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Zionists Were Bad Enough, But Look At The Christian Right
TooGood Reports ^

Posted on 10/04/2002 7:57:31 AM PDT by RCW2001

Zionists Were Bad Enough,
But Look At The Christian Right

By
Norman Ravitch, Ph.D.

Toogood Reports [Weekender, October 6, 2002; 12:01 a.m. EST]
URL: http://ToogoodReports.com/

Ever since the creation of Israel in 1947-48, with the indispensable help of both the United States and Soviet Russia and in the face of British opposition, support for Israel has in this country had to be balanced off against other Middle East interests — and not just oil supplies.

Guilt undoubtedly had much to do with our initial support of Israel, since the FDR administration had done virtually nothing for persecuted Jews and by inaction only encouraged Hitler to believe he could with impunity exterminate them. The Soviets supported Israel for reasons of their own but quickly switched to support of Arab radicals like Nasser.

Jewish Americans, largely but not entirely pro-Zionist, have naturally supported Israel but have also understood that there were limits to how much America would do, given its world-wide interests which did not always coincide with Israeli needs. Their support of Israel was relatively moderate, reasonable, and restrained.

Zionists have always tried to show that support for Israel was totally in America's interest, since Israel was the only democracy in the Middle East. Unfortunately it has never been clear that we are better off with democracies in any particular part of the world.… But no matter.

American supporters of Israel have not been totally uncritical of Israeli policy and often they have supported the Israeli Left more than the Israeli Right.

But recently a new pro-Israel group of Americans has emerged, the Christian Right of Fundamentalist Christians. They had never been particularly pro-Israel before; in fact, they had been pro-Arab because of their interest in Arab Christians in the Middle East, trying to wean them away from traditional Catholic, Orthodox, and other eastern sects into becoming fundamentalistic Protestants.

But suddenly, for reasons I do not understand, they have begun to take the insane expectations of the end of the world more seriously and now feel that the return of the Jews to Palestine is a necessary step in the Second Coming of Christ and the end of time.

Therefore they support Israel, and not just Israel, but the most intransigent and Right Wing policies of people like Sharon and Netanyahu. That these policies may provoke a world war does not bother them; a war would only usher in the end times more quickly. They are prepared for Armageddon, the sooner the better. They expect that at some point during the conflagration the still remaining unbelieving Jews will finally accept Christ.

All these speculations and expectations proceed from a literal reading of various biblical portions, tendentiously interpreted as predictions of the future. No academic scholar of the Bible would agree with any of this, but no matter. If you can believe that G-d, the Lord of Creation, spends His time pulling strings, writing books, and causing nations to do this or that, you can believe anything. St. Paul had some apocalyptic expectations but even he would be appalled at all this. These fundamentalists know actually nothing of how the Bible came to be written, what its purposes were, and what it really means. For them, all is prediction of the future.

Right-wing Zionists here (neo-conservatives) and in Israel (Likud) have to hold their noses when they realize how little Israel means for the fundamentalists except as its fate ushers in the End. They are a bit embarrassed at the peculiar philo-semitism of the fundamentalists which is hardly distinguishable from anti-semitism, but they acquiesce because they want support for Israel against the Arab masses and the religion of the Prophet Muhammed, whom the fundamentalists regard as evil. Jerry Falwell, Franklin Graham (Billy Graham's son), and Pat Robertson have already denounced Muhammed as evil. Personally I don't disagree here.

So, whereas pro-Israel, Zionist Americans created some dilemmas for America's foreign policy, the pro-Israel fundamentalists are creating many more terrifying dilemmas. All too many GOP supporters are buying their apocalyptic nonsense and the Bush administration seems friendly to their concerns. If you thought that the Zionists might have had dual loyalties, Israel or American, think about the dual loyalties of the fundamentalists: This World or the Next World! Jean-Jacques Rousseau wondered over two hundred years ago whether Christianity was not incompatible with a Republic. He should feel vindicated.

Forget the Zionists! They are as nothing in the harm they can do compared to the mad fundamentalists.

To comment on this article or express your opinion directly to the author, you are invited to e-mail Dr. Ravitch at ravitchn@bellsouth.net .


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Israel
KEYWORDS:
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1 posted on 10/04/2002 7:57:31 AM PDT by RCW2001
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To: RCW2001
No academic scholar of the Bible would agree with any of this, but no matter.

Make that SECULAR scholar. (Apparently only secular scolars can be unbiased.) If you can believe that G-d, the Lord of Creation, spends His time pulling strings, writing books, and causing nations to do this or that, you can believe anything.

Now, this is interesting. This guy is probably a Jew (as evidenced by his hesitance to use the full name of God) yet he claims not to believe that God doesn't inject His will into the world.

2 posted on 10/04/2002 8:04:19 AM PDT by Blood of Tyrants
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To: RCW2001
The real dangerous to the world fundamentalists, are the Islamakazi Radical Fundamentalists.

Seen any Christian Fundamentalists flying planes into the WTC recent, RCW2001?

Only your buddies the Islamakazi Radical Fundamentalists and their controllers the IslamoFascist do that.
3 posted on 10/04/2002 8:05:38 AM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: RCW2001
I guess we should really just embrace our Islamist brothers huh?

Wow, you always give us such important things to think about. Where would we be without you pointing out how evil and nasty the Jews and Zionists really are?
4 posted on 10/04/2002 8:06:56 AM PDT by mgstarr
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To: RCW2001
Since when was the Christian Right ever pro-Arab? I don't remember that?
5 posted on 10/04/2002 8:09:22 AM PDT by Always Right
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To: RCW2001
Here is the low down on the really dangersous fundalmentalists, the Islamakazi Fundamentalists: ('Why We Fight America': Al-Qa'ida Spokesman Explains September 11 and Declares Intentions to Kill 4 Million Americans with Weapons of Mass Destruction!)

RCW do you agree with this POS Mullah who wants to kill 4 million Americans with Mass Destruction. Is that why you keep posting these pro Islamakazi Bravo Sierra prop spins?

6 posted on 10/04/2002 8:09:31 AM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: RCW2001
Another anti-Christian rant. Ravitch takes careful aim and then shoots up in the air without giving any specifics at all. It appears that he has been trying to read other peoples' mail.
7 posted on 10/04/2002 8:09:33 AM PDT by nightdriver
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8 posted on 10/04/2002 8:10:55 AM PDT by William McKinley
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To: RCW2001
They had never been particularly pro-Israel before

BS.

Having been raised in a fundamentalist church, I can tell you the religious right's "rabid" pro-Israel position has never wavered. It was identical in the 1950s.

9 posted on 10/04/2002 8:13:27 AM PDT by M. Thatcher
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To: RCW2001
Christian Right of Fundamentalist Christians

Does anyone have the website for this organization? They sound like my group of people. ;-)

10 posted on 10/04/2002 8:13:47 AM PDT by Frapster
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To: RCW2001
Here is another fundamentalist group of Islamakazis that represent more danger to the world in a mintute than the Christians do in a century: ('Wahhabi Lobby' Takes the Offensive!, link)

The first paragraph says it all about those who support the Islamakazis. They are paid to do it: Totalitarian regimes in the Middle East have targeted the United States with a well-financed influence campaign that is being rooted in American politics. Veteran watchers of the "active-measures" programs of the former Soviet Union say this Islamist propaganda offensive bears an uncanny resemblance to the old Soviet international front operations and the broad parade of fellow travelers who used themes of peace, tolerance and civil liberties to advance Soviet strategic goals by weakening the United States at home and abroad.

11 posted on 10/04/2002 8:13:55 AM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: RCW2001
More data on the most dangerous people on this earth, and not fundamental Christians. The most dangerous people on this earth of the Islamakazis, their masters the Islamofascists and their paid supporters who try 24/7 to present these criminally insane clymers as good people.

(In the late 1960s Palestinian secular movements such as Al Fatah and the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) began to target civilians outside the immediate arena of conflict. Following Israel's 1967 defeat of Arab forces, Palestinian leaders realized that the Arab world was unable to militarily confront Israel. At the same time, lessons drawn from revolutionary movements in Latin America, North Africa, Southeast Asia as well as during the Jewish struggle against Britain in Palestine, saw the Palestinians move away from classic guerrilla, typically rural-based, warfare toward urban terrorism. Radical Palestinians took advantage of modern communication and transportation systems to internationalize their struggle. They launched a series of hijackings, kidnappings, bombings, and shootings, culminating in the kidnapping and subsequent deaths of Israeli athletes during the 1972 Munich Olympic games. link)

12 posted on 10/04/2002 8:19:18 AM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: Blood of Tyrants
bump to watch - this oughta be interesting < flameshields >
13 posted on 10/04/2002 8:20:56 AM PDT by LiteKeeper
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To: RCW2001
All these speculations and expectations proceed from a literal reading of various biblical portions, tendentiously interpreted as predictions of the future. No academic scholar of the Bible would agree with any of this, but no matter

As a statement of fact, this is dirt-ignorant, dead-wrong, and stupidly-biased.

Otherwise, of course, A-OK. (What could you expect, I suppose, from a guy who can't spell "G-o-d" correctly?)

Dan
Biblical Christianity web site

14 posted on 10/04/2002 8:22:00 AM PDT by BibChr
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To: RCW2001
"You have to be an intellectual to believe such nonsense. No ordinary man could be such a fool.' George Orwell

"The tone and tendency of liberalism...is to attack the institutions of the country under the name of reform and to make war on the manners and customs of the people under the pretext of progress." - Benjamin Disraeli

15 posted on 10/04/2002 8:23:57 AM PDT by hosepipe
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To: RCW2001
The overwhelming majority of people who post to this site seem quite concerned about this world.
16 posted on 10/04/2002 8:29:01 AM PDT by liberallarry
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To: Diogenesis
Diogenesis, would you please post some of your 9/11 pictures that were the result of Islamakazis and not evil fundamentalist Christians.

Also, if you have any current pictures of the rampant killing in Israel by the Fundamentalist POS Islamakazis, please post them.

Thanks
17 posted on 10/04/2002 8:29:56 AM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: RCW2001
Right-wing Zionists here (neo-conservatives) and in Israel (Likud) have to hold their noses when they realize how little Israel means for the fundamentalists except as its fate ushers in the End.

This is absurd. As both a fundamentalist (theologically) and a Zionist, I can say that this guy is merely typical of liberalism as it happens to manifest itself in Jews: although it shows some peculiarities due to the author's particular time and place, it is still untethered to reality (see Barbra) and given over to the reification of hysterics (see Barbra).
18 posted on 10/04/2002 8:33:37 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: RCW2001
The fundamentalist movement Pro-Israel attitude began in the late 70's and was part of what pushed "The Great One" into the White House.

The only reason its showing up in the press is the Pro-Israel Jewish lobby is finally noticing where its friends are.

Better late than never.

19 posted on 10/04/2002 8:40:16 AM PDT by Zathras
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To: BibChr; RCW2001
Otherwise, of course, A-OK. (What could you expect, I suppose, from a guy who can't spell "G-o-d" correctly?)

Come on, Dan. As many times as you've been told why G-d is written G-d, you should remember by now. If you don't remember, that is troubling because it calls into question your ability to learn anything new. If you do remember but continue to pretend that you don't so you can use it as a jibe, then it calls into question your character. So I'll just hope that you forgot, because a bad memory, though something to be regretted, isn't something of which one needs to repent.
20 posted on 10/04/2002 8:40:47 AM PDT by aruanan
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