Posted on 12/12/2013 4:05:13 AM PST by mrsadams
KHON-TV reported that Hawaii Department of Health Director Loretta Fuddy died when the Makani Kai Cessna Grand Caravan crashed half a mile off the north shore of Molokai. Fuddy was one of eight passengers on board the plane in addition to the pilot, and the only one who did not survive.
The plane took off at approximately 3:35 p.m. Wednesday from the Kalaupapa Peninsula bound for Honolulu. In addition to Fuddy, the department's deputy director, Keith Yamamoto, was also booked on the flight, department spokeswoman Janice Okubo told the Associated Press.
Makani Kai Air has said that the pilot did not make any radio calls indicating that he was in trouble before the crash. Another pilot spotted the wreckage and survivors wearing life vests and called in the details to the Molokai Airport tower
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
If you are a troll, you are not a very discrete one, law degrees in three states notwithstanding. If you are a troll you are not a smart one. Book savy perhaps; but lacking street smarts. As the true Hook has said himself, "Bad form."
Perhaps you should go back to troll academy, any of the liberal universities will do, before you are zotted.
IBZT.
My initial reaction was to observe how Benghazzi was off-topic to this thread.
It's an off-topic question in any event. I'm not going assist in turning this into a thread on Benghazzi.
I realize the questions I'm asking you about your Birther conspiracy theories are awkward to answer, because they are designed to do just that: expose the incoherent, inconsistent arguments your and other Birthers make. What people like you do at those moments is to try to distract from the problems in their arguments by side-tracking the discussion to other topics. It's a smoke-screen technique. I called you on that. And rightly so.
Here you're still doing it.
Is the Congress aware of Obama's ineligibility or is it not? If it is (as Birters are wont to claim), then this whole bit about Fuddy or others needing to be "silenced" is pure nonsense.
But I see you've got people circling the wagons in the vain attempt to avoid answering that simple question. It's funny watching everyone try to posture and duck.
They’re going to say it was a heart attack.
An early report cited a Honolulu fire department chief saying that Fuddy was found in the fuselage. The Coast Guard from Honolulu conducted rescue operations but I think it was the Maui fire department who also conducted rescue operations. Why the reporter quoted the Honolulu fire chief or where that fire chief got his info from, I don’t know, but that was the report that confused things a lot.
Someone in another thread gave a link to an article with quotes from the Coast Guard rescuer who found Fuddy about 200 yards from the nearest survivor. He said the survivors were not panicked but were glad to see help arrive. Said the navy had flares to show the Coast Guard where to look so they were able to find the wreck easily, about 30 minutes after the crash. There was some wind, he said, and waves about 6 ft high but nothing major.
Yamamoto said he helped Fuddy get her life jacket on and held her hand to calm her down. Seems like she was the one person on board who was panicked even as she was safely in the water with her life jacket. She had no visible injuries, according to the guy who found her, but he knew immediately that she was dead because she didn’t respond. The autopsy will say she had a heart attack, I’m sure.
We still don’t know if he’s got law degrees or not, because he was extremely offended when I asked what his name was. He prefers to be anonymous - and that’s his right, but he should expect his legal expertise to be no more credible than any anonymous poster who claims to be an attorney, which was my point in asking if he wanted to put his name to the legal theories he was espousing.
To the general public I will say this. Congress knows Obama is not eligible but until they have a law enforcement entity tell them that directly they have plausible deniability. That is why Zullo is having trouble getting the actual members of Congress to hear his evidence, and why they will throw away even law enforcement communications that are from non-constituents.
If/when the witnesses go to the foreign press and have the story reported, like Edward Snowden did, plausible deniability will go out the window. So there is a threat to Obama’s lawless regime IF the witnesses go to the foreign press.
The idea of offing witnesses is not a bizarre suggestion at all, and anybody who claims that as the reason to think that I or anybody else is a kook isn’t even TRYING to be genuine. The idea of offing somebody to intimidate others into silence is also not bizarre. It’s fairly routine in criminal circles.
I doubt that anybody expects Fuddy to go to the foreign press, but there are other witnesses who have resisted Fuddy, and if they end up being patriots like Snowden seems to have been (IMHO), then there IS a risk to Obama’s illegal, lawless regime. Offing Fuddy is one way they could try to intimidate those other witnesses.
Or it could just be a plane accident. We’ll probably never know. Given the already-known crimes and cover-ups of this regime and the rubber-stamp, whitewashing “official investigations” they’ve been caught at already, it is not unreasonable to wonder what really happened, and to expect that we’ll never know for sure.
It’s the people who suggest that only a “kook” would wonder who stand out as unreasonable. And when those people pose as conservatives but claim they know nothing about the Benghazi cover-up, that familiar troll scent becomes obvious.
That's nine months since I registered. I lurked for a while before posting. If my mission in life had been just to come disrupt threads (a true "troll") I'd hardly have waited that long. As I explained to at least one person, I have an interest law, history, and theology so the "NBC" issue (involving as it does caselaw starting no later than the early 1600's and appeal to "natural law") held an interest.
Following posts regarding birther issues exclusively with regard to Ted Cruz's eligibility to the Obama's issues.
On which point I argued against the silly "two citizen parent" theory (thus affirming Sen. Cruz's eligibility on that point). And that was before the Owners and Moderators here adopted that same position as essentially the "platform" of this Board.
You have an odd sense of what being a "troll" is.
If you are a troll, you are not a very discrete one
That's because I'm not one, so I'm not making an effort to coy about anything. I explained why the NBC issue made for a good topic of discussion when I got here.
If you are a troll you are not a smart one.
And yet my questions to Butterdezillion and the other Birthers still have them stumped. For being not very smart, I seem to know how to phrase a good question or two. :)
Perhaps you should go . . .before you are zotted.
No, you see it was among those arguing for some "two citizen parent" notion who got zotted. I was on the side of the Board moderators calling that legal mumbo-jumbo.
Oh, never mind . .
I don't post much here or anywhere. I don't have the luxury of some of camping out on Internet board seemingly 24/7. I will self-exile soon enough. (And I predict the Birthers here will still be stumped to answer the questions posed above.)
Congress knows Obama is not eligible but until they have a law enforcement entity tell them that directly they have plausible deniability.
So is the MCSO not a "law enforcement entity?" Haven't they and their "Posse" been clamoring to Congress about that for a long time now? Again, your claim and reality don't mesh very well.
That is why Zullo is having trouble getting the actual members of Congress to hear his evidence, and why they will throw away even law enforcement communications that are from non-constituents.
And why would any other law enforcement agency fare any better? Neither the law enforcement agencies nor Congress seems the least bit inclined to delve into this. And yet, under your theory, Loretta Fuddy was suddenly scared she was going to be prosecuted for her part in the 'scheme' (by one or more of these apathetic law enforcement agencies) and so started making agitating noises that caused her to be targeted and killed.
You're theory makes no sense.
If/when the witnesses go to the foreign press . . .
The Birther claims have been circulating for over 5 years, and two Presidential elections have come and gone. Why would these witnesses go now to the foreign press? It must be because of the lack of anyone looking to prosecute them for their involvement, right? That tell-tale "I'm not under scrutiny by law enforcement or the Congress, so I'd better act now" impulse that makes it so urgent?
and have the story reported, like Edward Snowden did, plausible deniability will go out the window.
Your comparison to Snowden is flawed because the surveillance program entailed substantial links to foreign agencies. The international press had an immediate interest. Where or when a U.S. President was born, insofar as that bears on some domestic law issue, isn't really of much concern to a foreign audience.
The idea of offing witnesses is not a bizarre suggestion at all,
Of course not. The Mafia and others have done it for years. But there the prosecution was imminent. Your idea becomes bizarre when posited in a situation (like with Fuddy) where there not the least hint that the 'witnesses' are under any sort of legal scrutiny nor any hint they are in the precipice of talking to the press.
I doubt that anybody expects Fuddy to go to the foreign press, . .
Yet, a moment ago, you were making the comparison to Snowden and posited that the possibility that she COULD have done that is the explanation for why she got assassinated. You've just undermined your own theory.
but there are other witnesses who have resisted Fuddy, and if they end up being patriots like Snowden seems to have been (IMHO), then there IS a risk to Obama’s illegal, lawless regime.
Offing Fuddy is one way they could try to intimidate those other witnesses.
You'd think the Regime would simply "off" one of the recalcitrants, rather than take out one of their own. With Fuddy out of their way, these other witnesses now have a bit more freedom to act without her keeping them in check, right? (Honestly, your thinking gets so backwards and inside-out that it defies reply).
Or it could just be a plane accident.
Your conspiratorial starting point being shown now to make no sense, it's time to consider that option more seriously.
Your points would have been better expressed without the personal attacks on Butterdezillion, who, as many of us have, is not engaging in the "luxury of some of camping out on Internet board seemingly 24/7;"but rather have taken on the watchfulness of engaged citizens as a second job.
Perhaps it is the snarkiness of your tone that sets off the "troll tingle" that we feel when you respond. It is a supercilious tone that seems to drip from the mouths of trolls and liberals at large. As Hook himself would say, "The pulling spawn, how I despise them."
Safe journey on your self-imposed exile.
The Honolulu Fire Department Chief was not on the scene and he may have assumed she didn’t get out of the plane as all the others got out and survived.
Yamamoto having to calm her down even after they got out got out of the plane might suggest she was experiencing anxiety which can be a symptom of heart attacks. So what he may have assumed was her not being able to relax may have actually been a sign that she was having a heart attack.
People having heart attacks in earthquakes and tornados is not that unusual.
Brietbart's death was the loudest and set the tone for how things would be. As such, Snowden is still in my "Patriot" column and, until I know the "rest of the story", my first impression is that he's a rather brave fellow.
Thanks again for the education and hats off to you once again for carrying the cross, so to speak, and becoming a target for doing so!
Dagnabbit. His name is spelled Breitbart, not Brietbart. (Banged up inner spellchecker is perpetually out of cal.)
Nice of you to be so concerned.
Er, Yamamoto was dressed in blue swim trunks for the flight.
Didn’t know that. Whatever he was wearing, I still believe that Lt. Rex T. Barber shot the Betty down, not Lanphier.
And the X-rays of his head went AWOL...but a photog had captured a shot of the film up on the reader, showing a fragment cone typical of a gunshot wound, not a dent (or even a hole) from a bolt.
You are missing the point. Anyone can shoot down conspiracy armchair sleuths - like shooting fish in a barrel - because as you say, one can conjecture in either direction from facts. A death can mean one thing, or its opposite, and still be part of a dastardly plot. We’ve all read enough mysteries and seen enough courtroom dramas to know how motivation and coverups can splay into different directions.
What butter and a lot of others here are trying to do is to sift through facts and general info to attempt to arrive at any truth.
There is too much evidence that something is amiss with Barack Obama’s citizenship. No one knows exactly what the story is, only that there is a story. Questionable citizenship means our president may not have been eligible to hold office. There are enough powerful forces apparently to aid him in hiding the information about his eligibility.
These questions have never been dealt with intelligently by any mainstream investigative news shows, papers, or reporters. There are a few in the media who have signed affidavits that they were threatened to not speak on this topic by their bosses. If George W Bush had had such questions surrounding his eligibility, they would have been investigated before his first election. Barack Obama’s citizenship issues were never even vetted.
Why don’t you speak on this topic? It would be more interesting to debate a “non birther” on why he believes evidence points to a normal American birth and normal citizenship of Barack Obama. There is nothing interesting about you ripping Butter by basically mocking the whole idea of corruption or conspiracy.
I made no personal attacks. My comments were directed at her arguments (which I think are Bond-novel-esque in their nonsense) and her refusal to defend her own position. (This, after calling me 'chicken' back in September - which was a personal attack).
. . .but rather have taken on the watchfulness of engaged citizens as a second job.
There's nothing wrong per se with watchfulness. It's when the watcher simply cannot seem ever to view any event outside the prism of the conspiratorial glasses that I take issue.
Perhaps it is the snarkiness of your tone that sets off the "troll tingle" that we feel when you respond.
Perhaps, but I find it's a 'no win' thing no matter how I play it. If I act like I give such arguments any credibility, I get accused of being insincere. So I call 'em as I see 'em -- hogwash. If that gets interpreted as haughty, so be it. To paraphrase Hook, "Let the mortals envy me."
As Hook himself would say, "The pulling spawn, how I despise them."
You get points for being able to quote Hook. :)
Safe journey on your self-imposed exile.
Thank you. The journey back will occur from time to time.
I am concerned. I'm concerned that what appears by all accounts to be just an unfortunate accident resulting in the death of a dedicated public servant is being immediately used as fodder for peoples' conspiracy mills.
Nice sparing with you. Have a Merry Christmas! Glad to see that you will journey back occasionally because as Hook himself said, “What would the world be like without Captain Hook?”
(Chicken was a little harsh. I mean, really, poultry?)
Nice sparing with you. Have a Merry Christmas! Glad to see that you will journey back occasionally because as Hook himself said, “What would the world be like without Captain Hook?”
(Chicken was a little harsh. I mean, really, poultry?)
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