Posted on 04/13/2022 2:12:42 PM PDT by marktwain
ABOARD THE MOSKVA MISSILE CRUISER (Reuters) - This Russian warship left the shipyard 25 years ago and it shows: the electronics consoles look like museum exhibits and its hull carries a thick crust of paint from years of running repairs.
Its shortcomings reflect the Russian navy’s many problems, highlighted again this month by an accident on a nuclear submarine that killed 20 people.
But looks can deceive. Hidden beneath the decks of the Moskva cruiser are 16 “Bazalt” guided missiles, which travel faster than the speed of sound and can strike an enemy aircraft carrier group 500 km away.
The Moskva, flagship of Russia’s Black Sea Fleet, symbolises Russia’s navy: all too easy to dismiss as an ageing rust-bucket, it can still pack a formidable punch.
The navy’s capability matters now more than at any time since the Cold War because the Kremlin is using it to project Russia’s new-found confidence far beyond its coastal waters, bringing it face-to-face with NATO warships.
“I believe we are treated with respect,” captain of the Moskva Igor Smolyak told a group of visiting journalists when asked what foreign navies made of his vessel. He was standing in front of a 130-mm cannon at the bow of his ship.
“They treat with respect the flag, the ship and -- accordingly -- our nation,” he said during the visit in late September.
BUTT OF JOKES
When Russia this year sent its nuclear-powered missile cruiser Peter the Great to Venezuela -- the first such manoeuvres off the U.S. coast since the Cold War -- Washington poked fun.
(Excerpt) Read more at reuters.com ...
MOSKVA ON FIRE IN BLACK SEA
Like with the Spanish Civil War, (an earlier superpower proxy war), a lot of new weapons are being tested in wartime conditions.
Those cheering the demise of the Moskva should consider the future survivability of our own CVN battle groups within a thousand or more miles of China, just for example. We might wake up to the news that one has been hit by Chinese missiles and is on fire in the not distant future. (Or hit by Russian or Iranian missiles, in slightly different circumstances.)
For students of history, here was another major naval paradigm shift that probably fewer than one in 100 has ever heard of:
“The WW2 Sinking of Two Mighty Warships – HMS Prince of Wales and HMS Repulse”
like their aircraft carrier?
Like our Bonhomme Richard, hm?
I was already thinking of the Prince of Wales and the Repulse.
I have a book by Cecil Brown, a WWII correspondence, who was angling to get on the Prince of Wales right after Pearl Harbor, as it was the biggest, newest, toughest battleship in the world, but had to settle for the Repulse. His description of the attack that sunk it was like shooting fish in a barrel. They survived the first “wave” of maybe a half dozen planes, and maybe winged a couple, but got devastated in round two.
I do not see drone submarines being used militarily... yet. Kind of like long range, lingering torpedoes?
Does China have the capability of targeting anything 1000NM away at sea, mixed in among merchant ships. I doubt it. Ships aren’t stationary and ID is a big problem.
(highlighted again this month by an accident on a nuclear submarine that killed 20 people.)
I missed that one
As reported today the Moskva is on fire and listing from two Neptune anti-ship misses fired from around Odessa. (Unconfirmed)!
Hitting an American warship in the Pacific Ocean is several orders of magnitude removed from hitting a Russian warship in the Black Sea.
Not that I am minimizing the issue, just that they’re not analogous.
L
Ah, but they feared an attack by the warlike NATO and were obliged to build themselves up militarily at the expense of improving themselves economically.
Supposedly the Ukrainians hit the Moskva with two Neptune missiles. Each has a payload of ~330kg so let’s say that both missiles really did hit the ship if Ivan is spun up on damage control then the ship should survive and make it to port.
It’ll probably be out of action for a while but unless the Russians pooch the damage control effort it should survive.
Not sure I agree. It is very hard to hide large ships from satellite observations.
Range makes a big difference, but once within range...
Maybe one order of magnitude, if we are lucky, and most of that due to training and advanced sensors... The Russians may well be overconfident. It could be a big factor. If the Moskva is sinking, a lot of people will sit up and pay attention.
And now Chinese salvage companies are slowly taking these war graves apart, throwing the bones overboard and selling them as scrap.
Cecil Brown got plenty of film of the attack, too, but according to his account he dropped the reels when a royal marine abandoned ship right on top of him.
“Ivan is spun up on damage control then the ship should survive and make it to port.”
Considering the state of their army’s equipment I’m not sure I’d take that bet.
L
I agree. Who knows what deferred maintenance issues are compounding the salvage of this ship?
And if it does make it to port will it ever make it back out again?
Shouldn’t a satellite have a picture of the flaming hulk by now?
Within a year of the Soviet Union splitting up, NATO bombed Russia’s closest ally for 78 days, systematically blowing up infrastructure and killing a large number of civilians with high altitude bombing.
They bombed to force Serbia to permanently give up territory it had held for centuries. This totally transformed the thinking of Russia about NATO and the wests intentions.
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