Posted on 12/26/2001 9:15:08 AM PST by Notwithstanding
Just want to see what people think.
Rudy has been a "good leader" in the wake of 9-11. Men with shoddy morals can be "good leaders" - but is a leader really good if he fails to show remorse for his evil acts (abortion support and public adultery)? Is a man really a good leader if he publicly advocates serial killing of preborn babies? If he publicly parades his mistress before the cameras? If he never publicly expresses remorse about these two hugely important moral errors.
Me: You purposefully mix many different issues in your unthoughtful question.
1. No one has suggested that divorce be criminal.
2. Thoe who make lifelong permanent vows ("till death do us part", "through good times and bad, richer or poorer, sickness and health etc.") and later choose to divorce and remarry by definition continuously violate their oath to their first spouse. NB: the mariage vow does not have an early release clause.
Seeing as how Rudy's a Catholic, the answer to your questions would be "Yes" and "Yes" as far as the Church is concerned.
Agreed 100%! Just because a person is a sinner does not mean they don't have the potential for unbelievable good!
Agreed. I believe one of the flight 93 heros was a very out of the closet homosexual. Is he any less of a hero because of that?
Instead, Giuliani tried to illegally stay on as mayor (and lose his image in the city's inevitable economic mess).
He should just marry Judith Nathan, be faithful to her and live happily ever after - and shut up.
Hero's are people we hold out as exceptional people whom we want other's to be emulate.
Since his public notoriety inlcudes very strong abortion support and very public adultery, he is not one to hold out for emulation.
I agree that Rudy ought to have been in the running for POTY, but since Bush is actually a true hero without the huge morality problems AND he has been such an astounding leader in the wake of 9-11, he desrved POTY both as a newsmaker and a hero through and through. (While I am disappointed in his stem cell decision, I will acknowledge the issue on which he had to decide regarding stem cells was not so black and white as abortion and adultery are).
I think Rudy has acted heroically in his official life since the planes hit the WTC on 09-11.
From dictionary.com, for "hero":
1. In mythology and legend, a man, often of divine ancestry, who is endowed with great courage and strength, celebrated for his bold exploits, and favored by the gods.
2. A person noted for feats of courage or nobility of purpose, especially one who has risked or sacrificed his or her life: soldiers and nurses who were heroes in an unpopular war.
3. A person noted for special achievement in a particular field: the heroes of medicine. See Synonyms at celebrity.
4. The principal male character in a novel, poem, or dramatic presentation.
Rudy fits enough of #2 or #3 to qualify as a hero. Whether he's a role model is a different story. He probably should be considered a role model for crisis managers of the future. He certainly appears not to be when it comes to having one's personal act together.
I believe Jesus said judge not lest ye be judged yourselves.
I have broken a self imposed rule, NEVER reply on threads consumed with self important opinion on what God expects from us.
I knew I could get a good discussion going though. I hate it when people tiptoe around the meat of an issue or topic. Thus my ever-provocative titles and postings.
To tell the truth, it all comes down to the fate of the babies for me - those who cheat the babies out of their right to life will be cut slack by me only if they change their position. Until then I will ensure all pro-aborts have the blood of the babes in their minds and on their hands. One's own sense of guilt is a gift from God! It can be a work of charity to help people get in touch with that sense of guilt so they might feel the urge to get right with their Maker. But most people hate guilt because it is so inconvenient - why, it might even convince one to chang one's ways! C'est la vie.
I long for the day when adultery, sodomy, fornication, and promoting immorality return to being captial offenses. Add attempting to get or adding in an abortion as well.
This does not prevent us from judging that an extramarital affair is wrong, and that a person is committing sin by being in the affair. I don't have to be sin-free to make that judgment, and I, like others, am far from it.
The expansion of the "judge not" warning from Jesus into "don't ever judge anyone for anything they ever do anywhere" is probably the most clever twisting of the Word of God ever perpetrated. It is the favorite canard of the pagan and secular left used against the religious right. Among other things, it enables sex ed to get a free pass into the classroom (don't judge unmarried kids who fornicate, just give them the tools to supposedly prevent bad consequences) and values to be kept out (we can't talk about right or wrong here, that would be making judgments, and we sure can't do that). The list goes on and on.
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