An American Catholic, Part II: Catholics in Name Only

NewsMax ^ | 4/03/2002 | Diane Alden

[TacomaJoe]

There is Some hope . In Nebraska, there is Bishop Bruscovitch and in Atlanta, things were bad until we got out new Bishop . As far as Religious orders go, there is Mother Angelica and her team . Also, I regularly receive fund raisers from the Legionaires of Christ

Things are not what you may think they are in Atlanta. We are fairly well infested with homosexual priests, and it seems to be a known problem amongst priests. If you really want the facts on The Legionaries of Christ visit this site by priest who have been abused in seminaries. http://www.arizweb.net/seminary.htm

[redhead]

"Does anyone else feel (the same way as I do) that churches have been placing too much emphasis on "Youth Ministries" over the last dozen (maybe longer) years; at the expense of "adult" ministries?"

You have really hit on something here. The other side of the coin is uninvolved adults, though. A lot of times, the grownups just don't want to do anything but go to mass and communion once a week. "Don't bother me with that stuff during the week!" (Well, this appears to be the situation at my parish, anyway.) I would be surprised if there was one other family in this parish besides mine that reads Wanderer, NOR, Crisis, or any of the other good Catholic publications that keep interested Catholics informed about what is really going on in the Church.

[iranger]

"I would add, I would rather have a priest who was a chaste homosexual than a heterosexual priest who was screwing around."

Ouch!!! Both are repulsive and unacceptable.

[saradippity]

This is the type of article that I am printing and copying several hundred times. Then I will mail one to each bishop prior to their next USCCB Conference in June. I will put my own comments on a cover letter to bishops and cardinals that I know are either,not in union with and under the Holy Father and the Magisterium, or conversely,if I know they are,to those I will add a big thanks. On most I will just say if the shoe fits wear it.

I imagine this will cost about $500.00 but it will come out of the monies I have budgeted for my parish collections and/or diocesan causes.It is truly sinful that we are forced to spend hard earned money to buy a dish in order to watch Mother Angelica and subscribe to conservative and orthodox magazines to keep apprised of what the Catholic Church teaches and to know what is happening in the Amchurch.

Father Elijah also had a good action plan.Can someone connect with it for newcomers to the discussion. I think Antonius also had a draft of a letter that was very helpful on the same thread.

On another thread I suggested copying good articles and letters and sticking them in the song books we find in the racks in back of each pew and in that manner get the word out to many Catholics who really don't have a clue to what is going on.I wish someone would start a thread on how to get the message out to those persons neither in the choir(thats us) nor those in the enemy camp.

[father_elijah]

Click here for Fr. Elijah: Catholic Action Plan

Also.......
Dr. Alice von Hildebrand said of the crisis facing the Church that "only the angels are optomistic". Because this evil goes so high up to bishop and even Cardinals, we cannot look to just one man or woman to be the Church's savior at this moment. We must remember the children of Fatima, Bernadette of Lourdes, Faustina of Poland -- God will give us his perfect answer through the simplest of souls. So we must turn to our divine Savior and pray and do whatever each of us can do to bring cleansing and healing to Christ's poor Church.

[saradippity]

I think those of us who expect that through this crisis we will end up with a Catholic Church that is poorer,purer,stronger and perhaps,smaller,need to be very careful about how we deal with this subject.

We can not judge another based on what we think they believe or what we think they look like.Some of the ruggedest,handsomest men I know are total narcissists and often sexually use men and/or women to satisfy their need for adulation and admiration.There are also many men who appear to be somewhat effeminate who are not in the least inclined to homosexuality.

Please do not think I am recommending no action because I think all priests who are known to have/or have had a homosexual house mate must go,all priests who do not present the Church teaching on the sin of homosexuality from the pulpit and from the podium and in ordinary conversations must go. Certainly,the parishioners can be told the parts of Church teaching which require that we treat them kindly needs to be stressed but any priest who gives the Church teaching and then follows with his own opinion,if its contrary to Church teaching must also go. And every priest needs to sermonize on sexual sins at least once a year.

If the bishops were smart they would immediately set up a committee of men like Father Fessio,Father Harvey,Father Neuhaus,Father McClosky to determine a policy that would come up with criteria and objective standards to be used by seminaries and bishops to assure that homosexuals are not ordained to the priesthood or admitted to the seminaries. This template could also be used to determine which previously ordained priests need to lose their faculties,or whatever.The quicker they do this the more chance we have of righting the wrongs before more damage is done.

Personally,I think just declaring that "I am a celibate man who has taken a vow to be chaste so I may best serve God and His people on earth." and kept/keeps his vow is all we need. When one insists on digging too far,even in our own lives,we can find things that might preclude any of us taking any vows ever.Please lets lobby for a committee of holy,intelligent Catholic men to come up with a plan and procedure to be used to ensure this doesn't happen again for a long,long time.

Has anyone else noticed how corrupt bishops are also consistently disobedient to the Holy Father and the Magisterium. That is the plan of the enemy "dis'the Pope ad corrupt the clergy and the Church will be destroyed".

[iranger]

What the heck is that all about? All I said was both a chaste homo and active hetero adulter is unacceptable for a priest. You somehow came up with a six paragraph essay that left me falling asleep at the wheel. Did you have a point? If so, try giving it in 50 words or less.

[saradippity]

You responded to a statement by someone who said I would rather have a chaste homosexual priest than a heterosexual who was screwing around" by saying "both are repulsive and unacceptable".

So I ask you,iranger. How do you determine who a chaste homosexual priest is? Do you read minds,or do you judge by appearance?

[sinkspur]

He replied that the Pope had a very difficult time of getting priests to take on the burden of being a bishop. Over 2/3 of the the priests offered the position refused the Pope's offer according to this priest.

Unless things have changed in the last twenty years, I find this priest's observation to be VERY hard to believe.

Human nature would accept a promotion, would it not?

[iranger]

"So I ask you,iranger. How do you determine who a chaste homosexual priest is? Do you read minds,or do you judge by appearance?"

I don't need to determine who a chaste homo priest is, or active homo priest for that matter, to know that it is repulsive and unacceptable. My statement is pretty straightforward.

[saradippity]

How do you know if a priest is a homosexual?

Are you from Phoenix?

[SkyPilot]

Bump for later --a lot to read here.

[glorygirl]

50 words

The view of the church --and of many catholics -- is that homosexuals are not sinning in that regard unless they actually participate in homosexual sex. For that reason, homosexual priests are "less guilty" and onerous than heterosexual priest who forsake their vows.

Not everyone's opinion, I know. Just the church's.

[choirboy]

Unless things have changed in the last twenty years, I find this priest's observation to be VERY hard to believe.

I find it VERY hard to believe that this priest was lying to me. And, as I said, he is very well connected and would have access to such information.

Human nature would accept a promotion, would it not?

One would think so.

I believe there are a lot of good priests out there. Priests who would make good bishops. Yet the current crop of bishops is not of a quality one would expect from that universe of priests (in my opinion, of course). Just the luck of the draw would give us a better group of bishops.

Now, why is this so? Bad luck? The office of bishop is by nature corrupting? Or wise men seeing a no-win situation who turn down the offer?

Why don't we have better bishops? Now I'm back at the beginning -- this is the question I asked the priest.

[saradippity]

Because this is so important,I am going to try again.Can either of you tell me,or anyone from the church tell me,what objective criteria will be used to rid the church of homosexual priests?Thankyou. If I get no response then I will assume that you don't know,and if you don't know can you not see what a perilous endeavor we are launching without clear direction.

Remember Satan is the Father of lies,lies lead to confusion,confusion to chaos and chaos is the exactly where the enemy(on earth and in the supernatural world) wants all of God's people to be.Then the "lord of the world"can reign.There are probably people on these threads who are looking forward to that takeover,if so,Truth makes no difference. But if it is not so,then be very careful or we will wake up one morning and all will be dark.

[glorygirl]

I think you and I are both viewing this from the same perspective.

The church recognizes the nature of orginal sin, that it manifests itself in different ways depending on the individual.

The church also realizes and recognizes it has a certain number of homosexuals within its ranks of priests.

I was simply trying to offer a concise explanation of the church's views on homosexual priests, not offering any rationale to expel them (unless they are guilty of grave sin!)

[american colleen]

Bump for more in depth later reading.

Thanks so much for posting this article and thanks to the many articulate FR's contributing to it.

[iranger]

"How do you know if a priest is a homosexual?"

You don't get it do you? I don't need to know if a particular priest is a homo to know that the concept is not acceptable. My remarks are conceptual and so were those of the person I was replying to.

[iranger]

"The view of the church --and of many catholics -- is that homosexuals are not sinning in that regard unless they actually participate in homosexual sex. For that reason, homosexual priests are "less guilty" and onerous than heterosexual priest who forsake their vows."

I believe that the act defines the label. That is, we're all hetero until you decide to take from tree that is forbidden. A priest that is chaste is hetero. He's only a homo if he's engaging (or maybe wanting to engage)in homo acts. So, the only homo priests you have are active ones. I am not of the belief that the homo crowd just received a different set of numbers in God's chromosomal lottery? I recall Genesis and the Garden of Eden having man and woman. On which day did God create homos and lesbians?