Posted on 01/28/2015 10:42:11 AM PST by keat
A Roman Catholic church in San Francisco has become one of a handful around the country to prohibit girls from being altar servers.
The Rev. Joseph Illo decided to train only boys to assist him at Mass after he was assigned to Star of the Sea Church in the Richmond district last year because he thinks the primary purpose of altar service is preparation for the priesthood, which women are ineligible to join, Illo told television station KPIX.
"The specifics of serving at the altar is a priestly function," Illo said. "And the Catholic church does not ordain women."
Illo said in a statement posted on the church's website Sunday that boys often lose interest in altar service when the programs are co-ed because "girls generally do a better job."
"I want to emphasize that we are not discontinuing altar girls because females are somehow incapable or unworthy. Girls are generally more capable and certainly just as worthy as boys," the statement said. "It is simply giving boys a role they can call their own, and more importantly recognizing the priesthood as a specifically fatherly charism."
Existing altar girls will be allowed to continue carrying the cross, washing the priest's hands and performing other duties of altar servers until they are phased out through Star of the Sea's new boys-only program, Illo said.
Girls and women have been permitted to serve Mass alongside priests since Pope John Paul II approved the practice in 1994. But a mixed-gender altar service is not a requirement, and the decision is usually left up to local bishops. San Francisco Archbishop Salvatore Cordileone authorized Star of the Sea's move to only having altar boys.
Some churchgoers told KPIX they were unhappy with the change.
"Those who can or cannot serve based on gender, that is discriminatory," parishioner Dunstan Alabanza said.
No, Romulus is trying to establish authority (of some sort) with insults and put-downs. Did you see what he wrote to Freeper ThomasMoore?
Don’t mistake arrogance for knowledge.
How (or why) would I mock people in the pews?
Please provide my exact quote and your interpretation of how I am mocking people in the pews.
He’s obviously very well educated and I saw no insults except he was saying you and Thomas More were ill-educated. Unfortunately, I was educated in my own religion but have lost a lot of my knowledge over the years. Thomas More was freaking out ‘cause I didn’t like little girl altar boys. And I don’t and will say so on every occasion.
“You know, rather than singing Kumbaya and strumming guitars? “ - miss marmelstein
Why would you say that?
Because you belittled the idea that there was more to being at Mass than sitting in the pews! As if people sitting in pews weren’t tuned into the transformation of bread and wine into the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ. Perhaps I misinterpreted your statement.
Nothing there invites the laity to perform liturgical offices, or even contemplates it.
With reference to the Liturgy and especially the Eucharist, the call to the laity is to be engaged and not mute spectators. Reference is made to responses, acclamations, postures, etc. and the summit of participation is worthy reception of Holy Communion.
Nothing about "ministries" in any of that. It is clericalism to insist that performing some liturgical office is a necessary or even desirable dimension of lay participation. The lay apostolate is in the world, performing works of mercy, working, raising families, and all that.
Yes, you misinterpreted my statement.
Badly.
I was contrasting what the Vatican II vision was for the laity with what Romulus has deemed was sufficient. They are not the same thing. This was in reply to a question that Romulus had raised about my knowledge of Vatican II.
Then you proceeded to attribute acts of liberalism to me. (Kumbaya...seriously?)
Uncalled for.
OK, I got it wrong. But explain, if you will, this business of sitting in pews. What did you mean by that?
Chapter III:
“The laity should accustom themselves to working in the parish in union with their priests”
Ask Romulus. I quoted him directly.
Chapter II
“ It is especially on this level that the apostolate of the laity and the pastoral ministry are mutually complementary.”
“The lay apostolate is in the world, performing works of mercy, working, raising families, and all that” - Romulus
“The laity carry out their manifold apostolate BOTH in the Church and in the world. In both areas there are various opportunities for apostolic activity.” - Chapter III, DECREE ON THE APOSTOLATE OF THE LAITY
It’s not the same, and, btw, I think there shouldn’t be “EMs” of either sex unless you’re at a huge service where the priests can’t possibly give communion.
Having grown in up in the 50s-60s, when we all came down the aisle, knelt briefly at the altar rail, and then moved on, I know that even two priests could very efficiently give Communion to a huge group - and in those days, the churches were full at every mass. But nowadays, most priests consider themselves put upon if they have to do more than one or two masses on a Sunday, and they never come out to assist the other celebrant if there happen to be more than one of them assigned to the same parish.
What we’re looking at is not the fault of the laity, but the fault of the politically correct hierarchy, who wanted to replace the lower clergy with lay people and made the lower clergy’s lives so unimportant and meaningless that most of them left.
And, of course, the key word there is “Extraordinary.” You’d never know it by how they are used in most North American parishes.
At the parish to which I belong, which has a rather large church building, it is still done that way for every Mass. And most of the Masses are not even Extraordinary Form. It is indeed efficient and quick.
I’m always amazed when I go to a church where there are 3 or 4 priests listed in the newsletter...and only the celebrant will serve Communion.
Priests used to spend all Sunday morning in the church, either celebrating Mass or assisting the other priests (this was before concelebration, btw) - and then they’d have the big Sunday dinner at the rectory, usually followed by Scotch provided by the pastor...
But that was a different world, I guess.
Still waiting for something — anything — about the laity being called to do liturgical stuff.
I know, because he was my pastor and is still a good friend. Thanks.
You’ll have to tell me where I specified that I claimed Vatican II said anything “about the laity being called to do liturgical stuff”
Let me help you with that scarecrow:
= = =
Post 67: “Most practicing American Catholics see altar serving as a way for children and young adults to serve the Church. Involvement. Responsibility.”
No mention of the laity being called by Vatican II to do liturgical stuff (you agreed with the observation, by the way)
= = =
Post 67: “Prior to Vatican II, there WAS a viewpoint that altar serving was preparation for the priesthood. After Vatican II, but BEFORE female altar servers, that viewpoint changed from priesthood preparation to layperson involvement in the Mass.”
What I thought was the opinion of most Catholics at the time, yes. Vatican II calling for laity to do liturgical “stuff”, no.
= = =
Post 81: “I was explaining the attitude shift that came with Vatican II, which DID call for greater involvement by lay persons”
No mention of the laity being called by Vatican II to do liturgical stuff. Greater involvement, yes. Liturgical “stuff”, no.
= = =
Post 100: “These documents note that lay people are called to be saints AND lay people are called by Christ to take part in the mission of the Church”
No mention of the laity being called to do liturgical stuff. Greater involvement, yes. Liturgical “stuff”, no.
= = =
Post 107: “The laity should accustom themselves to working in the parish in union with their priests”
No mention of the laity being called to do liturgical stuff. Greater involvement, yes. Liturgical “stuff”, no.
= = =
Post 112: “It is especially on this level that the apostolate of the laity and the pastoral ministry are mutually complementary”
No mention of the laity being called to do liturgical stuff. Greater involvement, yes. Liturgical “stuff”, no.
= = =
Post 113: “The laity carry out their manifold apostolate BOTH in the Church and in the world. In both areas there are various opportunities for apostolic activity”
No mention of the laity being called to do liturgical stuff. This directly counters your ignorant position that Vatican II limits lay person apostolate to the world only.
= = =
You can wait all day in self-aggrandizement, but I never claimed that Vatican II made calls for the laity to perform liturgical “stuff”.
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