The FBI-Apple Battle Is About Much More Than One Phone

Rush Limbaugh ^ | February 25, 2016 | Rush Limbaugh

[NYer]

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT

RUSH: I've been listening to a number of people talk about the debate, this whole FBI versus Apple and iPhone thing, and Tim Cook granted a very lengthy interview with ABC's David Muir, and World News Tonight about this, trying to explain his position and the FBI is explaining theirs.

And it's... Look, it's no different in this than any other thing that would come up, but it's fascinating, really, when in my case I am an expert on much of this. And to listen to people who don't know what they're talking about talk about it with passion, it's fascinating. It's an interesting, it's an educational, informative thing to watch people who don't really know what they're talking about. I mean, it's not that they're purposely getting things wrong. It's that they think they have it under control, a total understanding.

And when you listen to 'em, they don't.

I've seen this on TV from show to show, not just one particular show. But here's the bottom line to this -- and it's tough, too, because James Comey, the FBI director, is a solid guy. He worked for John Ashcroft. I've never met him, but a lot of people I know also know him and have great things to say about him. But what the government's saying they want here is simply not what they're actually angling for when they say it's just about access to this one phone. Mr. Comey himself said, "Look, it's not even a phone that's in wide use. It's an iPhone 5c."

It doesn't matter, this whole story, it doesn't matter what kind of phone it is. It doesn't matter the model. It doesn't matter any -- doesn't matter the specifics of the phone. That's not what is at stake here. This is about much more than simply a software company manufacturing an apparatus for the government to be able to get into one -- and only one -- phone. That is by no means what this is about. And, furthermore, this would have been solved -- this whole thing would have been over with by now and nobody would have even known about it -- except the FBI took it public.

The FBI went public with this.

That put Apple on notice.

It put them on the defensive because their marketing ends up being attacked here and a number of other things. The FBI going public with this has the resulted in them not getting what they want, for all intents and purposes. I mean, it's not guaranteed, but this episode might have already ended with nobody knowing anything about it. They were talking back channels, private. It wasn't public. The FBI took it public. The reason the FBI took it public is because they're converting this incident into a PR vehicle to get more than what they really are stating they want.

They want, ultimately, to force software writers and manufacturers to eliminate encryption. And if not that, to give them the keys to be able to decrypt the content on phones. And they're using the threat of terrorism as a means of emotionally involving everybody here. I mean, who can oppose finding out everything you can find out about terrorists? Who in the world would stand in the way of trying to find out what terrorism is lurking out there and who the terrorist might be? If all that information perhaps is on that one phone, who could possibly oppose that?

So the FBI wants to make everybody think that's what this is about, when it isn't. Their desires go way beyond being able to find out what's on this one phone -- way, way beyond it. And in the midst of this, do you know what Apple is doing? And I'm here to tell you that this is going to be something that is going to end up irritating a lot of people down the road. Because of this -- and I think even prior to this incident happening. You know, Apple, if you trust their marketing, if you trust what they say when they market and sell their products -- primarily their devices, the iPhones and iPads and so forth.

If you believe them, then you believe that they are really totally invested in your privacy and really totally invested in your security. And they don't want anybody to be able to hack into your phone, get in your phone, find out what's on your phone without your permission. So what Apple is doing -- and it may show up on the next iPhone, the iPhone 7, which is due to hit in September. Apple is working on securing their system software even more. And what they're going to end up with, if they succeed in this -- and there's nothing technologically to stop them.

It's, again, a marketing decision to do this or not. They could end up having system software that not even Apple would be able to crack. It will be so secure that not even Apple will be able to crack it. Now, you might say, "Well, that's really great, man! I'll be for that." Well, here's the problem with that: Most people forget passwords. Well, not most, but a lot of people forget passwords. You would be stunned at the number of customer service calls that Apple and other similar tech companies get every day from people who have forgotten their passwords to their devices and don't know what to do.

They have no way to get in if they've forgotten their password, and there are mechanisms in place that if you try a number of times and get it wrong, in the case of Apple, they will delay the next attempt and delay the next attempt. And then after 10 attempts, if you have it set the phone's data will be erased. It's the ultimate security: Just wipe it. After 10 attempts, the assumption is that somebody other than the owner is trying to get in there. The first four attempts, you can try them immediately right after.

If you fail four times, for the fifth attempt you have to wait a minute. If that fails, you have to wait 10 minutes, on up to the tenth time, which is the last time. After failed attempt number nine, you have to wait an hour before trying the tenth time. And if it fails the tenth time, sayonara. Now, in that case, you can call Apple now. When you set up your device and when you establish your passcode, you were given questions to answer what your favorite course in school was -- you know, questions only you could possibly know the answers to -- in case you forget your password.

When you want Apple to open the phone for you, reset your password so you can get into it, you have to be able to prove who you are, more than with your credit card, more than with conventional identification data, you have to answer certain questions that you choose to answer when you set it all up. Apple's preparing to eliminate all that. They're gonna take this, the complete end of the road. If you forget your password, you are screwed. There will not be a way into it.

Apple is writing it so that not even they will be able to unlock anybody's phone, and they're doing this on the basis of promising ultimate, total security and privacy. Now, that's gonna end up making a lot of people really irritated because there are more people than you would understand -- or maybe not understand, believe -- who forget their passwords. Have you ever forgotten a password? I've never forgotten my phone PIN or passcode. But if it's been years since I've used, say, a website where I need one?

I've forgotten some. It happens to everybody, is the point. It's getting to the point where, if they succeed in this, -- they're calling it "improvement in security" -- and you forget it, and if you did not set up ways for you to remind yourself what that password is, you're gonna be out of luck. And if they do this, it's gonna make these phones hack proof, but it's gonna irritate a lot of people who forget their passwords and did not set up mechanisms whereby they can be reminded what their password is.

It's a little bit more involved than this. I'm just giving you the surface end result of this. One of the ways that you can beat the system now -- and this is what the San Bernardino County people screwed up. There's a way you can get into every iPhone without a passcode, and it is to put it in recovery mode and restore software, restore the operating system to it. And you can do all of that with -- and preserving the data on the phone. You can do all of that by installing a new system from recovery mode.

Now, getting into recovery mode's not an easy thing to do. It takes a little practice to get in there, but you have to figure out how to put the phone into recovery mode. Connect it to iTunes (can't use iCloud for this), and then once you've done that, you have a way of getting into the phone. This is what the San Bernardino people blew that opportunity by changing the Apple ID password. They were trying to get in and find a backup on iCloud of the data on the phone that they could get to, and because they changed...

They didn't know what they had.

They didn't know what they were doing.

They didn't know that they had total control over the device and everybody else

that has a device that they gave. So it's not just about this one phone, and it's not just about whatever's on this phone stopping terrorism. They want ways into all kinds of devices. They want the devices to be less encrypted than they are now. But they're camouflaging those desires by focusing everybody's attention here. "It's just one phone! It's just a terrorist's phone. Who in the world could not want us to find out what was on that phone to stop terrorism?"

That's the position Apple finds themselves in, and is having to explain this.

It's a tough sell.

END TRANSCRIPT

[Auntie Dem]

Why does the FBI need to get into the phone to see who the terrorist was calling? The service provider (Verizon, AT&T, Whoever). Has all those details in their files. When I get online to my cell account I can see the numbers I called or who called me, whether it was a voice call or a text. I’m told the providers can even retrieve the text and attachments from text messages. The FBI can bypass Apple altogether, but they won’t. They want the master key to get into every iPhone.

[DiogenesLamp]

The fact is that the FBI is now saying they want Apple to create software that will be used to crack at least 12 more phones.

The word "create" means about 15 minutes work for a software engineer. The cracking of other phones will be the consequence of court warrants to do so.

So long as a court warrant is issued, I have no problems with Apple using that modified operating system to crack more phones.

I have a problem with the FBI or any other governmental organization doing it, but so long as Apple does it and keeps the software proprietary and in their custody, I really do not have a problem with Apple breaking open phones as the result of a Court order.

[Vic S]

But it's not really a court order. It's a secret court order. Take it to court where apple can present their side and the govt present theirs.

This is about setting precedent. If Apple caves then the FBI can go to any internet device manufacturer and ask for a backdoor. It's getting to hard for them to go to each company one at a time. So they're trying to shotgun it and get access to the world of all internet devices (all smartphones, computers, cars and "the Internet of Things")

I have a friend who was approached by the NSA. He was a Sr VP and they came to him and asked for a backdoor. He arranged it, because it made sense. But there are many companies where it doesn't make sense and to protect their use base they won't just give one out.

So, you trust the FBI enough to just give them access to everything? And you trust them enough that they will only use it on special occasions. I don't

People have gone to jail for not granting access:

Ralph Nachio of Quest CEO of Bitlocker

[MeganC]

The problem is that the FBI wants custody of the software.

[Bryan24]

Who do you trust more, Apple or Uncle Sam?

Who do you trust more to keep your personal information safe, Apple or Uncle Sam?

Who is Constitutionally Mandated to defend your rights regarding privacy/safety/liberty?

Who is going to make you pay for securing your rights regarding privacy/safety/liberty?

Who will track down and confront/arrest/stop terrorists?

This episode does NOT have an either/or solution.

The Feds have screwed up by breaking the trust with the American people and over-reaching in their demands. Edward Snowden revealed the duplicity of our Intelligence Agencies.

As a US Company, Apple has screwed up by choosing a foolish 3 legged marketing/business strategy:
1. Distrust of US Government
2. Technical innovation
3. Sales to anyone world wide

I’m not defending the government. I’m not defending Apple.

We need to trust our government because.......
Our government is the entity tasked with our security against terrorists. That is not Apple’s job.

How does the government regain the trust?

[jessduntno]

Been a while. I’ve been in pretty bad shape.

[jessduntno]

Yeah, sorry, not a big Snowden fan.

[RockyTx]

don’t believe anything the FBI says

if you want to securely encrypt something,
use stand-alone encryption.

the idea that a carry-around device is going to be
secure, seems odd to me.

with that said,

Apple is being forced to write software that
hacks their own device...
to set a precedence for the future.

[Vendome]

Really?

What’s happening?

PM if you want...

[varyouga]

“Yeah, sorry, not a big Snowden fan.”

Yea, he proved your Fed buddies are scum who will spy on you without a warrant and then lie about it in court

[jessduntno]

My Fed Buddies? Hahahahaha. You a pretty funny guy. Or girl.

[Jmouse007]

RUSH has been and is on Apple's side because somehow and in some way there is $, Apple stock or personal bennies and perks involved. RUSH doesn't do or say anything about any product or service unless it $ benifits him personally, period!

RUSH is always personally hawking Apple's "latest and greatest" Chi-com Apple junk on his show. He always does so within the context/content of the show itself, NEVER as a separate advertisement or sponsored commercial.

For years I have suspected RUSH has some kind of cushy unstated reciprocal arrangement/agreement with Apple. The fact that RUSH as never once mentioned or condemned Apple's bending over and grabbing their ankles whenever the Communist Chinese government demands and is given the exact same thing and more concerning access to EVERYONE'S Apple products throughout ALL of Communist China, while at the same time he cries foul, citing "privacy concerns" and defends Apple's denial of access to the American governments request concerning ONE phone formerly owned by a Muslim "American 'citzen'" who carried out a Muslim terrorist attack which left 14 Americans dead and a number of other Americans severely wounded clinches my long-held suspicion that RUSH is in bed $ with Apple, something that he will never reveal to his listening "audience", that gloms onto early everything he says.

[Sirloin]

The people trying to change the 4th is the corrupt companies trying to sell an un-crackable phone - which puts people above the law. Think about it. You really want ISIS, drug cartels and kiddie porn sellers networking with these new encrypted phones protected from LEGALLY court ordered surveillance?

Here is the problem I have with this: First, the government wants to establish a precedent to compel private companies to create new software that makes it easier for the government to do their jobs. This is not merely about Apple giving the feds access to tools already created, this is the feds ordering Apple to create new software. Which is conscription (or slavery to be less charitable). Once that horse left the barn there is no putting it back. What limit would there be on the government to compel anyone to do anything?

Secondly, currently the government says that this is only to fight heinous crimes like terrorism or child pornography. Tomorrow it will be for things that aren't so heinous: non-mainstream pornography, soft drug use, and who knows what else. The sad fact is that there are so many laws that a typical American breaks many of them a week and they don't even realize it. In the past it was just too cumbersome for the government to utilize the manpower to go after all the inadvertent scofflaws. With a network a all-seeing computers that can sneak into all phones it won't be hard for the government to read your text messages, emails, and search your phone contacts for known drug dealers, tea-party subversives, socialist subversives, etc. I don't believe the 4th amendment won't stop them, because the NSA has established a precedent of mass surveillance of entire population to find terrorists (the needle in the haystack problem). It's for the good of the collective, after all.

Finally, it's important to realize that all social movements throughout history started with people breaking the laws of their era. Agree with them or not, the civil rights movement, gay rights, legalization of marijuana in some states, etc. were illegal in the past. Now they are not because enough people banded together and tried to change the laws. If these movements were snuffed out before they got rolling by a government that has a vested interest in keeping the status quo, would you say that's a good thing? I don't. I may not agree with other people on controversial issues but I do respect that they have a right to agitate for the change they want to see. Pervasive surveillance could strangle that in the womb.

[DiogenesLamp]

So, you trust the FBI enough to just give them access to everything?

Everything a Judge issues a writ or warrant for. So long as they go through a Judge, I regard their search as legal.

At least until we reach the point where we cannot trust judges to issue valid warrants.

[bert]

ok, answer me this......

My iphone 5s has a passcode. being old and absent minded, I forget the pass code. I can’t operate my phone. Why can’t I as owner take the phone to apple and ask them to crack the pass code and give my phone back?

the alternative is throwing away the phone.

[RetiredTexasVet]

But it is only one phone .... they can destroy the software after the retrieve the data .... this is a one time only order .... we guarantee that no hackers, etc. will have access to the back door ..... bend over, grab your ankles and spread them ... you can trust us because we are the government!

[jessduntno]

“Pervasive surveillance could strangle that in the womb.”

True. But the order specifically addresses this phone, this mechanism to defeat the self destruct part of the system and they do not want the key itself. They have offered to pay for the cost - they are NOT demanding it be done free - and until there is a Constitutional amendment and search warrants are abolished, this isn’t going away. Tackling this in this manner is no easy way to do it. But fir now, I di niit imagine America having no ability to access the important (in my opinion) part of the fourth that protcts us. The bad guys will do what they do, but that doesn’t mean we should allow it.

[Buffalo Head]

"the alternative is throwing away the phone."

No, the alternative is to act responsibly and record the password somewhere. So, instead of acting responsibly by taking care of yourself, you propose penalizing everyone else. For shame!

[DiogenesLamp]

The problem is that the FBI wants custody of the software.

The problem is that Apple keeps spreading this lie all over the internet. From the FBI's filing:

To the contrary, the Order allows Apple to retain custody of its sofware at all times, and it gives Apple flexibility in the manner in which it provides assistance. In fact, the software never has to come into the government's custody.

Apple is the one lying to everyone about what is going on.

[jessduntno]

“First, the government wants to establish a precedent to compel private companies to create new software that makes it easier for the government to do their jobs.”

Yes, of course. When you issue a legal court order, you expect to get compliance with the 4th amendment. It’s the basis of our freedom. Why is that news?