Posted on 06/06/2015 1:19:48 PM PDT by don-o
First came a few pistol shots, several witnesses said, then a barrage of rifle fire during the shootout last month at a Waco restaurant favored by bikers. But authorities still have not said how many of the dead and wounded were the result of police fire.
Police have identified only one assault weapon, a semi-automatic gun that fires high-powered ammunition, among the firearms confiscated from bikers, and that was found in a locked car after the shooting ended.
(Excerpt) Read more at star-telegram.com ...
“Some people in the middle could somewhat innocently get involved with something they didn’t intend to the morning when they rode to this affair.”
They were released the first day.
Have you done ANY independent research at all as to the folks in jail, the people behind those mugshots? YES or NO?
Have you given intellectually addressed the MILLION DOLLAR BAIL, done some independent investigation to compare it to the norm of bail typically demanded for murders and others accused of serious crimes? YES or NO?
Have you done anything at all to live up to your screen name? Your answers to the simple yes-or-no questions will reveal it, however you risk then having to share the info you found when you did that research, and that info represents truth you cannot handle.
And what does your attorney friend, the one you praise as knowing what he is talking about, think about million dollar bail being imposed on people who have zero prior criminal records?
Why do I think that any response you give to this post (which I bet you won't provide), you will fail utterly to provide any answers to those questions?
Your screen name is absolutely false advertising. Really, it is pathetic and contemptible. You are devious and at best self-deceiving. At best.
Good questions. There are few “child boys” in the instant case. These “clubs” self-identifiy as being in the worst 1% by the small diamond-shaped patch they wear on their back.
That said, many minor players’ lawyers will cut deals for clients to testify, and then their clients will walk.
You don't have to answer -- I probably won't read it anyway. But you go ahead and keep insulting the efficacy and abilities of policemen all across the state of Texas. You really are a 'gator, with all the intellect of a cracked hazelnut.
Would that require one of the participants to testify to that effect? iow, must the prosecution have a Rat to substantiate intent?
And would you care to share thoughts on RICO statutes as related to pre-empting crime as opposed to prosecuting actual crimes? And generally the possibility of it being used to harass unpopular groups of citizens.
I saw federal RICO prosecutions against pro-life rescuers in the early 90's. I thought that was a pretty heavy hammer they had to work with and now the states have it as well.
YES
Its short hand for stop pinging me to your leather clad circle jerk.
i would guess a girlfriend alerted the cops, possibly a wife
What did you find out about how many the folks behind the mug shots have established businesses, jobs, and families? And what did you find out about them that makes them such a flight risk that bail had to be set at $1 million?
What is the average bail for someone accused of engaging in organized crime linked to capital murder? For example -- this case, where Texas bail for the first murder of this creepy kid criminal was $250,000 (then $2 million on a 2nd murder charge).
Speaking generally about setting bail, [the judge] said: "There is that presumption of innocence for a defendant, and you try and set bail in a way that's not oppressive, in a way that gives the defendant the opportunity to get out and prepare for trial with his lawyer."
In your digging, what did you find out about how the accused are able to prepare for trial? And regarding the guys who were shot and killed? Their gang affiliations? Prior criminal records? Specific convictions on those criminal records?
Care to share? By the way, did you get the AGES of the 177 individuals arrested?
There are some genuine hard-core bad boys among that group, I would bet hard cash.
I would bet even harder cash that anyone over the age of 23 who is genuinely a hard-core criminal in that group, has a record as long as your arm. But I would also bet hard cold cash that anyone over the age of 30 on that list who doesn't have a prior criminal record, is "guilty" only of being present at a meeting of biker enthusiasts of all walks and types who wanted to discuss legislation and what-not affecting motorcycling.
Ask your lawyer friend about how the legalities of law enforcement engaging in guilt by association.
Rat? Don’t you mean a person who saw some idiot with a gun escalate to murder and wants0 no part of it.
This is not a federal RICO action. This us a State of Texas Murder and conspiracy case. No application of RICO here.
I am also curious ... bad-ass biker gangs "intent to rumble" at that location, as opposed to a place and TIME where they would be least likely to be filmed, seen, caught, snitched-on? But instead in one of the regularly scheduled meetings that a very broad coalition of clubs have been having for years? And on top of that, with law enforcement present and visible, or at the very least law enforcement present that could preemptively revealed its presence and thereby minimized the bikers' likelihood of starting so-called "rumble"?
Really???
There's people who'll buy anything, I guess, and lawyers too smart by half to get caught up in the game. But if these charges hold up, it sure is going to make it a lot easier for law enforcement to harass and arrest citizens simply for assembling together in one place, even the most unlikely place EVER for a "rumble."
“I am also curious ... bad-ass biker gangs “intent to rumble” at that location,”
Waco police sayh that is exactly what the videos will show.
http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/docs/PE/htm/PE.71.HTM
Sec. 71.02. ENGAGING IN ORGANIZED CRIMINAL ACTIVITY.
Isn’t this the statute the charges refer to?
All the leather I own is my shoes. So guess i am under dressed.
Well...watch where you step!
“Good questions. There are few “child boys” in the instant case. These “clubs” self-identifiy as being in the worst 1% by the small diamond-shaped patch they wear on their back.
That said, many minor players’ lawyers will cut deals for clients to testify, and then their clients will walk.”
And STILL have no records ??
” including one club member of Vice Grip Motorcycle Club, which is comprised of mechanics who work on vintage bikes, especially Harley Davidsons.”
Hmmm. What does that diamond-13 on the vest mean?
Much simpler than that.
I’m not admitted in Texas, so please consult local counsel before depending on this.
Some basics:
#1: A, B and C decide to take a handgun and rob D’s liquor store. A and B go inside. C stays outside and only drives the getaway car. All goes down fine, unless B shoots A and C and keeps all proceeds himself!
#2: Same as above but A brags to local hooker who tells cops. A, B and C are all charged with armed robbery, even though C never left getaway car. He was part of the felony, with aforethought.
#3: Same as #1, but B shoots D and D dies. A, B and C are all charged with murder, again with C never leaving car, as described above in #2.
#4; Same as #1, but after B pulls gun, D pulls bigger gun. D shoots B. B dies. In many states, A and C can be charged with MURDER because they participated in a felony where someone dies, even though it was a perp!
#5. A, B and C, and 50 of their friends go to motorcycle rally. They hate other club that AA, BB and 50 of their friends belong to. There has been trouble before, fights, shootings, etc. between these clubs. Someone says, “If it happens again, I’m gonna kill their ass, screw their women and destroy their Harleys.”
A, B and their friends end up at same parking lot where AA, BB and their fiends are.
Words, then punches are exchanged. A and B pull out guns and start shooting at AA, BB, etc. AA, BB, etc. shoot back. 7 die.
Cops have A and B cold. Their DNA, fingerprints and palm prints are on murder weapon. Fingerprints and palm prints are also on magazine and spent cartridge casings. Plenty of blood splatter from vics is on A amd B. Paraffin test shows A and B recently fired guns. 11 eyewitnesses, including 6 members of opposite gang and 5 bystanders pick A and B out of lineup.
A and B are screwed.
F,
But so are C, D, E, etc. Can cops and DA convince a jury they were in on some murder or other felony plot? Could they take the Big Sleep for this too?
Now, there are 45 other members in A and B’s gang. How many of their lawyers are racing to the courthouse to help the DA have an ever better case against A and B?
5? 10? 20?
In exchange, those who flip and burn A and B get off. Others at a minimum plead to some 2-5 year count so there is no chance they have to face a jury of pizzed off locals on a murder rap. Sure there is some chance they might get off, but why risk a 2-5, out in 14 months, against 12 pizzed off locals and a chance of 20-life?
The ones who flip never have to testify, because when A and B’s lawyers see the evidence against their clients, they all agree to hold hands, sing Kum Ba Ya and plead to murder 2 with a 20 year sentence, out in 12.
The flipers? They move to Spokane or Bangor, change their names and no problems for them. No formal Witness Protection. Just new ID.
Why are all held on murder now? Because of the scenario in #4 above, that makes a murder charge entirely viable, and each day more potential flippers get sick of jail and fess up!
That, my friend, is reality.
P.S. Your son is a USMC fast mover driver? Congratulations!
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