Posted on 02/09/2017 4:01:56 PM PST by Jim Robinson
Vanity Discussion Question: Can the president ignore the court order and continue with his valid executive order?
It appears the president is acting in accordance to his constitutional powers and specifically in accordance to laws regarding immigration and has been challenged and overridden by an unconstitutionally political activist (liberal) court.
If so, can he can he continue with his valid orders controlling the actions of the executive branch? No doubt this would set up a "constitutional crisis" but this is going to happen soon anyway as it's the only way we will ever restore constitutional government, ie, the liberal activist courts will have to be toppled eventually. Why not now while we have a strong president and Republican majorities in both housees of congress?
Just askin'.
People are over reacting to this because they don't understand the legal procedures. This isn't a trial on the merits, it's an emergency appeal of an existing temporary restraining order. There has been no trial yet on the merits.
Still, the court basically tipped off the administration to exactly what they could do to address the issues. Rewrite a new order that either, 1) bars only aliens and doesn't interfere with legal residents or visitors, or 2) create a process for visa and green card holders to challenge a decision to bar them.
From other stories I see this morning it appears that's what is going to happen.
When they leave the country, they have no due process rights for return. Current law already forsees:
Even a permanent resident (green card holder) isn’t safe from being found inadmissible. If a permanent resident departs the U.S., it’s possible for him or her to be found inadmissible upon return. This situation might arise, for example, if the person had been gone from the U.S. for too long, had committed a crime, had developed tuberculosis, or had begun receiving public assistance since receiving the green card.
Further, whatever due process rights such a person might have when the reach the US have NOT been eradicated in that EO - the one section that could bar them also allows for the Offices of the Secretaries of State and Homeland Security the authority to grant waivers on a case by case basis - which directly implies that there is a path to entry for these people.
Lastly, the “point” is, entry to the US for non-citizens is a privilege, not a right. Rights can not be denied without due process - privileges are granted and rescinded at will.
The courts disagree, and I don't mean the 9th Circuit. Constitutional due process rights apply to everyone in the country, not just citizens. Aliens outside the country have no constitutional rights. Everyone inside does. Disagree with that if you like, but argue with the courts, not me.
Great idea. Then let me ask. Why in the hell has President Trump NOT done it? If this is a solution and he is such a stupendous deal maker with great ideas why has he not stopped the 10,000 current eligible VISA holders in these 7 countries from coming with this order yawl talk about. Sounds simple and a great way to protect the people of America which President Trump has vowed to do.
Tell you what my suspicions are. Another deal has been struck. A deal about confirmation of appointees. If President Trump does not put up a good fight against this political hack judge, his confirmations will slide right through. So far since Friday, 5 confirmations have succeeded with Sessions being the biggest.
Awww the wheels of Washington and knowing how to play the game. You do not have to be a politician, you just need to know how to make deals
Bkmk
Better to rescind it and start over with one that is well implemented from the start.
The same advice the GOP loser elite have been offering for decades.
Let Trump fight, his voters love it.
These same set of events happened in Australia a few years ago with illegal aliens. Ultimately the Tony Abbott decided to just ignore the court. After whining about it for a few months the issue went away.
Frankly I don’t know why conservative would extend legitimacy to the US courts. They’ve been operating on a double standard of whatever the liberals want is the law while the actual law is ignored since the 60s. 90% of the problems in this country can be traced back to unconstitutional SC decisions.
Until the courts are remanded to their original role of objectively interpreting the law they’re going to get nothing but contempt from me. Override them President Trump!
It’s only for 90 days so by the time the court hears it we will have the vetting process in place.
Green Card holders are here on an immigrant visa - once they leave the country, they are subject to reentry requirements. They are not “in country” and are not citizens -> no due process as a “right” is not being denied.
A Green Card *may* grant then some privilege not available to other immigrants, but they are still subject to immigration procedures.
One of those privileges might be that you can not be sent back directly and can retain counsel and apply for a waiver for the disqualifying factor. That privilege was NOT abridged in the EO, if it exists at all.
Again, travel outside the US is voluntary - if you decide to leave, for whatever period and whatever length, you are subject to re-entry regulations. The Regulation states “all classes” of immigrant and nonimmigrant. IOW the President CAN deny Green Card holders (a class of immigrant) at his discretion and for as long as he deems necessary, re-entry into the US. He can NOT, by decree, revoke the Green Card or the Visa. He was not granted that power.
The law is clear and concise and INCLUDES Green Card Holders if the President so decrees.
Don’t give an inch on that argument. The courts to NOT agree - this is settled law that is simply being ignored.
The only downside I see is his legacy will paint him, at least by liberals, as a “dictator”.
I was thinking about that. I assume he would need a full travel ban as well, or these people will just come to the US anyways knowing once they are here they will never get deported?
How long to get the new judge in their?
Bring it on. DJT is the 1st pres in a long time to have our backs.
1) as you said, shut it ALL down
2) Ignore the 9th circuit and business as usual
3) Just move on for now until our new Justice is confirmed.
If we storm the congressmans offices? They don’t represent us.
I would estimate 3 months at a minimum. It depends how long it takes the GOP to invoke the nuclear option, because I just don’t think enough Dems will vote for cloture.
OK, he needs some other solutions then....
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