But back to the mutual comprehensibility - UKR and RUS overlap by around 60% to 80% mutual comprehension
Posted on 06/20/2024 6:56:33 AM PDT by Cronos
Many years ago, in the 1980s, I went to Brighton Beach, then in its heyday as a district of newly arrived Soviet Jews. It was a grand event, rich in humor and tinged with nostalgia. I asked a middle-aged partygoer for his thoughts on his lost homeland, and his reply has stayed with me: “I hate Russia, for forcing me to leave her.”
It was an apt summary of what waves of émigrés from Russia and the Soviet Union since the early 20th century have felt: a sorrowful sense of loss for a motherland — what Russians call “toska po rodine” — coupled with resentment at the autocratic powers that forced them out. My grandparents were among the “White” Russians who fled the Revolution and moved to Paris in the 1920s. A second wave of emigrants left in World War II. The third, Soviet Jews, started leaving in the 1970s. Vladimir Putin has now created another wave of people fleeing Russia, and many of them may still believe, as my forebears did, that they will one day return to the homeland.
Most probably will not.
It’s hard to say precisely where Russian exiles stand, politically or in their sense of attachment to Russia. The waves of emigrants differ widely one from another, and in the United States, they have not behaved like immigrants from Italy, China or Poland who formed hyphenated-American communities and organizations that have persisted over generations. Russians immigrants to America have, by comparison, melded quickly into the general population.
...That is the tragic irony of Mr. Putin’s war. His attempt to “restore Russian greatness” through violence and hatred has tainted Russia’s real greatness for years to come, just as his attempt to quash Ukrainian nationhood has steeled its foundations.
(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...
“The Russian invasion of Ukraine...”
Get with the PROGRAM, dude. You should be writing:
“The Russian UNPROVOKED, FULL-SCALE, invasion of Ukraine...”
You’re slipping.
Edited for accuracy.
There are about 25 million Russians living outside of the Russian Federation in what were former parts of the Soviet Union.
These ethnic Russians often hold down prime jobs.
Other people such as Ukrainian speakers want the prime jobs just as black American DEI people want the prime jobs of Caucasian Americans.
There have efforts made to dislodge ethnic Russians from the prime jobs in Ukraine by requiring the use of the Ukrainian language in public life and by KKK-type intimidation of ethnic Russians by swastika wearing groups.
Putin wants to protect these ethnic Russians both as a fellow ethnic Russian and to prevent 25 million ethnic Russian refugees showing up in Moscow and Leningrad.
Putin demanded the anti-ethnic Russian efforts in Ukraine be ended. They were not. Putin launched a Special Miliary Operation for the same reason Eisenhower sent in troops to Little Rock back in 1957 to protect black Arkansas students.
Damn, I missed that. Anyway I’m just trying to help the OP with his terminology. If he doesn’t get with the program, there’s a risk that FReepers may start asking questions, such as whether there is more to this war than Putin simply waking up on the wrong side of the bed 2 years ago and thus deciding to invade the nearest country.
See, look at Post #5, it shows the COST of making this mistake. This is why STRICT DISCIPLINE is required of these guys.
When I want fair, objective reporting I always read the NY Times.
Russian greatness? Really? What period of time does the NYT think Russia was great?
Many years ago, in the 1980s, the New York Times hated President Reagan and slobbered over Gorbachev.
WIKI
Following Ukraine’s Revolution of Dignity in 2014, pro-Russian, counter-revolutionary unrest erupted in the eastern part of the country. Russia annexed Crimea from Ukraine, while armed separatists seized government buildings and proclaimed the Donetsk People’s Republic (DPR) and Luhansk People’s Republic (LPR) as independent states. This sparked the war in Donbas, part of the wider Russo-Ukrainian War. The DPR and LPR are sometimes described as puppet states of Russia during this conflict. They received no international recognition from United Nations member states before 2022.
On 21 February 2022, Russia recognised the DPR and LPR as sovereign states. Three days later, Russia launched a full-scale invasion of Ukraine, partially under the pretext of protecting the republics. Russian forces captured more of Donetsk Oblast, which became part of the DPR. In September 2022, Russia proclaimed the annexation of the DPR and other occupied territories, following illegitimate referendums. The United Nations General Assembly passed a resolution calling on countries not to recognise what it called the “attempted illegal annexation” and demanded that Russia “immediately, completely and unconditionally withdraw”.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donetsk_People‘s_Republic
The independent states of DPR and LPR existed for about as long as the independent from Great Britain states of Virginia and Massachusetts did from 1776 to 1783.
“Russian greatness? Really? What period of time does the NYT think Russia was great?”
Probably never, but they ABSOLUTELY LOVED the Soviet Union, pretty much from Day 1. When they jettisoned Communism and became Russia again, the NY Times started to HATE THEM, as we see now (and a bunch of others who probably subscribe to the NY Times seem to have the same feelings).
The Zelensky acolytes are getting more unhinged by the day. Too bad for them that the front keeps moving west.
Agreed.
the Bold is because that’s from the article...
You know that is false when Zelenskyy is a native Russian speaker
But back to the mutual comprehensibility - UKR and RUS overlap by around 60% to 80% mutual comprehension
WIKI
the Maidan Uprising, was a wave of demonstrations and civil unrest in Ukraine, which began on 21 November 2013 with large protests in Maidan Nezalezhnosti (Independence Square) in Kyiv. The protests were sparked by President Viktor Yanukovych’s sudden decision not to sign the European Union–Ukraine Association Agreement, instead choosing closer ties to Russia and the Eurasian Economic Union. Ukraine’s parliament had overwhelmingly approved of finalizing the Agreement with the EU, but Russia had put pressure on Ukraine to reject it.
During the uprising, Independence Square (Maidan) in Kyiv was a huge protest camp occupied by thousands of protesters and protected by makeshift barricades. It had kitchens, first aid posts and broadcasting facilities, as well as stages for speeches, lectures, debates and performances. It was guarded by ‘Maidan Self-Defense’ units made up of volunteers in improvised uniform and helmets, carrying shields and armed with sticks, stones and petrol bombs.
The uprising climaxed on 18–20 February, when fierce fighting in Kyiv between Maidan activists and police resulted in the deaths of almost 100 protesters and 13 police.
As a result, Yanukovych and the parliamentary opposition signed an agreement on 21 February to bring about an interim unity government, constitutional reforms and early elections. Police abandoned central Kyiv that afternoon, then Yanukovych and other government ministers fled the city that evening. The next day, parliament removed Yanukovych from office and installed an interim government.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euromaidan
The Muscowite invasion was unprovoked as you correctly point out.
The “provocation” that Putin complains about (”Nato coming”) is proven false by:
1. NATO rejected Georgia and Ukraine’s request to join in 2008 and Putin invaded shortly afterwards
2. Russia has bordered NATO countries since 1999
3. After Finland joined NATO, Putin actually REDUCED the number of troops it has on the border with Finland.
So you are correct that the Muscowite invasion was unprovoked
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