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To: Stand Watch Listen
Remember that military personnel get (especially REMFs):

30 days (that is 6 weeks) of paid vacation a year
Average a 3-4 day weekends nearly every other week
Paid to work out/exercise
Can not be fired (ie kicked out of the army)
Can not be laid off
Full benefits (health, dental, 401k, etc)
Need only 20 years until full retirement
etc.

It is not really comparing apples to apples. And what do you compare (in the civilian world) to a Ranger or SF?

No flames - I have lived in both worlds
5 posted on 05/22/2002 8:18:27 AM PDT by 2banana
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To: 2banana
Remember that military personnel get ...

... ~50% time deployed overseas away from home and family (especially in the Navy), not being able to use that 30 days per year leave due to 'operational needs' in many cases, working in some of the most dangerous environments in the world (ie carrier flight decks, combat zones, etc), being both a representative and target whether on duty or off, etc.

Just balancing your paybenefits points with the scarifices demanded of servicemen and women.

No flames either.

V/R

9 posted on 05/22/2002 8:28:07 AM PDT by Magnum44
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To: 2banana
No flames, but your statements are misleading and inaccurrate.

FWIW, pay scales should go up, with a large bump for NCOs and Field Grade officers. Let there be turn over in the lower grades, but do a better job of attracting and keeping professional, career-minded people.

10 posted on 05/22/2002 8:29:54 AM PDT by Eagle Eye
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To: 2banana
Remember that military personnel get (especially REMFs): -30 days (that is 6 weeks) of paid vacation a year -Average a 3-4 day weekends nearly every other week -Paid to work out/exercise -Can not be fired (ie kicked out of the army) -Can not be laid off -Full benefits (health, dental, 401k, etc) -Need only 20 years until full retirement etc. Please do not think this is intended to be flames, however your REMF's are really not accurately portrayed. 30 days paid vacation is Sunday though Monday counted, not M-F, therefore it is slightly more than 4 weeks. I am not certain where 3-4 day weekends are the norm as you state. In fact they are rare in my line of service. Although I must admit I try to compensate my people due to their having to work 7 day work weeks for over 1/3 of the year. I do try to schedule PT during normal working hours if possible per instruction. I do this because their failure to meet physical standards can mean cause for dismissal or being unable to compete for advancement. -People are "fired" from the military, though usually due to their own misconduct or failure to adhere to standards. - And 20 years is not retirement. It is a retainer until their 30 year reserve status is complete. I have friends who are back on active duty after their "retirement" due to the recent events in the world. Again this is not a "fire" post. It is I feel a more accurate portrayal of the benefits package that goes with serving our country,
13 posted on 05/22/2002 8:36:11 AM PDT by Borntowade
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To: 2banana

Remember that military personnel get (especially REMFs):

30 days (that is 6 weeks) of paid vacation a year

Wrong! Military personnel must take weekends as leave. For instance, I want to take off 3 consecutive weeks then I must take the days as 21 consecutive days, we don't just take the weekdays as leave.

Average a 3-4 day weekends nearly every other week

Wrong, I don't know where you worked but the military I'm in doesn't have this luxury.

Paid to work out/exercise

Correct, since we are paid based on a 24 hour duty day I don't see that this should be a problem. Also, being physically fit is a prerequisite to being in the military.

Can not be fired (ie kicked out of the army)

Wrong, haven't you ever heard of a courts martial or administrative discharge?

Can not be laid off

Wrong, haven't you heard of the RIF (reduction in force) program. In the 90's we cut our forces significantly (laid off).

Full benefits (health, dental, 401k, etc)

Correct, what's wrong with this?

Need only 20 years until full retirement

Wrong, retirement at 20 years is at the 50% of base pay rate. Housing and other allowances are not used to calculate retired pay.

It is not really comparing apples to apples. And what do you compare (in the civilian world) to a Ranger or SF?

No flames - I have lived in both worlds

I don't know what military you were in but you sure don't know what you're talking about.

20 posted on 05/22/2002 9:31:25 AM PDT by ChuckHam
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To: 2banana
Average a 3-4 day weekends nearly every other week

Jeez. I want to work in *your* outfit. The only time I got that many days off in a row was when we were in stand-down just prior or just after a six month deployment (this is Navy). Otherwise, 3-4 day weekends were a fairly rare occurance.

Tuor

24 posted on 05/22/2002 9:46:21 AM PDT by Tuor
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To: 2banana
30 days (that is 6 weeks) of paid vacation a year

Subject to the "needs of the service."

Average a 3-4 day weekends nearly every other week

And what planet was THIS on?

Paid to work out/exercise

And not paid overtime when pulling 18-hour watches.

Can not be fired (ie kicked out of the army)

Hmm. Then I guess those guys I knew who got the Big Chicken Dinners didn't exist.

Can not be laid off

I guess you've never heard of "SERB," or "RIF."

Full benefits (health, dental, 401k, etc)

401k? Gosh, when did THAT come about? As for the medical benefits: yup, you get them, delivered by persons who couldn't survive in private practice (or even get licensed or keep their license).

Need only 20 years until full retirement

Followed by trying to get a job in the private sector at 38-42 years old.

No flames - I have lived in both worlds

Sorry, but idiocy gets flamed, no matter which world it comes from.

26 posted on 05/22/2002 9:59:22 AM PDT by Poohbah
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To: 2banana
"30 days (that is 6 weeks) of paid vacation a year
Average a 3-4 day weekends nearly every other week
Paid to work out/exercise
Can not be fired (ie kicked out of the army)
Can not be laid off
Full benefits (health, dental, 401k, etc)
Need only 20 years until full retirement
etc. "

You're forgetting to add there is no overtime paid for working 16 hour days 7 days a week on deployments or two weeks in the field every few months with no overtime pay.

You're forgetting to add that the lower half of the pay scale is just over the poverty line.

You also forgot to add that full retirement of 50% base pay is below the poverty line for 80% of military retirees !

29 posted on 05/22/2002 10:05:53 AM PDT by america-rules
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To: 2banana
I don't know where you came up with that 4-day weekends every other week end number but I never saw such a thing. Yes, we had what were called training holidays from time to time, but nothng approaching 4 day weekends every other week.

Further, by age 40 or so, most military, especially the ones who hump packs for a living, are physically used up. When I went into the Army back in 1970 I was one year out of high school, having played football, baseball, basketball and in great physical shape. When I retired 20 plus years later, I had two bad knees, a screwed up back and right shoulder, war wounds, hearing loss in both ears from explosions, right ankle broken twice, and other minor injuries from being exposed to war and harsh conditions in the field over 20 years. So, it is not like a 8-5 job I am working now in a nice heated and cooled office space on the 34th floor of this building. Life is much harsher in the military. But, we accept that. The costs you list are the price we pay for having people who will handle the job of protecting our freedoms. Pay it or lose it. Your choice.

30 posted on 05/22/2002 10:09:35 AM PDT by RetiredArmy
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