Turkey launches offensive in northern Syria with air strikes

BBC News ^

[tkocur]

Turkish warplanes have bombed parts of north-eastern Syria at the start of an offensive which could lead to conflict with Kurdish-led allies of the US.

Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan said the operation was to create a "safe zone" cleared of Kurdish militias which will also house Syrian refugees.

The strikes have killed at least two civilians, Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) said.

The group vowed to resist any Turkish advance across the border.

It asked the US and the coalition against the jihadist group Islamic State (IS) to establish a no-fly zone in the area to stop "attacks on innocent people".

The Kurds - key US allies in defeating IS in Syria - guard thousands of IS fighters and their relatives in prisons and camps in areas under their control and it is unclear whether they will continue to be safely detained.

Turkish ground forces have been massing on the border. The offensive was launched just days after President Donald Trump controversially withdrew US troops from northern Syria, a decision announced after a phone call with Mr Erdogan that sparked widespread criticism at home and abroad.

[VietVet876]

UN can’t even save a dime. They are reportedly on track to run out of money at the end of this month.

[caww]

The agreement between those Leaders negotiating peace in Syria was indeed a ‘Safe Zone’ along the Syrian Border......the Kurds were hoping they could retain the ground they fought on but this was never part of the deal in Syria.

[Redwood71]

The US provided the F-4 II and F-16 aircraft, and the KC 135 to move their in flights. WE also set up for their on grounds the larger possibilities, the BGM-71,the FIM-92 Stinger, and the M-72. For smaller arms, the M79 and M203, CAR-15, M-4A1, M-16, SCAR, Intervention and the MSR. This last grouping is used by their special forces and infantry commando brigades.

For the larger stuff, we have been providing the M 60, M48, and M 109. The AVs coming from the US at one time were ACV 15 and the M 113 and M 107. Rockets we provided include the MGM-140 and the M270.

There’s a lot more from rocket launchers to support vehicles some as simple as jeeps. The US and Turkey have been partners as early as the cold war starting about the end of WW II. The step up of the weapons trading was during the Clinton administration for the latest of the capacity.

https://fas.org/asmp/library/reports/turkeyrep.htm

A lot to find and many places to find it. Good luck. Hope this gets it startyed for you.

rwood

[Pollard]

So who are the Kurds?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdish_people

Kurds (Kurdish: کورد‎, Kurd) are an Iranian[27] ethnic group native to Western Asia. Geographically, this mostly mountainous area, known as Kurdistan, includes southeastern Turkey, northwestern Iran, northern Iraq, and northern Syria.[28] There are also exclaves of Kurds in central Anatolia and Khorasan. Additionally, there are significant Kurdish diaspora communities in the cities of western Turkey, in particular Istanbul, while a Kurdish diaspora has developed in Western Europe, primarily in Germany. Numerically, the Kurds are estimated to number between 30 and 45 million.[2][29] Kurds speak the Kurdish languages and the Zaza–Gorani languages, which belong to the Western Iranian branch of the Indo-European language family.[30][31][32] Regarding religion, although the majority of Kurds belong to the Shafi‘i school of Sunni Islam, significant numbers practise Shia Islam and Alevism while some are adherents of Yarsanism, Yazidism, Zoroastrianism and Christianity. After World War One and the defeat of the Ottoman Empire, the victorious Western allies made provision for a Kurdish state in the 1920 Treaty of Sevres. However, that promise was nullified three years later, when the Treaty of Lausanne set the boundaries of modern Turkey and made no such provision, leaving Kurds with minority status in their respective countries.[33] This fact has led to numerous genocides and rebellions, along with the current ongoing armed guerrilla conflicts in Turkey, Iran, and Syria / Rojava. Kurds have an autonomous region in Iraq named Kurdistan Region, while Kurdish nationalist movements continue to pursue greater cultural rights, autonomy, and independence throughout Greater Kurdistan.

"The land of Karda" is mentioned on a Sumerian clay tablet dated to the 3rd millennium B.C. This land was inhabited by "the people of Su" who dwelt in the southern regions of Lake Van; The philological connection between "Kurd" and "Karda" is uncertain but the relationship is considered possible.[46] Other Sumerian clay tablets referred to the people, who lived in the land of Karda, as the Qarduchi and the Qurti.[47] Karda/Qardu is etymologically related to the Assyrian term Urartu and the Hebrew term Ararat.[48] Qarti or Qartas, who were originally settled on the mountains north of Mesopotamia, are considered as a probable ancestor of the Kurds. Akkadians were attacked by nomads coming through Qartas territory at the end of 3rd millennium B.C. Akkadians distinguished them as Guti. They conquered Mesopotamia in 2150 B.C. and ruled with 21 kings until defeated by the Sumerian king Utu-hengal.[49] Many Kurds consider themselves descended from the Medes, an ancient Iranian people,[50] and even use a calendar dating from 612 B.C., when the Assyrian capital of Nineveh was conquered by the Medes.[51] The claimed Median descent is reflected in the words of the Kurdish national anthem: "We are the children of the Medes and Kai Khosrow."[52] However, MacKenzie and Asatrian challenge the relation of the Median language to Kurdish.[53][54] The Kurdish languages, on the other hand, form a subgroup of the Northwestern Iranian languages like Median.[34][55] Some researchers consider the independent Kardouchoi as the ancestors of the Kurds,[56] while others prefer Cyrtians.[57] The term "Kurd," however, is first encountered in Arabic sources of the seventh century.[58] Books from the early Islamic era, including those containing legends such as the Shahnameh and the Middle Persian Kar-Namag i Ardashir i Pabagan, and other early Islamic sources provide early attestation of the name Kurd.[59] The Kurds have ethnically diverse origins.[60][61]

The usage of the term Kurd during this time period most likely was a social term, designating Northwestern Iranian nomads, rather than a concrete ethnic group.[63][64]

---

So basically, they're Northwestern Iranians. The majority of them are Moslems. They live mostly in the mountainous region as depicted in the map above. They're somewhat the equivalent of the Appalachian people here in the US in that they're spread out over multiple States in a mountain range.

Interestingly enough, the USA had no role in the two treaties mentioned above, one that gave the Kurds a State and the second one three years later that took it away. That was the UK and France. The treaties basically broke up the Ottoman Empire and doled out land to people. So exactly why the hell is it our problem that these Northewestern Iranian mountain nomads don't have a State?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Lausanne

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Sevres

[xzins]

I agree about declaring war. We’ve been there going on 6 years. 18 in Afghan and about 16 in Iraq. The people there hate us so much that a US serviceman cannot walk down the street to get a cup of coffee and a donut. They must stay in compound or in convoy constantly or they’ll be killed.

There is no “civilizing” this culture into a western democracy.

If that’s the goal, then declare war until there’s an unconditional surrender.

If the goal is to keep the peace, then that’s not a job for the US military.

If the objective is to spend money and keep some war industry materiel being produced, then do more live fire training in the USA.

Guard our own border.

If there’s no declaration of war, then get out.

[semimojo]

I heard somewhere that the total number of troops we actually removed was 25.

I don't know what the number is but 25 embeded US troops would be plenty to stop Turkey. Ever hear of a trip wire?

[Openurmind]

Yep, absolutely.

[Openurmind]

Fantastic, thank you for the knowledge... Looks like it’s kind of like being stuck with California.

[DesertRhino]

They should make peace with Assad, who never attacked them to begin with, and restore the territorial integrity of Syria.

The entire civil war was a CIA/State/Saudi operation designed to overthrow Assad and install a wahabbist theocracy.
Back off from that and make the Kurds stop their terror attacks in Turkey and the entire problem vanishes.

[Sam Gamgee]

Did Trump do this because he is pro caliphate? Or is he doing this to ensure Trump Towers gets built in Turkey?

[Sam Gamgee]

He is isn’t he? His removal of troops basically gave Turkey permission to begin the slaughter. Why does he hate Kurds?

[Sam Gamgee]

We are going to trust the Islamist Turks?

[Parley Baer]

Funny that we have not heard a word from Assad or Russia.

[bert]

You are confused.

There are Kurds and then there are kurds. Some Kurds are Turkish enemies having been fighting them more or less forever (since the fall of the Ottoman empire at least)

You are encouraging American involvement in a Turkish civil war

[Eleutheria5]

Very funny.

[Sam Gamgee]

I just don’t understand Trumps motivation here. He could lose support from evangelicals

[Magnatron]

If Congress wants to do something about it, they can declare war as per the Constitution.

Exactly.

Anyone throwing a conniption fit over this needs to lobby their congress critters to do their job.

[samtheman]

If Congress wants to do something about it, they can declare war as per the Constitution.

Exactly.

Anyone throwing a conniption fit over this needs to lobby their congress critters to do their job.
—
I agree

[bert]

Only a foolish evangelical will be so single minded as to desert their own cause over Kurds

[max americana]

“UN can go save the day”

They have no money ...

http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3784544/posts