Posted on 07/02/2002 3:37:44 AM PDT by WhiskeyPapa
The Osceola Sentinel SUNDAY, JULY 5, 1998 -- An Edition of The Orlando Sentinel
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Historian: Civil War tales are pure bunk
History doesn't lie. Right? Well, the winners want history to make them look good. Sometimes the losers get their say, too.
Perspectives can change. Villains can be made to look like heroes. Interpreting the past can lead to lively debates. And because it is history, often the only confirmation comes from what was written down or told orally through generations.
Even so, care must be taken.
When talk turns to the Civil War and blacks' role with the Confederacy, there is no room for revisionist theories for Asa R Gordon.
For instance:
The Confederate states were interested in white supremacy.
The war between North and South was not about states' rights or a War of Southern independence. States' rights and independence are WHATS of the Civil War. The WHY of it was to preserve slavery, Gordon told a small group at St. James AME Zion church in Kissimmee last week.
Simply put, there should be no memorials honoring men like Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson. They and others resigned from the Union Army and fought against their country.
They were rebels, and they are traitors to the United States. Nations normally don't honor traitors, Gordon, a retired astrophysicist, said to a crowd that included a group from the Osceola Children's Home.
People normally don' t build memorials for traitors, racists or those who practice genocide.
There are no memorials to the Nazis.
In the United States, Confederate memorials dot the countryside. The flag is flown with pride. The Nazi flag - and Nazi leaders - inspire hatred.
It should he no different for Lee and others who fought for the South. The real heroes, Gordon said, are those Southerners who fought for the North.
As for those who try to promote the idea that blacks were willing soldiers for the South, Gordon's research disproves it.
In a lecture that was close to three hours long, the founder and executive director of the Washington, D.C. -based Douglass Institute of Government left no doubt about the fantasies and historical myths of Afro-Confederates.
"The South won in peace what it lost on the battlefield," Gordon said.
The commitment to the neo-Confederate movement is often emotional rather than intellectual, he said. It cannot stand the scrutiny of scholarship. The belief that blacks willingly served in the Confederate Army is ludicrous and harmful, he said.
"A slave didn't have a choice. If his master said he was going, the slave couldn't say no. He was a slave."
Those who say blacks fought for the South should look at Confederate documents, which ban blacks serving as regular members of the Army. They also need to look at records showing that those who did serve deserted when they got the chance.
Propagation of the present-day theories make it hard for people to realize that blacks were unhappy about their condition, Gordon said.
"How can you owe a people anything, if in fact they were so satisfied with the state that suppressed them?" he asked. "How can you correct that legacy if you are in denial about the true reasons?"
Gordon's visit was sponsored by Ann Tyler and Evan McKissic. McKissic, a retired Osceola teacher, has been critical of the theories of another retired local teacher, Nelson Winbush.
Winbush travels the country recounting the stories of his grandfather, who he said willingly and proudly served with Southern forces.
"I try to get the truth out. I talked with my grandfather, and I know what he said," Winbush said.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Pino welcomes comments. He can be reached at (407) 931-5935, by e- mail at OSOpino1@aol.com, by fax at (407)931-5959 or by mail at The Osceola Sentinel, 804 W. Emmett St., Kissimmee, 34741.
So let's see, a more comprehensive healthcare plan, against gun ownership, wishy-washy at best on abortion (although I've seen reports where she was quoted as being pro-abortion), and for tariffs on textiles. Of course she won't debate Snyder or Parker else she would be outed as the Democrat she really is. She's going to get voted in, and people will vote for her, some even on FR, just because she's running on the Republican ticket. Myself, I'd as sooner vote for my cat and will not be casting a vote for Giddy
I do find it peculiar and ironic the seemingly contradictory trends of the past half century.
The British Empire's and Soviet Union's disolution, Quebec's and Scotland's quest for further independence, as well as the continuing efforts of the Basque's and Tibetans while at the same time the U.N., IMF, WTO, NATO, and other global associations have gained power.
It suggests a recognition of both the value of regional, cultural, homogeneous "states" as well as the necessity for agreement of some basic fundamental rules being applied to international trade and defense. Damn curious. Almost like the same questions facing the founding fathers in the 1780's, only larger in scale and slower in resolution.
It is my hope that an independent united Ireland and "Confederate" States of America will come into existence, but with the current trends of immigration offsetting advances in technology, such a result seems unlikely in my lifetime. I imagine we will achieve "independence" shortly after it has ceased to be truly relevant. Such is the nature of man and history.
But one can hope, and of course, one never knows what fateful turns the world will take next.
Oh really? The former confederate states didn't celebrate the 4th of July for a very long time, thanks to the Reconstruction Acts, oh and thanks for trying to make your superior point and in prodding southerners such as myself. Southerners knew about a police state before the rest of the nation ever did.
The 1st Revolutionary War secured the independence of the States.
The Declaration of Independence declared that the United Colonies were free and independent States.
The US didn't exist until 2 decades later.
Be a Yankee Doodle, but not a Union Party lackey like Walt.
Cultures that have made soldiers of slaves ultimately do fail, but the original statement is preposterous on its face.
But, ultimately, all cultures fail. Whether they had slaves, or slave-soldiers, or not. We will be no exception. If our vices, failings, and defeats do not destroy us, our virtues, successes, and victories will. Cultures and civilizations are no more immortal than individuals are.
It takes a strong person to fess up to the fact that one's relatives owned slaves because they were too lazy and shiftless to do their own work and then were traitors to the world's greatest nation by taking up arms against it. This admission may help you to heal and then one day you may become a patriot of this nation. One can not be pro-Confederacy and pro-USA at the same time.
"Treason never prospers: what's the reason? If it prospers, none dare call it 'treason'.'"
Since the odds are 100% that one of your ancestors owned slaves, and that one of your ancestors at some point were "traitors" to someone or something, one has to wonder at your selective indignation at the South.
Of course, the men who founded "the world's greatest nation" (the USA) were themselves traitors to what was then the "world's greatest nation" (Great Britain).
The US didn't exist until 2 decades later.
Well, I am sure your co-CSA worshippers all nodded sagely at that. But the D of I dates from 1776. The articles of Confederation date from 1779.
By "two decades" after the D of I, Washington had been president for 4 years already.
Walt
BTW, the criminals (who SAID they were members of a legal ORGANIZED US military unit)in Lawrence were armed and DANGEROUS!
for TRUTH & dixie,sw
Even the Census records are anti-southron? Man, they're all out to get you, aren't they?
for dixie,sw
you are therefore, undoubtedly, keyboarding to a NON-existant person of colour.
for dixie,sw
Wrong by a factor of 5 or 10? Remember, You said that there were 100,000 free black confederates. The Census records say there were only 62,000 free black men of all ages in all of the Confederacy, including areas that the Union controlled from the start. Now to get 100,000 free blacks of military age, who would volunteer (your're not claiming that Jeff D was drafting blacks, are you?) the Census would have had to undercount free blacks by at least 5 times --- more likely 10 times.
Or could it be that you just pulled that 100,000 number out of your butt?
did you miss where i posted the source of the 100,000+ number?
Professor Blackerby was NOT a white man, but rather a person of colour, with a PhD from Harvard, as well as being the chairman emertius of the history department at Tuskeegee Univ.
for dixie,sw
If you want on (or off) of my black conservative ping list, please let me know via FREEPmail. (And no, you don't have to be black to be on the list!)
international law has always allowed punitive expeditions against WAR CRIMINALS, which the REDLEGS & jayhawkers definitely were.
for dixie,sw
The quote is; "I recently worked along side our textile workers..."
Az
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