam to tolerate such a slap in the face by Ford.

Ford opened a plant in Nam? Shows how well the media covers important events...

Semper Fi.

[FormerLurker]

Guess what, the free bubble up and rainbow stew are just about gone.

Time's a changing (although the majority of unaffected people could either care less or simply don't know)....

[Nam68]

I didn't know Ford opened a plant in Vietnam. Dang it, I liked Ford trucks and now I will never ever buy a Ford product again.

[taxed2death]

Don't waste your time here trying to defend American manufacturing jobs. There are actually people on this b.b who think that unrestricted free trade, which leads to huge trade imbalances is "good" for the consumer. I've wasted hours here on this b.b typing in facts to which you allude to........"no U.S. customers will be able to afford to buy their products".
Some people who work in ivory towers, who's feet never hit the "street", can't comprehend that every time an American manufacturing job is shipped overseas, it weakens our economy here at home. These same people tell me "don't worry, those manufacturing jobs are being replaced by new economy jobs". Yea right....ask the .com bubble bursting babies how the job market is out there. Just more BS slathered on by pencil necked geeks with Phd's in theoretical economics. Escapades into the real world reveal things are quite different than equasions previously thought were written in stone.

[FITZ]

What are you talking about? Checked the unemployment numbers lattely?

What do unemployment numbers mean anymore? All they do is count those who have any job at all, part-time jobs with no benefits count. Jobs that pay so low the "employee" is on WIC, food stamps, Medicaid and other welfare programs actually count as jobs. The Clinton Administration manipulated how unemployment statistics are to be used so it would look like unemployment was very low.

[FITZ]

These same people tell me "don't worry, those manufacturing jobs are being replaced by new economy jobs".

But ask them what those new jobs are and you get a blank. Some admit those jobs might be store-cleak jobs like Walmarts where employees might make $7 an hour instead of $15 working in a factory.

[kellynla]

If I had been the one to cut the deal I would have told Viet Nam to make a full accounting of all MIA's and POW's before I would have opened the plant there. Not only was that not done but as I said when they opened the plant they flew the Vietnamese flag at corporate headquarters. Sorry folks but that is where I draw the line. I didn't go to Viet Nam and get my behind shot off, return to have losers spit on me and call me names just so FMC could make cheaper automobiles. I would walk first. Semper Fi

[kellynla]

Excellent point, Fitz. And a point that bears repeating every day. Even if there was ZERO unemployment, it must be made clear "HOW MUCH" are the people actually "TAKING HOME AFTER TAXES." You wonder why mothers have to work to make ends meet. And who suffers? The children who have no adult supervision. They come home from school and sit in front of the television getting dumbed down. Just look at how much is taken out of your check and what you actually bring home. Parents, I hope you are encouraging your children to get a college education because in the very near future there will be absolutely no manufacturing in these United States. All jobs will be service and if they don't have at least a bachelor's degree they will be spending the rest of your life flipping burgers at Burger King or turning a wrench at the local Ford dealership competing with an illegal for a job that the dealership will try to pay the very least they can get away with paying. Semper Fi

[Sgt_Schultze]

...I told him it would be available most of 2003 ... he said "No way" ... I said "Yes way" ... otherwise they'll have to shut factories and layoff workers ... which now it looks like they'll have to do anyway ...

I believe you're correct. In fact, I don't know how automakers will be able to ever offer cars at other than token financing. I think zero-interest loans are the new Air Conditioning - a once costly option, now standard equipment.

[tubebender]

The Toyota Trundra is starting to make a dent in the Big Three truck sales and Toyota just announced they will spend up to a $100,000,000 to fund a Nascar challenge in the truck series. I told my son to learn Japanese and practice turning left.

[FITZ]

Parents, I hope you are encouraging your children to get a college education because in the very near future there will be absolutely no manufacturing in these United States.

In what though? Certainly not for degrees in information technology anymore since those jobs are for H1B visa holders now. Not in medicine because people losing insurance have no way to pay except to get in Medicaid and Medicare and the reimbursement is falling. Lots of college graduates aren't finding jobs now so why go in debt thousands of dollars?

[FITZ]

All jobs will be service

Service jobs won't be around much after we lose all the manufacturing jobs. If too many Americans are out of work or making minimum wage jobs, and not receiving employer provided health insurance, they won't be able to afford "services". People making minimum wage can't pay for doctors, lawyers, accountants.

I just wonder what our government and leaders intend to do about all the taxes they aren't collecting now from both businesses that left and Americans who are falling into lower salary ranges. When people make minimum wage, they get the "Earned Income Tax Welfare", they don't pay income taxes. Will the government now start cutting salaries on government employees like Congressmen? And cutting social program spending?

[kellynla]

A college diploma is a key to openig the door of opportunity and getting the degree is a discipline. When I was honorably discarged from USMC I went back to college not so much of what the professors would teach me because I was older, more experienced and some times wiser than many of the professors but to get that diploma and to learn all I could from the discipline and the courses. We all have gifts whether a gift of music, numbers, arts, technology or maybe mechanical. What we need to teach our children is to learn as much as they can while they can and to take that knowledge and those gifts to fill a need in society. As long as there is a world there is a need. One must only find a field they would like and take those gifts and knowledge to fill that need. How much you make is not as fulfilling as doing something you truly enjoy. I'll stop preaching. LOL

[xp38]

It's not all gloom and doom...sales in Communist Canada are great.

Auto sales still at warp speed 'Spectacular month': Many carmakers race past last year's totals by October

Paul Brent

Financial Post

Saturday, November 02, 2002

Canadian consumers continued to flock to car dealers in October, confounding observers who have said the torrid sales pace could not last.

The five automakers with significant manufacturing presence in the country all rang up sales gains, led by Toyota Canada Inc., Honda Canada Inc., Ford Motor Co. and General Motors of Canada Ltd. A total of 134,025 cars and light trucks were sold in October, up 10.1% from 121,697 a year ago.

"That is quite a spectacular month. Unexpectedly high," said Dennis DesRosiers, a Toronto-area auto analyst whose company compiles the monthly sales totals.

The sales results show the so-called transplants, Toyota and Honda, which both have assembly operations in Canada, continue to gain market share at the expense of their larger Big Three rivals, GM, Ford and Chrysler. Toyota's Canadian sales surged 18.2% to 12,263 from 10,372 a year ago. With the inclusion of its Lexus luxury brand, the maker of the Camry and Highlander has sold 129,651 vehicles in the first 10 months of the year, already more than last year's 127,651. Toyota's year-to-date market share has risen to 8.6% from 8%, according to DesRosiers Automotive figures.

Honda, the country's No. 5 seller, moved 13,061 vehicles in October, up 13.3% from last year, boosting its market share for the year to 8.4% from 7.9%. Its sales were led by the launch of the new 2003 Accord.

GM Canada, which like its U.S. parent company has relied on incentives to drive sales, reported sales to its dealers of 37,531 vehicles last month, up 8.3% from a year ago. GM's Chevrolet Cavalier accounted for about a third of the increase, with double-digit gains also made by the Pontiac Grand Prix and Chevrolet Impala.

"GM sales continue to outwit the pundits as October sales got us another rung closer to what may be a record year," said Marc Comeau, vice-president of sales, service and marketing. "For the calendar-year-to-date, GM Canada sales are up over 11% and we have already sold over 430,000 cars and trucks -- that's more than we sold in all of 1998." Thanks to GM's steady use of incentives, its market share has climbed to 29.8% from 29.4% a year ago.

The Canadian unit of the world's largest automaker also announced yesterday it has extended its zero percent financing to its 2003 model year and will make the first payment on the purchase or lease of most 2003 vehicles.

Ford Motor Co. of Canada Ltd. sold 18,458 vehicles in the month, up 12% from a year ago, on gains by its Expedition SUV, Ranger pickup and Focus compact car. "Canadians are buying cars and trucks at a record-level pace. The economy is healthy and consumer confidence remains strong," said Robert Girard, Ford's vice-president of sales.

DaimlerChrysler Canada Inc. sales rose 5.8% to 18,204 cars and trucks with strong sales of the Jeep Liberty and Chrysler Sebring sedans.

U.S. sales fell an estimated 26% in October.

[kellynla]

As far as taxes and government spending go IMO until the electorate demands that a better government is one that governs less and spends less is we will continue to pay more and get less. Otherwise we will wind up with nothing more than socialism which we are creating now. The pendulum has probably swung as far left as it can and within the next ten years it will probably start swinging back especially if people realize what is actually going on and how much we are all taking it in the shorts. Truth be known the average Joe/Josephine is paying half of his/her income in taxes and fees so the incumbents can get re-elected and feed at their constituents' trough. Semper Fi

[kellynla]

And auto sales will drop off this quarter. The only person in the automobile industry who will be busy in 2003 will be the Repo Man! So if you can't pay cash for an item don't buy it.