Posted on 02/25/2016 4:00:34 PM PST by NYer
Why does the FBI need to get into the phone to see who the terrorist was calling? The service provider (Verizon, AT&T, Whoever). Has all those details in their files. When I get online to my cell account I can see the numbers I called or who called me, whether it was a voice call or a text. I’m told the providers can even retrieve the text and attachments from text messages. The FBI can bypass Apple altogether, but they won’t. They want the master key to get into every iPhone.
The word "create" means about 15 minutes work for a software engineer. The cracking of other phones will be the consequence of court warrants to do so.
So long as a court warrant is issued, I have no problems with Apple using that modified operating system to crack more phones.
I have a problem with the FBI or any other governmental organization doing it, but so long as Apple does it and keeps the software proprietary and in their custody, I really do not have a problem with Apple breaking open phones as the result of a Court order.
This is about setting precedent. If Apple caves then the FBI can go to any internet device manufacturer and ask for a backdoor. It's getting to hard for them to go to each company one at a time. So they're trying to shotgun it and get access to the world of all internet devices (all smartphones, computers, cars and "the Internet of Things")
I have a friend who was approached by the NSA. He was a Sr VP and they came to him and asked for a backdoor. He arranged it, because it made sense. But there are many companies where it doesn't make sense and to protect their use base they won't just give one out.
So, you trust the FBI enough to just give them access to everything? And you trust them enough that they will only use it on special occasions. I don't
People have gone to jail for not granting access:
Ralph Nachio of Quest CEO of Bitlocker
The problem is that the FBI wants custody of the software.
Who do you trust more, Apple or Uncle Sam?
Who do you trust more to keep your personal information safe, Apple or Uncle Sam?
Who is Constitutionally Mandated to defend your rights regarding privacy/safety/liberty?
Who is going to make you pay for securing your rights regarding privacy/safety/liberty?
Who will track down and confront/arrest/stop terrorists?
This episode does NOT have an either/or solution.
The Feds have screwed up by breaking the trust with the American people and over-reaching in their demands. Edward Snowden revealed the duplicity of our Intelligence Agencies.
As a US Company, Apple has screwed up by choosing a foolish 3 legged marketing/business strategy:
1. Distrust of US Government
2. Technical innovation
3. Sales to anyone world wide
I’m not defending the government. I’m not defending Apple.
We need to trust our government because.......
Our government is the entity tasked with our security against terrorists. That is not Apple’s job.
How does the government regain the trust?
Been a while. I’ve been in pretty bad shape.
Yeah, sorry, not a big Snowden fan.
don’t believe anything the FBI says
if you want to securely encrypt something,
use stand-alone encryption.
the idea that a carry-around device is going to be
secure, seems odd to me.
with that said,
Apple is being forced to write software that
hacks their own device...
to set a precedence for the future.
Really?
What’s happening?
PM if you want...
“Yeah, sorry, not a big Snowden fan.”
Yea, he proved your Fed buddies are scum who will spy on you without a warrant and then lie about it in court
My Fed Buddies? Hahahahaha. You a pretty funny guy. Or girl.
RUSH is always personally hawking Apple's "latest and greatest" Chi-com Apple junk on his show. He always does so within the context/content of the show itself, NEVER as a separate advertisement or sponsored commercial.
For years I have suspected RUSH has some kind of cushy unstated reciprocal arrangement/agreement with Apple. The fact that RUSH as never once mentioned or condemned Apple's bending over and grabbing their ankles whenever the Communist Chinese government demands and is given the exact same thing and more concerning access to EVERYONE'S Apple products throughout ALL of Communist China, while at the same time he cries foul, citing "privacy concerns" and defends Apple's denial of access to the American governments request concerning ONE phone formerly owned by a Muslim "American 'citzen'" who carried out a Muslim terrorist attack which left 14 Americans dead and a number of other Americans severely wounded clinches my long-held suspicion that RUSH is in bed $ with Apple, something that he will never reveal to his listening "audience", that gloms onto early everything he says.
Here is the problem I have with this: First, the government wants to establish a precedent to compel private companies to create new software that makes it easier for the government to do their jobs. This is not merely about Apple giving the feds access to tools already created, this is the feds ordering Apple to create new software. Which is conscription (or slavery to be less charitable). Once that horse left the barn there is no putting it back. What limit would there be on the government to compel anyone to do anything?
Secondly, currently the government says that this is only to fight heinous crimes like terrorism or child pornography. Tomorrow it will be for things that aren't so heinous: non-mainstream pornography, soft drug use, and who knows what else. The sad fact is that there are so many laws that a typical American breaks many of them a week and they don't even realize it. In the past it was just too cumbersome for the government to utilize the manpower to go after all the inadvertent scofflaws. With a network a all-seeing computers that can sneak into all phones it won't be hard for the government to read your text messages, emails, and search your phone contacts for known drug dealers, tea-party subversives, socialist subversives, etc. I don't believe the 4th amendment won't stop them, because the NSA has established a precedent of mass surveillance of entire population to find terrorists (the needle in the haystack problem). It's for the good of the collective, after all.
Finally, it's important to realize that all social movements throughout history started with people breaking the laws of their era. Agree with them or not, the civil rights movement, gay rights, legalization of marijuana in some states, etc. were illegal in the past. Now they are not because enough people banded together and tried to change the laws. If these movements were snuffed out before they got rolling by a government that has a vested interest in keeping the status quo, would you say that's a good thing? I don't. I may not agree with other people on controversial issues but I do respect that they have a right to agitate for the change they want to see. Pervasive surveillance could strangle that in the womb.
Everything a Judge issues a writ or warrant for. So long as they go through a Judge, I regard their search as legal.
At least until we reach the point where we cannot trust judges to issue valid warrants.
ok, answer me this......
My iphone 5s has a passcode. being old and absent minded, I forget the pass code. I can’t operate my phone. Why can’t I as owner take the phone to apple and ask them to crack the pass code and give my phone back?
the alternative is throwing away the phone.
But it is only one phone .... they can destroy the software after the retrieve the data .... this is a one time only order .... we guarantee that no hackers, etc. will have access to the back door ..... bend over, grab your ankles and spread them ... you can trust us because we are the government!
“Pervasive surveillance could strangle that in the womb.”
True. But the order specifically addresses this phone, this mechanism to defeat the self destruct part of the system and they do not want the key itself. They have offered to pay for the cost - they are NOT demanding it be done free - and until there is a Constitutional amendment and search warrants are abolished, this isn’t going away. Tackling this in this manner is no easy way to do it. But fir now, I di niit imagine America having no ability to access the important (in my opinion) part of the fourth that protcts us. The bad guys will do what they do, but that doesn’t mean we should allow it.
No, the alternative is to act responsibly and record the password somewhere. So, instead of acting responsibly by taking care of yourself, you propose penalizing everyone else. For shame!
The problem is that Apple keeps spreading this lie all over the internet. From the FBI's filing:
To the contrary, the Order allows Apple to retain custody of its sofware at all times, and it gives Apple flexibility in the manner in which it provides assistance. In fact, the software never has to come into the government's custody.
Apple is the one lying to everyone about what is going on.
“First, the government wants to establish a precedent to compel private companies to create new software that makes it easier for the government to do their jobs.”
Yes, of course. When you issue a legal court order, you expect to get compliance with the 4th amendment. It’s the basis of our freedom. Why is that news?
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