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Despite concerns, US to send 31 Abrams tanks to Ukraine
Associated Press ^ | January 25, 2023 | LOLITA C. BALDOR AND TARA COPP January 25, 2023, 12:47 PM

Posted on 01/25/2023 12:09:44 PM PST by 4Runner

Just last week, Under Secretary of Defense for Policy Colin Kahl told reporters that the Abrams is a complicated, expensive, difficult to maintain and hard to train on piece of equipment. One thing Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin has been very focused on, he said, “is that we should not be providing the Ukrainians systems they can’t repair, they can’t sustain, and that they, over the long term, can’t afford, because it’s not helpful.”

For the Abrams to be effective in Ukraine, its forces will require extensive training on combined arms manuevuer — how the tanks operate together on the battlefield, and on how to maintain and support the complex, 70-ton weapon. The Abrams tanks use a turbine jet engine to propel themselves that burns through at least two gallons a mile regardless of whether they are moving or idling, which means that a network of fuel trucks is needed to keep the line moving.

(Excerpt) Read more at aol.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; Russia
KEYWORDS: bombsaway; nukemenow
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To: 4Runner

31 is, I believe more than a battalion’s worth so that would seem to be a battalion plus some replacemnts.


21 posted on 01/25/2023 12:56:45 PM PST by robowombat ( )
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To: PGR88
it will allow Russia to see them up-close, but in amounts that make little military difference

The Russians have been very anxious to get their hands on an M1 and thoroughly examine it at one of their Siberian depots. Now their wish will come true.

22 posted on 01/25/2023 1:02:42 PM PST by Right_Wing_Madman
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To: PGR88

Biden / Obungo wagging the dog.


23 posted on 01/25/2023 1:03:08 PM PST by PhiloBedo (You gotta roll with the punches, and get with what's real.)
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To: 4Runner
I particularly enjoyed this little snippet:

...that burns through at least two gallons a mile regardless of whether they are moving or idling...

24 posted on 01/25/2023 1:04:42 PM PST by Plexi
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To: Carriage Hill
Sounds like we’re going to have boots-on-the-ground, to train the Ukes and maintain the tanks.

So far, all the Ukrainian training on US weapons has taken place in Poland. But somehow, I think there's a 50 percent chance the Poles use these tanks instead of the Ukes.
25 posted on 01/25/2023 1:05:56 PM PST by Right_Wing_Madman
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To: Texas Fossil

You are correct. Trump would have ended this insanity.


26 posted on 01/25/2023 1:08:30 PM PST by laplata (They want each crisis to take the greatest toll possible.)
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To: Jewbacca

Man to man or zone, makes no diff.
Critical things are logistics and mobility and concentration.


27 posted on 01/25/2023 1:11:21 PM PST by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: Jewbacca

Slow, in war, is generally very bad. War is very expensive. You want it over as soon as possible. Going slow means fast is not possible. Slow is a response to constraints, not a preference.


28 posted on 01/25/2023 1:13:15 PM PST by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: buwaya

Slow is fast. Fast is slow. Did you not learn that in the military?

A slow plane is terrible if you are getting shot at.

A slow plane is great if you are not getting shot at and can follow a pretty slow cruise missile on a predetermined path that will not make evasive maneuvers. Oh, and it leaves a giant smoke cloud pointing right at it.

The Ukraine has specifically requested A29s for this exact purpose, as they are ideal. Cheap, can loiter, and cheap ammo.

They’d also be useful for close air support later, as they work great at treetop. Russian air defenses suck at low level and can’t get a lock.

But, hey, I’ve just been in the IDF or fighter pilot biz for decades now. Been shot at a hell of a lot by Russian equipment (admittedly operated by idiots). A old guy. What do I know?


29 posted on 01/25/2023 1:26:52 PM PST by Jewbacca (The residents of Iroquois territory may not determine whether Jews may live in Jerusalem.)
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To: 4Runner

No offense, exalted leaders but....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ygh5f-B99A


30 posted on 01/25/2023 1:27:55 PM PST by frank ballenger (You have summoned up a thundercloud. You're gonna hear from me. Anthem by Leonard Cohen)
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To: Jewbacca

These are the main threat -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kh-55
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3M-54_Kalibr

No way a Tucano intercepts this stuff.


31 posted on 01/25/2023 1:39:10 PM PST by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: 4Runner

“According to Fox News, while the European Leopard 2 tanks are essentially ready to use by the Ukrainian military, the American M1 Abrams vehicles “will take months” to make it to their intended destination. This is due to the fact that instead of coming from US stockpiles, they will be procured fresh via the Ukraine Security Assistance Initiative.”

The Abrams tanks won’t even arrive for months. Russia might accept delivery by then.


32 posted on 01/25/2023 1:43:12 PM PST by ltc8k6 ( .)
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To: buwaya

Thise Abrams will be reworked for the monkey model armor.


33 posted on 01/25/2023 1:44:24 PM PST by Thunder90 (All posts soley represent my own opinions)
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To: buwaya

Considering the record of ME peoples at maintaining equipment I expect that most of the gear is non-operational now.


34 posted on 01/25/2023 1:45:25 PM PST by Seruzawa ("The Political left is the Garden of Eden of incompetence" - Marx the Smarter (Groucho))
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To: ltc8k6

So we have thousands in storage but they are going to buy new ones? Disgusting but not surprising. Eisenhower was right.


35 posted on 01/25/2023 1:47:34 PM PST by Seruzawa ("The Political left is the Garden of Eden of incompetence" - Marx the Smarter (Groucho))
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To: Seruzawa

The Iranians kept a surprising number of their F-14’s and F-4’s flying for a couple of decades. They were a force to be reckoned with throughout the Iran-Iraq war.

I understand that the F-5’s, at least, are still flying. Granted the F-5 is a simple thing.


36 posted on 01/25/2023 1:52:54 PM PST by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: Seruzawa

I figure they will receive the Dutch F-16’s first off.

There are a bunch of spare F-16’s floating around, as many NATO countries are receiving their orders of F-35’s.

Japan now even has spare F-15’s, as the Japanese F-35’s are operational. There was a Japanese proposal a couple of months ago to gift these to the Philippines, though I doubt the Philippines can afford to operate them.


37 posted on 01/25/2023 1:57:07 PM PST by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: buwaya

I know a couple of guys who did contract work in Saudi Arabia and other ME places. They had some very amusing anecdotes about the idiots over there. Yes there are some good well trained maintenance people over there. But also a lot incompetent dunderheads.


38 posted on 01/25/2023 2:09:10 PM PST by Seruzawa ("The Political left is the Garden of Eden of incompetence" - Marx the Smarter (Groucho))
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To: Seruzawa

Another source of F-16’s which I consider quite - interesting.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draken_International

They bought some of the Norwegian F-16’s as these have been replaced by F-35’s. The rest of the Norwegian F-16’s may be going to Romania.

Maybe Ukraine can lease some F-16’s. With US approval of course.


39 posted on 01/25/2023 2:12:56 PM PST by buwaya (Strategic imperatives )
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To: buwaya

I don’t think you understand how intercepting works.

A defender doesn’t have to chase the bogie.


40 posted on 01/25/2023 2:23:11 PM PST by Jewbacca (The residents of Iroquois territory may not determine whether Jews may live in Jerusalem.)
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