111 (U. Methodist) clergy, clergy candidates come out as gay (on eve of denominational convention)

Good News ^ | 10 May 16 | Steve Beard

[xzins]

By Heather Hahn
May 9, 2016 | PORTLAND, Ore. (UMNS) On the eve of the 2016 General Conference, more than 100 United Methodist clergy and clergy candidates have come out as LGBTQ religious leaders.

“We are here because God has called us to serve in this denomination, and our souls are fed by the theology in which we’ve been raised,” the 111 United Methodists write in what they call “A Love Letter to Our Church.” The signers come from across the United States, and one signer is from the Philippines. They identify themselves as “Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Trans, Queer/Questioning, and Intersex” in the letter.

Their letter comes a week after 15 clergy and clergy candidates in the New York Conference took a similar step of coming out together. It also comes just two days after the Rev. David Meredith, a United Methodist pastor in the West Ohio Conference, married Jim Schlachter, his boyfriend of 28 years.

These actions could put these clergy at risk of losing their credentials under church law, just as 864 delegates from around the globe are embarking on a 10-day legislative meeting that will determine church rules for the coming four years. Some of the May 9 letter signers are among the delegates.

However, the letter also indicates that many United Methodists are moving forward regardless of what General Conference decides, said Matt Berryman.

He is the executive director of Reconciling Ministries Network, an unofficial United Methodist group that advocates for the church to be more inclusive. The network has coordinated publicity of this and other challenges to church law as part of the group’s “It’s Time” campaign.

“Since 2012, we’ve decided we would be the church no matter what,” Berryman told United Methodist News Service. The majority of delegates at the 2012 General Conference voted against a proposal to say United Methodists disagree whether homosexuality is against God’s will.

To read the entire UMNS story by Heather Hahn, click HERE.

[xzins]

Both, Johnie. I’m a retired Army chaplain and am an active pastor.

[johniegrad]

Private note coming.

[AppyPappy]

Ironically, the desire to drive people from the faith has simply driven them to more Biblical churches. We have lost a bunch of families in our UMC church to PCA and conservative-independents.

The problem isn’t same-sex marriage or homosexual pastors. It is the need to avoid the Bible in order to support those issues. The Bible has become a minefield for the church.

[xzins]

There is no doubt in my mind. The Bible is the single greatest hurdle they have had to deal with. They’ve done that by ignoring/rewriting it.

Their second obstacle, of course, is two millennia of church history and the bulk of current world Christianity rejecting what they are proposing. They are in rebellion, so that reality is simply pushed aside.

[AppyPappy]

Tradition is easy to overcome because it can be rewritten. But the Truth will stand until the Day of Judgment.

[xzins]

The history of Christianity is, as you say, not nearly as much an obstacle as is the Bible. But, if you put that history in combination with the Bible, then the only conclusion that can be reached is that millennia of Christians interpreted the bible the same way on this subject.

It’s a powerful argument.

[Bryanw92]

>>I suppose the A vs C ‘debate’ will go on until Jesus’ return.

After I became a Calvinist, I went through the “cage stage” for a while, but I got over it and just came to accept Arminianism as a part of the human condition.

But then I went to bible study with a Wesleyan friend a few months ago where they were discussing the possibility of losing salvation. They were worked up into a real tizzy over it and I forced myself to stay silent since I was a visitor to their church.

But it was quite interesting.

[OrangeHoof]

And if 111 United Methodist ministers came out in support of pedophilia or bestiality, would the church’s governing body just roll over and let them?

It’s the same arguments.

[xzins]

It’s the same argument, but they would hide behind cultural acceptability at this point in time.

[fwdude]

That absolutely nothing of substance will happen to these sodomite activists tells us what the UMC’s real policy is.

[xzins]

Nothing will happen. I agree.

That is why a legislative victory at the General Conference will be meaningless against this disobedience movement.

[fwdude]

Yep. The law will essentially be whatever you can get away with.

[Neoliberalnot]

I posted my comment to the UMC site. All freepers should do the same.

[faithhopecharity]

It’s good you got out. There are so many churches running around now. I hope you’ve found one that — notwithstanding any complicated theological distinctives — still does try to read and understand and live as best possible in accord with God’s will for mankind. Best,

[riverdawg]

“Ironically, the desire to drive people from the faith has simply driven them to more Biblical churches. We have lost a bunch of families in our UMC church to PCA and conservative-independents.”

What I have observed is a polarization, with some families going the conservative/independent route and others heading to the Unitarian church. The mushy middle, represented by many UMC churches, is hemorrhaging members.

Apparently, the Presbyterian church is going through a similar schism; a substantial group within the largest Presbyterian church in town voted to leave and set up a separate church. There is a big fight over church property and other assets which was so rancorous it made the local newspaper.

[mbarker12474]

“Just as I am,
I’m changing not,
How dare you say my soul’s got spots!
I feel I’m okay,
And that’s good enough,
Oh a Lamb of Godwith a lamb and a goat, I come,
Just as I am.”

[Elsie]

It is the need to avoid the Bible in order to support those issues.

Like THIS???

 

Genesis 13:13

Now the men of Sodom were wicked and were sinning greatly against the LORD.

Genesis 18:20-21
20. Then the LORD said, "The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous
21. that I will go down and see if what they have done is as bad as the outcry that has reached me. If not, I will know."

Genesis 19:4-7
4. Before they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city of Sodom--both young and old--surrounded the house.
5. They called to Lot, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them."
6. Lot went outside to meet them and shut the door behind him
7. and said, "No, my friends. Don't do this wicked thing.

Psalms 12:8 The wicked freely strut about when what is vile is honored among men.

Isaiah 3:9 The look on their faces testifies against them; they parade their sin like Sodom; they do not hide it. Woe to them! They have brought disaster upon themselves.

2 Peter 2:13b Their idea of pleasure is to carouse in broad daylight. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their pleasures while they feast with you.

Ezekiel 16:49-50
49. "`Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy.
50. They were haughty and did detestable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you have seen.

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2 Peter 2

1. But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them--bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2. Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
3. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.
4. For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment;
5. if he did not spare the ancient world when he brought the flood on its ungodly people, but protected Noah, a preacher of righteousness, and seven others;
6. if he condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah by burning them to ashes, and made them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly;
7. and if he rescued Lot, a righteous man, who was distressed by the filthy lives of lawless men
8. (for that righteous man, living among them day after day, was tormented in his righteous soul by the lawless deeds he saw and heard)--
9. if this is so, then the Lord knows how to rescue godly men from trials and to hold the unrighteous for the day of judgment, while continuing their punishment.
10. This is especially true of those who follow the corrupt desire of the sinful nature and despise authority. Bold and arrogant, these men are not afraid to slander celestial beings;
11. yet even angels, although they are stronger and more powerful, do not bring slanderous accusations against such beings in the presence of the Lord.
12. But these men blaspheme in matters they do not understand. They are like brute beasts, creatures of instinct, born only to be caught and destroyed, and like beasts they too will perish.
13. They will be paid back with harm for the harm they have done. Their idea of pleasure is to carouse in broad daylight. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their pleasures while they feast with you.

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But there IS hope!!!

1 Corinthians 6:9-11

9. Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived:
Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders
10. nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
11. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

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If you could NOT change, you would be in most pitiful shape...
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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The Health Risks of gay sex.

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[Elsie]

I attend a Wesleyan congregation and have no problems at all saying you can lose your salvation.

To say otherwise means you have to toss out some Scripture.

[Elsie]

Apparently, the Presbyterian church is going through a similar schism;

A time is coming, where sound doctrine upness will not be put with.

[CodeToad]

UM is a money making social club. It isn’t a church.